topic Re: Missing Sink Hole In Basin Cabinet in Libraries & objects

Missing Sink Hole In Basin Cabinet

Anonymous — Fri, 04 Mar 2005 02:15:53 GMT

See Screen Shot.

Re: Missing Sink Hole In Basin Cabinet

Karl Ottenstein — Fri, 04 Mar 2005 16:40:11 GMT

Mystery, Jay. I just recreated a Basin Cabinet that looks similar to yours - round sink, single door - and there's a hole there ... looking all the way down to the drain.

Select your object in plan, and do a File | Modules/Xref | Save Selection as Module and attach the MOD to a message here.

Thanks,
Karl

Re: Missing Sink Hole In Basin Cabinet

Anonymous — Fri, 04 Mar 2005 17:42:10 GMT

Here is the Module File.

Re: Missing Sink Hole In Basin Cabinet

Anonymous — Sat, 05 Mar 2005 01:52:31 GMT

Jay,
I downloaded and merged your module.
I placed an instance of what is apparently the same
object right next to yours and mine has a hole that
goes down to the bottom of the sink just like Karl's.
Your object appears to have an extra shelf which
is not cut by the CUTFORM or CUTPOLYA command
(I haven't checked the script yet).
I have changed all of the parameters of my object
to the same settings as your object but my object
still has the correct hole, but if I transfer the settings
from your object to mine using the eye dropper and
syringe tools my object acquires the same extra shelf
and vice versa.
I have never seen this or have any explanation.
Maybe Karl will know. I hope so. What a mystery.
Thank you,
Peter Devlin

Re: Missing Sink Hole In Basin Cabinet

Anonymous — Sun, 06 Mar 2005 04:45:27 GMT

Jay,
After looking into this a little further I think I know what happened.
There is a hidden parameter in the objects parameter list
called "gs_sink_type_m" it's value is set by default to =3.
If it's value is somehow set to =0, the 3D script calls the cabinet macro
with the "sink" parameter set to =0 meaning "no sink",
which causes the cabinet macro to show a cabinet top, otherwise
it omits the top and the Base Cabinet object installs a counter top
with some kind of sink in it. What we are seeing is this top.
The question is how did the hidden parameter "gs_sink_type_m"
get changed from 3 to 0 ?
I cannot in fact know what the hidden parameters of your instance
of the object are because they are hidden and I have no hacking
software to "look inside" the module file. I can only deduce that
the value in question has, in fact, been changed.
My deduction may be wrong.
Could you do the following to confirm the deduction and, if correct,
fix the problem ?
Go to File/GDL Object/Open GDL Object, find the object, and open it
in the library editing environment.
Look in the parameter list, way down at the bottom, and find the parameter
named "gs_sink_type_m". Check it's value. If the value =0 change it to =3.
Save the library part and close.
If I am correct this should fix the problem.
Please let us know what happened.
Thank you,
Peter Devlin

Re: Missing Sink Hole In Basin Cabinet

Anonymous — Sun, 06 Mar 2005 21:44:32 GMT

The Parameter value is 3. See Screen Shoot. I am Hopping not to edit and save out a "special" Cabinet object. This Object comes from the AC9 "Object Library 9.pla".

Re: Missing Sink Hole In Basin Cabinet

Anonymous — Sun, 06 Mar 2005 22:59:55 GMT

Jay,
I'm baffled.
The only way I could get the object to appear the way yours does
without altering the script is to change the value of
"gs_sink_type_m" to =0.
I can see from your screen shot the value indeed =3
You might try just saving the object again.
Sometimes re-saving an object fixes problems.

Thank you,
Peter Devlin

Re: Missing Sink Hole In Basin Cabinet

Anonymous — Mon, 07 Mar 2005 13:32:11 GMT

Peter wrote:
..
You might try just saving the object again.
Sometimes re-saving an object fixes problems.

I would prefer not to have to add a normally standard Object from the Default AC "Object Library.pla" to my Office Library.

I use to alter and save many of the standard AC 6.5 and AC 7.0 objects in my Office Standards Library, but this proved troublesome when updating to new release version. I want to "trim" this down, as far as how many Library objects that I use.

Once moving to AC 8.1 I began using the Default pla for my objects. This made for a truly easily transition from AC 8.1 to AC 9.

I know that we are only talking one object right now so I may just copy the object out of the pla into my office Library Folder that is loaded each time AC is launched. Just not a habit that I want to get into, that is having multiple Librarys loaded that contain in essence the same library part and macros.

Re: Missing Sink Hole In Basin Cabinet

David Maudlin — Mon, 07 Mar 2005 13:41:32 GMT

Jay and Peter:

My 2 cents:
I was able to reproduce the problem by selecting the Cab Base 1D object in the Kitchen Cabinets 9 folder and setting the Sink Style parameter (under Sink and Tap) to "None". I placed this object, selected it, opened the object settings dialog box and navigated to the Bathroom Fixtures 9 folder to transfer the parameters of the Cab Base 1D object to the Basin Cabinet object. This also transferred the hidden parameter that Peter discovered. This can be undone by selecting the problem object, opening the settings dialog box, selecting some other object, and then reselecting the Basin Cabinet object; this has the result of resetting the parameters (including the hidden ones) back to their default values, the parameters will now need to be changed to get the desired appearance. Changing the default parameter values by opening the object will not affect the parameters of an object that is already placed in the project.

It makes sense that all parameters are transferred (even hidden ones), but this object has a bug in that particular parameter since the sink cannot be eliminated as it can be with the Cab Base 1D object.

Interesting problem, in that it shows that hiding a parameter does not eliminate its consequences. I hope this helps.

David

Re: Missing Sink Hole In Basin Cabinet

Anonymous — Mon, 07 Mar 2005 18:58:57 GMT

David,
Incredible.
I did what you suggested with Jay's problem object and it got fixed.
What remains a mystery is how Jay's object got busted in the first place.
Your experiment with Cab Base 1D object is suggestive.
Peter Devlin

Re: Missing Sink Hole In Basin Cabinet

Karl Ottenstein — Mon, 07 Mar 2005 20:10:20 GMT

Glad you guys figured this out (other than why Jay's placed object got broken in the first place)... Very weird.

But, just a note: when you open the object for a placed instance, you do not see the parameters of the placed instance ... you see the default parameters to be used for new instances. So, for Jay to see if his placed cabinet had 0 or 3, he would have had to unhide the parameter, save the modified object, then open the object settings for the cabinet and read off the value there.

Cheers,
Karl

Re: Missing Sink Hole In Basin Cabinet

Anonymous — Mon, 07 Mar 2005 20:43:58 GMT

Karl,
You are right of course.
That's why it was a rather a forlorn hope
that somehow Jay's copy of the lib. part
might have been altered.
I could not un-hide the objects parameters
save and then check the parameter values
in the problem object because I have the
demo version of AC 9.
Peter Devlin

Re: Missing Sink Hole In Basin Cabinet

Karl Ottenstein — Tue, 08 Mar 2005 02:03:02 GMT

Peter wrote:
I could not un-hide the objects parameters
save and then check the parameter values
in the problem object because I have the
demo version of AC 9.
Peter Devlin

I knew you knew 😉 but was posting for the archive. Hope you get your unlocked 9 soon, Peter. 🙂

Karl

Re: Missing Sink Hole In Basin Cabinet

Anonymous — Tue, 08 Mar 2005 02:25:36 GMT

Thanks man, me too.
Peter

Re: Missing Sink Hole In Basin Cabinet

Anonymous — Tue, 08 Mar 2005 16:59:19 GMT

Peter wrote:
..
What remains a mystery is how Jay's object got busted in the first place.
..

This may have occurred, because while creating "Favorite" Cabinets I was capturing the Attributes of an already Favorite Cabinet with my preferred settings using the Alt-click method. Then I would Crl-Alt Click within the cabinet object library to transfer the Settings. ( This practice BTW produces incorrect Heights [height equal to zero] when applying parameters from one door to another door). Then I would save the Current Object or Defaults as a new Favorite.

This may be why "Hidden" parameters were changed...?

Re: Missing Sink Hole In Basin Cabinet

David Maudlin — Tue, 08 Mar 2005 21:52:04 GMT

Jay wrote:
This may have occurred, because while creating "Favorite" Cabinets I was capturing the Attributes of an already Favorite Cabinet with my preferred settings using the Alt-click method. Then I would Crl-Alt Click within the cabinet object library to transfer the Settings.

Jay:

This was the method I used to reproduce your problem. As I said earlier, it is a bug with the way that particular object handles this hidden parameter, since this parameter can be changed using this standard method. Just something to watch out for when doing parameter transfers.

David