topic Re: Quick command to remove duplicate library parts in Libraries & objects

Quick command to remove duplicate library parts

Anonymous — Mon, 13 Aug 2007 22:34:29 GMT

I guess this would just be too easy but I am among the many who just don't get why I keep needing to deal with the library manager.

I guess I worked on an older project created in 9 on 10 today and then later opened a different project that was fine when I closed it last and it showed up with the dreaded dots where all the symbols are. I can't ever figure out what is missing from the file by way of the library manager since all the libraries I would ever need are already listed as installed on the file so I just drag over the exact same libraries that are already there and of course I always end up with several thousand duplicate parts. The symbols are back but now the file is dragged down by the several 1000 duplicates when opening up.

I have done a quick search here and it seems that there is a way to remove the parts but it all seems a bit complicated and time consuming. Is it too much to hope for that there is a "remove duplicate library parts now" command?

blip! gone. The file is as it was when last worked on and closed.

Why is it so ridiculously easy to add duplicate libraries/parts and so mysterious on how to remove them?

update...and so now all my files have "missing libraries" and when I drag over the folders the "helpful" (make that maddening) manager indicate are missing the only result is that they all end up with 1000's of duplicate parts/names.

How and why can a file that was set up and only worked on by this machine by this version of ArchiCAD end up with missing library parts when opened up again. I sure as heck didn't remove them. The frustration of this system is mind-boggling. Why the manager is never satisfied and always is waiting to screw up my file is like an having to hold on to an electric fence that scrambles your brain. The documentation available is unfortunately not very helpful either.

Just my rant.

Hard to not want to stick with other CAD programs

Thanks though

Tad

AC10
Mac OS9

Re: Quick command to remove duplicate library parts

Karl Ottenstein — Tue, 14 Aug 2007 03:23:57 GMT

Sorry, Tad - but this is a basic training (day 2) issue. Nobody who sees errors in Lib Mgr should even be working on a project until they understand the what/where/why/how of proper lib part management.

Too many people/firms plow ahead with disorganized approaches to library management, and it really is not something that can be swept under the rug. Sure, there are hassles with migrating old projects up through multiple versions at times (but there are subset libraries to help). But, most things are very straightforward.

Does your reseller offer training?

Karl

PS Addressing one issue you raise: the Readme and other documents explain how to migrate old projects. You seem to have missed the part about saving the old project as a PLA in the old version (with the option checked to save only library parts in use) and to open the PLA in the newer version of AC. What you do next depends on whether you just need to view the old project, modify it using the existing parts only, or continue it with the new version and lib parts in the newer lib...

Re: Quick command to remove duplicate library parts

Anonymous — Tue, 14 Aug 2007 17:25:56 GMT

Thanks, (even if somewhat backhanded lol) any info and where to look is helpful.
I have taken just some training but not nearly enough to be sure. The documentation is quite limiting I feel for such a complex program, I want big thick manuals I can read over and over again. and I must admit that I just can't wrap my mind about the darn manager popping up with different parameters and messages about a file that has already been set up-I'll get it eventually.

Unfortunately (or fortunately) we are a busy two person firm-I do all the CAD (very productive in Vectorworks-full CDs and beautifully rendered complex models-I know that ArchiCAD can be an amazing CAD app and just need to spend some more time with the organizational aspects of it. -just hard to find the time to learn when in production mode) and my mind gets twisted and frustrated going back and forth between older files and newer files in various versions of ArchiCAD, AutoCAD and Vectorworks

Back to the tiny manuals and going over as much as I can here-I am sure I will continue to have those AHAH! moments of revelation. Even despite my rants some of you have been very helpful and I thank you.

Cheers,

Tad

Re: Quick command to remove duplicate library parts

Steve Jepson — Wed, 15 Aug 2007 01:22:59 GMT

I don't want to miss my chance to confuse you.

There is another way to manage library parts you might like better.

You don't have to load any libraries at all. You can get them via the Load other Objects...From Dialog Box.

The idea is to create a folder with all of the ArchiCAD library parts in it and choose only the part you want from this folder, rather than always loading everything in the entire library just so you can get to the stuff you need.

There are several advantages to this, and a few drawbacks as well, as I am sure you will read about when the orthodox guru's see this and want to set you straight about it.

Here is how it goes:

Open your ArchiCAD 11 Template.tpl
Don't do anything to it, just save it as a .pla somewhere you can find it.
In the pop-up, be sure to include All Parts of Loaded Libraries.

Next open that .pla you just made.

The Open Archive window will open.

Select Extract Elements to a folder.

It will make a folder with all of the library parts in it.

Now you can just get the part you want via the From Dialog Box.

Now you have a folder with all of the library parts as separate files that you can use your windows explorer to search, sort, sync, ect...and you can use the Thumbnails feature to see each of them in a nice big window.

There is one more thing I would recommend.

When you get you Template configured the way you want it, make an .pla file of it just like above, but this time, save only the parts used in this Master Template. Use this as your default library so you will always load a basic library that has what you need as far as graphic symbols, lines, fills, section markers, and a few things like that which you need for all projects.

Also learn to use Favorites.

I would also agree with you that there should be some quick way to delete duplicate library parts and such, because this does happen to sometimes even when we are using orthodox library procedures.

Re: Quick command to remove duplicate library parts

Andy Thomson — Wed, 15 Aug 2007 03:56:27 GMT

Steve wrote:
I would also agree with you that there should be some quick way to delete duplicate library parts and such

http://www.archicad.ca/?p=63

I don't like LCF's or PLA's for just this reason. Management is much simpler with folders, but one needs to know a little about what one is doing. TidyUp! was modified with 'Colour Labels' for precisely this task - ArchiCad library management. NoClone is a somewhat equivalent app for PC's. Someday when I can manage to compile an OSX AND PC friendly version of my libraries, I will post them. They always load our projects with 0 duplicates, 0 missing parts, but it was a helluva lot of work, and is maintained daily.

Re: Quick command to remove duplicate library parts

__archiben — Wed, 15 Aug 2007 04:05:49 GMT

Steve wrote:
I don't want to miss my chance to confuse you.

i think that's about the only thing you are managing to do with any success lately.

You don't have to load any libraries at all. You can get them via the Load other Objects...From Dialog Box.

... and a few drawbacks as well, ....

like missing low-level functionality? please do share your list of drawbacks with us steve.

Here is how it goes:

Open your ArchiCAD 11 Template.tpl
Don't do anything to it, just save it as a .pla somewhere you can find it.
In the pop-up, be sure to include All Parts of Loaded Libraries.

Next open that .pla you just made.

The Open Archive window will open.

Select Extract Elements to a folder.

It will make a folder with all of the library parts in it.

or just use the 'Extract a Container...' command . . .

~/archiben

Re: Quick command to remove duplicate library parts

Steve Jepson — Wed, 15 Aug 2007 04:32:14 GMT

~/archiben,

You can not explore an .lfc file to see what is in it.

The entire purpose of what I have explained is how to get the Library parts into files where they can viewed and managed with the Windows Explorer.

What is your objection to showing someone how to do this?

andryro has used this same principle to do exactly as I have, create a folder based Library, and for the same reasons.

The current way ArchiCAD is intended to manage Libraries is not great.
It needs some imporvemnets.

If you don't like the idea, don't do it.

Your explanation of creating a .lfc file is absolutly useless for this purpose.

Re: Quick command to remove duplicate library parts

__archiben — Wed, 15 Aug 2007 04:42:11 GMT

Steve wrote:
The entire purpose of what I have explained is how to get the Library parts into files where they can viewed and managed with the Windows Explorer.

so was mine. only much quicker.

What is your objection to showing someone how to do this?

idiots giving bad advice to new users.

Your explanation of creating a .lfc file is useless for this purpose.

my explanation was nothing to do with creating an .lcf file. re-read it and try to understand it this time.

~/archiben

Re: Quick command to remove duplicate library parts

Steve Jepson — Wed, 15 Aug 2007 04:46:24 GMT

The extract a container command generates a .lfc file right?
How is that useful in doing this?

If you can explain it better using ArchiCAD 11 steps that would be great.
Post it.

I am describing a very old process that has been used for many years.

Re: Quick command to remove duplicate library parts

__archiben — Wed, 15 Aug 2007 05:03:22 GMT

Steve wrote:
the extract a container command generates a .lfc file right?
how is that useful?

sweet jesus steve. the 'Extract a Container...' command does what it says on the tin: it EXTRACTS a Library Container File (that's LCF not LFC, IFC or any other FC that you've gotten it confused with) into files and folders.

step 1: choose the 'Extract a Container...' command.
step 2: select the LCF file you wish to extract in the resulting file dialogue.
step 3: choose a location you wish to extract the LCF file to in the next file dialogue.
step 4: click OK

please can you try to engage your brain before you post to the forum again? you get things arse-about-face more often than you make sense.

~/archiben

Re: Quick command to remove duplicate library parts

Steve Jepson — Wed, 15 Aug 2007 06:00:29 GMT

That works great as long as the Library you are wanting to do this with is in .lcf format. It will not work with older Libraries.

Damon is using AC10. Will he need to do it the way I expained it to him to get at his AC9 Libraries or the way you explaind it to him?

As always, there is never only one way to skin a cat.

Re: Quick command to remove duplicate library parts

Karl Ottenstein — Wed, 15 Aug 2007 16:57:58 GMT

Steve wrote:
Damon is using AC10. Will he need to do it the way I expained it to him to get at his AC9 Libraries or the way you explaind it to him?

Nobody should EVER do it the way you explained it Steve! There is no need to open a template, yada, yada as you directed. Sheesh.

For 10 and above, Extract the LCF. For 9 downwards to when things were in folders by default, you'll notice that the library itself is a PLA. Just open it!

As always, there is never only one way to skin a cat.

Yes, but lately, your posts list the most unlikely and confusing methods. As Ben said, please think before posting.

Cheers,
Karl

Re: Quick command to remove duplicate library parts

Steve Jepson — Wed, 15 Aug 2007 17:16:15 GMT

Like the way ~archiben said that you can not extract shadows?

Is that an example of what you mean by posting with out thinking lately?

Perhaps it is you who are not thinking about why I have suggested taking the library parts from a template that has been configured to the way you like it, as apposed to the library parts you will get from the original library.

Hopefully the readers will understand the main point.

The way ArchiCAD comes set up to use the Libraries is not the only way to do it.

Re: Quick command to remove duplicate library parts

James Murray — Wed, 15 Aug 2007 17:23:26 GMT

Pardon me, but the advice to 'not load any libraries' and access every single object via the Load from Dialog Box sounds like a disaster waiting to happen.

Those parts are indeed loaded, and when you move the project anywhere you're going to have the worst Library Manager/Missing Parts experience of your life.

Library management is a pain, but it can't be avoided. You need a robust method you can count on when weird things happen. You have to know it well before you can ignore it.

Re: Quick command to remove duplicate library parts

Steve Jepson — Wed, 15 Aug 2007 17:30:22 GMT

Did you not read that I was recommending a default library?
One created in the folder style better described by andyro?

When you move the project, do it as .pla

Keep in mind that he said he is using version 9 and 10.

He may not have any knowledge of a .lcf file.

Answer his question based on that.

Especially considering that you think I have not explained it properly.

Also, keep in mind that what I have explained to Damon does work, and as I said, he might like to do it that way better.

My guess is that all of you are doing something very much like this because you also know that the way ArhciCAD comes set up to handle libraries is not very good.

Re: Quick command to remove duplicate library parts

Steve Jepson — Wed, 15 Aug 2007 18:12:40 GMT

James wrote:
Pardon me, but the advice to 'not load any libraries' and access every single object via the Load from Dialog Box sounds like a disaster waiting to happen.

Those parts are indeed loaded, and when you move the project anywhere you're going to have the worst Library Manager/Missing Parts experience of your life.

Library management is a pain, but it can't be avoided. You need a robust method you can count on when weird things happen. You have to know it well before you can ignore it.

http://www.archicad.ca/?p=63

This is what I am talking about. A better way to do it.

Re: Quick command to remove duplicate library parts

Rakela Raul — Wed, 15 Aug 2007 18:14:58 GMT

thank god guns are also virtual here

Re: Quick command to remove duplicate library parts

James Murray — Wed, 15 Aug 2007 18:18:11 GMT

Perhaps I misunderstood:

You don't have to load any libraries at all. You can get them via the Load other Objects...From Dialog Box.

I know you have been at it a long time and you have things working. But I think where new users are concerned, it's better to advise more standard methods, especially about fundamentals such as libraries.

I am specifically addressing this piece of advice, which distracted from your discussion of what is a PLA/LCF and why might you want to extract it.

No, I don't extract the AC library for daily use, having decided not to get into the business of maintaining it on top of all my own stuff.

Yes, library management needs to be torn out and done over.

Re: Quick command to remove duplicate library parts

Steve Jepson — Wed, 15 Aug 2007 18:27:03 GMT

As I said from the begining.

The orthodox guru's will be all over this one.

Poor Damon, he may still need someone to answer his question based on the ArchiCAD 9 and 10 he is using.

Re: Quick command to remove duplicate library parts

James Murray — Wed, 15 Aug 2007 18:30:54 GMT

http://www.archicad.ca/?p=63.

That's an excellent post. Duplicates are not an issue when using the AC library non-extracted. (Though @#$% macros certainly are.) Missing parts are not an issue once you've mastered library management. This is the correct answer to the original question, IMHO.