topic Re: Very wrong colors in .PDF, .JPG, and .PSD image file typ in Visualization

Very wrong colors in .PDF, .JPG, and .PSD image file types

Anonymous — Thu, 11 May 2023 11:45:17 GMT

Hello,
Ever since OS 10.2 it was possible to "Save as PDF".
I started making .PDFs of the 3D , 2D and S/E windows.
Any fill or pen color in the browns or rust tones
came out bright red in the PDF image.
All .PDFs from any source had all such colors changed to
bright red when viewed on my machine (Mac G4).

I say on my machine because If I make a PDF of
the 3D window and it has brown or rust tones
they will be bright red on my machine but
If I send the PDF to someone else and ask them
to view the PDF on their machine they report that
the colors are correct meaning that they do not
see the bright red I see when viewed on my machine.

Recently, I had the chance to use Photoshop 7
and wanted to try some editing of a photo-rendering
generated in Archicad. I saved the photo-rendering
as a .JPG, and as a .PSD, and opened them in PS 7.
Both showed areas having brown or rust tones
in the photo-rendering as bright orange/red.
I have opened several .JPGs in Photoshop and they
all have this same problem.

If I force PS 7 to open in classic mode and view
the same file the colors are correct.
If I open the files using Photoshop 4 which only
runs in OS 9.2 or in classic mode the colors are correct.
Again if these files are viewed in Photoshop on another
machine the colors are correct.

Curiously, the .JPG or the .PSD when opened in
Preview show the colors correctly but a .PDF made from
the same image opened in Preview shows the bright red.

So it seems that it has something to do with the OS
on my machine but I haven't a clue as to what it could be.

Has anyone run into this problem ?
Does anyone have any ideas about what might be causing this ?
Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Thank you for your attention,
Peter Devlin

Re: Very wrong colors in .PDF, .JPG, and .PSD image file typ

__archiben — Sun, 13 Nov 2005 20:14:16 GMT

Peter wrote:
So it seems that it has something to do with the OS on my machine but I haven't a clue as to what it could be.

probably calibration and colour profiles:

make sure that your monitor has not been calibrated incorrectly:

System Preferences>Displays>Colour...

and then run through the calibration or choose a profile from the list that is relevant for your display.

i won't pretend that i understand it fully, but my idea of the process goes something like this: when an image is generated by a device (whether it be scanner, camera or display capture) a colour profile is attached to that image so that when it is displayed or used in any way by other devices its relative colour is interpreted correctly. if a 'colour space' attached to an image is incorrect, the image's colour may be interpreted vastly differently when translated to the monitor's colour space . . . or something. it's a black art to me.

~/archiben

Re: Very wrong colors in .PDF, .JPG, and .PSD image file typ

Anonymous — Mon, 14 Nov 2005 00:31:46 GMT

Hello Ben,
Thanks for posting back.
I did try a calibration and new profile
as well as trying another preset profile with no success.

You say:
"if a 'colour space' attached to an image is incorrect,
the image's colour may be interpreted vastly differently when translated to the monitor's colour space".

Clearly, the correct information is in the file because other machines
show the image colors correctly and my machine using OS 9.2.2
shows the colors correctly.

It's as if the OS 10 video driver for the machines video card is
somehow busted but I don't know of a way of verifying this.

Thanks,
Peter Devlin

Re: Very wrong colors in .PDF, .JPG, and .PSD image file typ

__archiben — Mon, 14 Nov 2005 05:06:10 GMT

Peter wrote:
I did try a calibration and new profile
as well as trying another preset profile with no success.

...

Clearly, the correct information is in the file because other machines
show the image colors correctly and my machine using OS 9.2.2
shows the colors correctly.

hmm. strange one! if you're correct with the assumption that the error lies with the system, (which logically makes sense), i don't know what else to suggest other than a complete re-install.

sticking with the colour profile idea: you could try 'ColorSync Utility' and use 'profile first aid' to ensure that your monitor profile hasn't been corrupted . . . ?

sorry - out of ideas now . . .

~/archiben

Re: Very wrong colors in .PDF, .JPG, and .PSD image file typ

Anonymous — Mon, 14 Nov 2005 06:06:06 GMT

Hello Ben,
Thank you for posting back (again).
I have been having this problem since OS 10.2 when
save as PDF was possible. I noticed that the driver for
my graphics card was last modified in January 2005
which implies that the installer for the OS 10 upgrades
has replaced the driver several times because I am up
to OS 10.3.9.
One thing occurs to me however.
I have an Hitachi cm715 CRT display that I have had for six or seven years.
I ran into something on the web about making sure one's device drivers
are up to date. So I am going to get in touch with Hitachi and see
if they have a new driver compatible with OS 10.3 and later.
None of the displays used by the people who checked my files were Hitachi
Thank you for your interest and concern,
Peter Devlin
P.S. I did a profile first aid and no hit

Re: Very wrong colors in .PDF, .JPG, and .PSD image file typ

Anonymous — Sat, 19 Nov 2005 00:03:07 GMT

Hi Peter,

I'm afraid that I have no direct answer for your predicament

However, the inner workings of PDFs is one of my pet distractions.... the PDF format has lots of 'tweakable' components, which are best examined and set with a pukka version of Adobe Acrobat. The real shame is that lots of third party PDF creation packages simply ignore these issues, and therefore lose the point of a good PDF - reliable, small file, universal distribution.

Much though I love Macs , Apple's implementation of PDF creation is unfortunately on a par with these cheap third party bolt-ons - you get no control over the critical parts, just a cheap way of making bloated PDF files. I suggest that you look at the full Adobe package if you need reliable PDF's. I have used this (admittedly on a PC and with Microstation & other packages) to achieve:
- Much smaller files (if colour space is not important, eg black and white layouts)
- Interactive files with button navigation etc
- reliable colour settings for 'proofing' work
- effective interaction with "Office" packages to create bookmarked text files

For my money, part of the issue probably lies with Graphisoft's colour engines. Plotmaker in particular gives very unreliable colour interpretation - the office used Photoshop to produce some colour sample images, only to find that inserting the files (TIF, JPG, PDF, whatever...) into Plotmaker changed the colourspace rendition when sending to print.....AAAAHHHHH!!

HTH

Re: Very wrong colors in .PDF, .JPG, and .PSD image file typ

Anonymous — Sat, 19 Nov 2005 01:09:59 GMT

Tim,
Thanks for posting back.
What you say about Apple's implementation of the the Adobe
PDF specification is something that I had sadly suspected.

By full "Adobe package" do you mean "Adobe Acrobat" ?
Acrobat is around $700 is it not ?
Speaking of file size, I tried to "save as PDF"
the 3D window in one project and the PDF was 7.8 MB.

The issue with Photoshop is making me suspect my monitor.
I talked to Hitachi display support and was told that if
I had a color problem it was because Apple had changed
their software and the Hitachi displays don't work with the new software.

I asked Hitachi to be more specific about what the problem
is but so far they have evaded being more specific than saying
that there is a problem and it's Apple's fault.

I am presently investigating some software called
Jaws PDF Creator which is the only PDF maker I have found
that is compatible with OS 10.
Unfortunately, on my machine, it can't make a PDF of the 3D window.
I am working with their tech support people to find out why.

Thanks,
Peter Devlin

Re: Very wrong colors in .PDF, .JPG, and .PSD image file typ

Dwight — Sat, 19 Nov 2005 02:12:04 GMT

If JAWS won't work with the 3D window directly, you can always do a screen grab or Scrapit Pro or Snapz Pro or something and open it or paste it into a Photoshop document...

Re: Very wrong colors in .PDF, .JPG, and .PSD image file typ

Dwight — Sat, 19 Nov 2005 02:18:37 GMT

And how about Adobe PDF online?

First five are free. Small subscription service afterward...

https://createpdf.adobe.com/

Re: Very wrong colors in .PDF, .JPG, and .PSD image file typ

Anonymous — Sat, 19 Nov 2005 02:57:07 GMT

Hello Dwight,
I hoped I would hear from you.

By "screen grab", do you mean what is called
a screen capture or screen shot ?
I have noticed that in OS 10 the screen shot
is a PDF rather than a PICT as before but
it is a raster PDF image not a vector PDF.
Strangely, the color in the screen shot PDF is right
but wrong in "save as PDF " PDF

Does Scrapit Pro or Snapz Pro create a vector type
image or both make a ps , eps, psd, or some
other raster type file ?

The reason I ask is I use PDFs to send working drawings
to engineering consultants and the vector drawings
are easier to read by those consultants.
I also use PDFs to show clients 3D views and would like,
in this context, to have the colors be right.

I haven't tried the Adobe PDF online approach.
I may be forced to.

Thanks,
Peter Devlin

Re: Very wrong colors in .PDF, .JPG, and .PSD image file typ

Dwight — Sat, 19 Nov 2005 03:08:20 GMT

These methods yield bitmaps only.

Ideal for 3D captures to make a slide show later. You can paste directly into Keynote, for instance.

The default Screen grab for a selection is
Command+Control+Shift+4.

Like doing a diminshed fifth chord on the piano. Sort of.

Once the selection is grabbed, paste it into a new Photoshop document - save in any file format at all as long as it is black. (joke).

Re: Very wrong colors in .PDF, .JPG, and .PSD image file typ

Anonymous — Sat, 19 Nov 2005 03:25:05 GMT

Thanks for the tips Dwight.

Now all I have to do is find out how to
get raster images into Photoshop with
the correct colors on my machine.

Peter Devlin