topic Re: Internal hotlinks super slow update in 21 in Project data & BIM

Internal hotlinks super slow update in 21

Mats_Knutsson — Wed, 17 Oct 2018 06:34:37 GMT

Hi,

We migrated a project from 19 to 21. The project has multiple internal holinks in three layer.
Updating hotlinks was ok time wise in 19 but is dead slow in 21. Any ideas why or something that more people have experienced?

Best regards,
Mats

Re: Internal hotlinks super slow update in 21

Barry Kelly — Wed, 17 Oct 2018 07:12:50 GMT

Yes we noticed this when we made the change from 18 to 20.
One or two hotlinks are fine.
But when there are multiple hotlinks it slows quite dramatically.

I have reported this as a bug but have not heard anything back other than to use the fastest machine you can and ....

HQ have added the issue as a request #241178.

My support person tested it in 21 - this was back in February, but I haven't followed up for any further results yet.
I have been waiting until I set up 22 which I am in the process of doing now and I am yet to test this out in 22.

Maybe someone in GS (I hope you are listening ) could say if there is any resolution to this bug?

Barry.

Re: Internal hotlinks super slow update in 21

Mats_Knutsson — Wed, 17 Oct 2018 07:36:19 GMT

We have fast hardware...it's definitley something wrong. We can't continue this way and will probably need to split the file into multiple. I'll bump to GS.

Re: Internal hotlinks super slow update in 21

Daniel Kovacs — Thu, 25 Oct 2018 10:45:16 GMT

Barry wrote:
...
I have reported this as a bug but have not heard anything back other than to use the fastest machine you can and ....
HQ have added the issue as a request #241178.
...
Maybe someone in GS (I hope you are listening ) could say if there is any resolution to this bug?

Hello Barry,

I took a look at the error you mentioned. The error report specifically says that from AC19 to AC20 (or above) dragging a copy of a hotlink module is the process that got slower. According to the current state of this error, it looks like there is indeed a bit of a slow-down there, but that's because the code that was processing the copying of a hotlink module was faulty in AC19 (sometimes missing elements and such), so it was fixed for AC20.

So now it works properly, but a bit slower. We are still working on enhancing speed of hotlinks overall, but I think this specific problem can't be "fixed" (since it is already a fix).

Mats_Knutsson wrote:
We migrated a project from 19 to 21. The project has multiple internal holinks in three layer.
Updating hotlinks was ok time wise in 19 but is dead slow in 21. Any ideas why or something that more people have experienced?

Mats_Knutsson,

I am not sure of the exact situation and speed differences, but it sounds like something definitely worth investigating!

If you contacted your local support about the issue, then it is in the best hands. If you couldn't send it there for some reason, then let me know, and I will try to look into it.

Regards,

Re: Internal hotlinks super slow update in 21

Mats_Knutsson — Thu, 25 Oct 2018 14:52:41 GMT

dkovacs wrote:

Barry wrote:
...
I have reported this as a bug but have not heard anything back other than to use the fastest machine you can and ....
HQ have added the issue as a request #241178.
...
Maybe someone in GS (I hope you are listening ) could say if there is any resolution to this bug?
Hello Barry,

I took a look at the error you mentioned. The error report specifically says that from AC19 to AC20 (or above) dragging a copy of a hotlink module is the process that got slower. According to the current state of this error, it looks like there is indeed a bit of a slow-down there, but that's because the code that was processing the copying of a hotlink module was faulty in AC19 (sometimes missing elements and such), so it was fixed for AC20.

So now it works properly, but a bit slower. We are still working on enhancing speed of hotlinks overall, but I think this specific problem can't be "fixed" (since it is already a fix).

Mats_Knutsson wrote:
We migrated a project from 19 to 21. The project has multiple internal holinks in three layer.
Updating hotlinks was ok time wise in 19 but is dead slow in 21. Any ideas why or something that more people have experienced?
Mats_Knutsson,

I am not sure of the exact situation and speed differences, but it sounds like something definitely worth investigating!

If you contacted your local support about the issue, then it is in the best hands. If you couldn't send it there for some reason, then let me know, and I will try to look into it.

Regards,

Speed from 15 sec to 45 minutes... have no time to prepare stuff for support now but will do so asap.

Re: Internal hotlinks super slow update in 21

Barry Kelly — Fri, 02 Nov 2018 07:45:09 GMT

I have just been testing this a little more now I am setting up our version 22 template.

As a test I took a typical file, copied it and renamed it 8 times, so I have the original and 8 duplicate files.
I then opened the original file in version 18 and hotlinked in each of the duplicate files once, so I have 8 hotlink files in the original.
I saved this file and then opened in it version 20 and version 22.

I dragged a copy of the 8 hotlinks and timed how long it took to complete.

In version 18 it is consistently around 12 seconds.
In version 20 it is consistently around 16 seconds.
In version 22 the fastest I can get is 50 seconds but it can be anything up to 3 minutes 17 seconds.
I have tried 8 times now - 4 times around 1 minute and 4 times at 3 minutes or more.

Even just copying 1 hotlink file takes 10-12 seconds in 22 but only 3 seconds in 18 & 20.

So it is definitely much much slower in 22.
Even deleting the copied hotlinks is slower.

I will try to test on another machine over the weekend.

Barry.

Re: Internal hotlinks super slow update in 21

Daniel Kovacs — Tue, 06 Nov 2018 07:57:06 GMT

Hi Barry,

If those numbers are correct, then that definitely seems suspicious at the least. I still couldn't reproduce it myself though, so could you send me this set of files you are testing with, so that I can try it here?

Thanks,

Re: Internal hotlinks super slow update in 21

Barry Kelly — Tue, 06 Nov 2018 08:49:01 GMT

dkovacs wrote:
Hi Barry,

If those numbers are correct, then that definitely seems suspicious at the least. I still couldn't reproduce it myself though, so could you send me this set of files you are testing with, so that I can try it here?

Thanks,

I would have to save those as PLA files as they use our custom library.

However I have just done a test using the default Graphisoft template and library to eliminate any problems with our template and library.
In version 18, I modelled 4 walls, 3 windows, 2 doors and a roof - very simple.

I then selected and saved the selection as a MOD file.
I place the mode and copied it so I had 32 instances of that module.

I then selected those 32 modules and dragged a copy.
In version 18 it takes less that 2 seconds.

I opened the same file in 22 and even allowed it to migrate the library.
To drag a copy of the same 32 modules it takes just over 25 seconds.
I repeated this several times - all the same.

I will send you a link to these files.

Thanks.

Barry.

Re: Internal hotlinks super slow update in 21

Barry Kelly — Wed, 07 Nov 2018 08:28:15 GMT

Interestingly I just tried the same simple file in my last experiment except i didn't migrate the library.
All 32 hotlinks copied in 5 seconds.

So I opened the file again and migrated the library.
Back to 25 seconds.

I opened the file again and migrated the library just to be sure and it was 25 seconds again.

Barry.

Re: Internal hotlinks super slow update in 21

Barry Kelly — Wed, 07 Nov 2018 08:53:11 GMT

I just tried on my laptop with the same file.
Version 22 - build 4005.

No library migration is 5 seconds still but migrating library now blows out to 45 seconds.
I checked a few times with the same results.

I deleted the 22 and migration libraries so there was no library loaded at all and it was about 4 seconds.
So there is something in the library that is slowing it down even though I only used 1 door and one window object in the hotlink.

Barry.

Re: Internal hotlinks super slow update in 21

Mats_Knutsson — Wed, 07 Nov 2018 19:08:50 GMT

Barry wrote:
I just tried on my laptop with the same file.
Version 22 - build 4005.

No library migration is 5 seconds still but migrating library now blows out to 45 seconds.
I checked a few times with the same results.

I deleted the 22 and migration libraries so there was no library loaded at all and it was about 4 seconds.
So there is something in the library that is slowing it down even though I only used 1 door and one window object in the hotlink.

Barry.

Sherlock Kelly

Re: Internal hotlinks super slow update in 21

Daniel Kovacs — Fri, 04 Jan 2019 12:34:20 GMT

Hello,

I have done some testing with files that I got from Barry. It turns out the problem with our testing was that we only migrated the libraries in the host file, but we were still loading the same modules (that were created in AC18).

That meant that if we didn't migrate the libraries, everything was simply duplicated, but when the libraries were migrated, then during the duplication process ARCHICAD saw that the parts in the sources were from an earlier version, and it had to migrate the library parts in the new instances as well. I tested with ARCHICAD 18 and ARCHICAD 22, and so in this case the migration in the background had to go through 4 iterations (from 18 to 19 to 20 to 21 to 22).

If you take all the module files and the host file, open them in AC22 and migrate the libraries and save them first, then duplicating them should take roughly the same amount of time as in previous versions. Please see if you experience the same.

Regards,

Re: Internal hotlinks super slow update in 21

Barry Kelly — Wed, 09 Jan 2019 12:40:35 GMT

Thanks Daniel,
I will check it out in a couple of weeks when I am back from holidays.

Barry.

Re: Internal hotlinks super slow update in 21

Anonymous — Wed, 09 Jan 2019 18:15:26 GMT

Hello i am new here and i want to let you know that One or two hotlinks are perfectly fine. but the other links hyperlinks especially shows dramatic issues

Re: Internal hotlinks super slow update in 21

Barry Kelly — Mon, 21 Jan 2019 09:11:20 GMT

Barry wrote:
Thanks Daniel,
I will check it out in a couple of weeks when I am back from holidays.

OK, I am back and I just did a quick couple of tests.

The simple plan that I showed before did benefit from updating the hotlink to the same version (22 with the migrated libraries).
It then copied all the hotlinks in a matter of seconds.

Another test I did with a full plan also benefited from simply saving the hotlinks in the same version (22).
I had 8 plans hotlinked in.
They all use my custom library so there was no need to migrate libraries.
If I leave the hotlink plans as version 18 then the copy and paste of those 8 hotlinks, it takes around 3 minutes.
Saving the hotlinks as version 22 as well (and making sure they are updated in the master plan), it then takes around 30 seconds to copy and paste all 8 hotlinks at the same time.

A marked improvement.

So it seems make sure all the hotlinks are saved in the same version as the master plan, and migrate the libraries in all files if necessary.

Thanks for your help on this on Daniel.

Barry.

Re: Internal hotlinks super slow update in 21

agroni — Mon, 21 Jan 2019 21:13:39 GMT

I might want to jump into this subject, since we are working on a big project with a complex Archicad structure. Our project has 55.000 gross area; therefore it was necessary to divide the project into multiple parts of the building resulting in 4 different teamwork files. There 4 files (certain stories) are hotlinked between each other, since we need the reference of the other storey. There is an additional Teamwork file for the smaller bits such as rooms, geometries, etc. which are hotlinked to these 4 files. In the end there is this master file which has the 4 files placed here, hence producing all the layouts from this master Teamwork file.

We started this project with AC21. Updating Hotlinks took ages, also trying to reserve the settings of the Hotlink-Manager users were getting hypnotized by the blue magical donut (windows loading symbol).
For two weeks, we migrated into AC22. All teamwork files, including their libraries were migrated. We left the migration libraries 21, since there was too much cleaning to be done, in order to exclude the migration libraries 21. Our hopes were on AC22, but those died! No improvement; still slow; frustrating.
We received some tips to remove/replace some objects that are qualified as performance killers, but still not running smooth.

A simple calculation:
One blue magical donut waiting time is 2min x 4 operations/h = 8min/h
Per day we work 8h x 8min = 64min
Our Team has 9 workers in this project x 64min = 576min/day
So our project has loses in total 9,6h per day which makes 13,3% of the users time, WAITING!

I believe that GS should consider this a really HIGH PRIORITY task and launch it in the next update for AC22.

Re: Internal hotlinks super slow update in 21

Noemi Balogh — Mon, 04 Feb 2019 16:11:33 GMT

Hi agroni,

You can try some of these steps to improve your hotlink related performance issues:

1. Turn off Background Processing in the Work Environment (User Preference Schemes > Model Rebuild Options > Background Updating > Disabled)

2. Turn off automatic Hotlink checks for all users (Work Environment > Company Standards Schemes > Data Safety & Integrity > Data Integrity > Automatically Check Status of All Hotlinks in Hotlink Module Manager)

3. Ignore hotlinks' update at Open / Join process (Work Environment > Company Standards Schemes > Data Safety & Integrity > Data Integrity > Hotlink Update > Ignore Hotlinks)

Applying these settings means that no other user than the responsible needs to wait for hotlink updates / reservation of the Hotlink Manager. Also, it is possible to assign one particular user to manage hotlinks, for whom it is not necessary to Send & Release the dialog. (When you've finished with updating hotlinks, click on the triangle next to OK & Release and choose the option OK.)

Kind regards,
Noemi

Re: Internal hotlinks super slow update in 21

agroni — Thu, 14 Feb 2019 05:37:17 GMT

Hi Noemi,

thanks for the tips.
To your Case Nr.1: isn't it contraproductive if I disable this option. Maybe it may help with the hotlinks but then opening sections, elevation and co. will slow down.

As for the hotlink part we have tried this approach. The automatic check for hotlinks is not a big problem because if you don't want to update them, then we just simply click cancel. Setting up just one person to do updates of the hotlinks will create other problems since we have three offices in three different places, and different teams working on different tasks. Therefore updating the hotlinks multiple times per day is neccessary for a high transparency in information flow.

What I meant with the magical blue donut is the actual time that a hotlink needs to get updated. All our hotlink files are located on the BIMcloud (basic), hence has to do with the Server communication. But I am 100% sure that we have a very powerfull server with lots of space in it. That is why I would wish to have more speed in the updating hotlinks, since it is a necessity for daily processes in the office.

Re: Internal hotlinks super slow update in 21

PVBergkrantz — Wed, 03 Jul 2019 07:44:18 GMT

We are experiencing this issue as well. Updating hotlinks in 21 or 22 very very slow compared to earlier versions.

Re: Internal hotlinks super slow update in 21

yy — Wed, 20 Oct 2021 12:50:36 GMT

Hi, experiencing similar issues still with Archicad 25. Is there any opinions of speed from old users ? Is it still bad on Archicad 25 or better from the previous versions ?

Thank you.