topic Re: Artlantis ..or LW AC 9 in Visualization

Artlantis ..or LW AC 9

Anonymous — Thu, 11 May 2023 11:12:01 GMT

In my opinion Artl. is very good for interior (LW is too dificult to check the light)

For exterior LW with AC is absolutly better than artl.

What is your opinion?
Please help me.
Now I am considering to buy Artl or not...(in Germany bargainsale for 100 € for AC9 buyer)

Re: Artlantis ..or LW AC 9

Steve Jepson — Tue, 12 Apr 2005 14:02:44 GMT

buy it so the upgrade to the next version wont hurt so bad.

Re: Artlantis ..or LW AC 9

Anonymous — Thu, 14 Apr 2005 03:26:23 GMT

learn a good 3d soft... also the new Artlantis 5 has a very strong radiosity engine but not yet available...

I vote for C4d... but Artlantis is ok

Re: Artlantis ..or LW AC 9

Anonymous — Thu, 14 Apr 2005 09:54:27 GMT

C4d....is it easy? Is it expensive?
Artlantis R ...but nobody knows, what Artlantis R can do.

Re: Artlantis ..or LW AC 9

Anonymous — Thu, 14 Apr 2005 11:18:50 GMT

andronikos916 wrote:
learn a good 3d soft... also the new Artlantis 5 has a very strong radiosity engine but not yet available...

I vote for C4d... but Artlantis is ok

Please explain your experiance with rendering software.
I agree, if I use one software, I will use permanantly like ArchiCAD.
To use several sotwares is too much work. As student ok

Re: Artlantis ..or LW AC 9

Anonymous — Thu, 14 Apr 2005 14:55:01 GMT

Managing and fine tuning materials in AC, raspectively LW, is very clumzy and inconvenient. There are many posts and wishes in this forum about this. ArtL manages them with ease like most advanced rendering programs. For me adjusting materials and producing test-renders for these materials takes much much more time than the final rendering.

So, if you want to keep work flowing, stick to ArtL! LW prodices great results but we'll have to wait to v10 (or 11 ???) for an easy way to work with it.

In the meantime give a try to VRAy! It's free

Re: Artlantis ..or LW AC 9

Karl Ottenstein — Thu, 14 Apr 2005 18:18:28 GMT

You cannot beat the simplicity, ease of learning, and interactive nature of Artlantis. As Kliment says, you are able to fine tune materials much more quickly than in AC with immediate feedback and the shadow control is still better than what we have in the AC implementation of LW today.

If you produce any animations, VR panoramas or objects, the interactive nature of setting them up and previewing them in Artlantis 4.5 is far superior to AC also.

Artlantis 5 promises radiosity and preliminary public images suggest that the results could be quite good. None of the beta testers is authorized to discuss this next version any further.

Today's price for Artlantis 4.5 - around $250 in the US at Objectsonline, as I recall, and the 100 euro posted here, make it a bargain, especially since it would qualify you to upgrade to Artlantis 5 when it is released.

C4D and the other 'professional' packages produce stunning images, but only after a much steeper learning curve, more set-up time, and a much higher purchase price. (The power and flexibility of these packages is astounding though.)

IMHO, for most users who want a little more interactivity in the material application/definition and scene set-up process than is provided by AC, Artlantis is the choice for ease of use. Also, moving and adjusting lights in Artlantis is a dynamic thing, seen in the preview window (an approximation anyway). Nothing in AC permits that. In AC (LW), you have to adjust your lights, render to see what is happening, adjust your lights some more, etc.

Karl

Re: Artlantis ..or LW AC 9

Anonymous — Thu, 14 Apr 2005 18:41:23 GMT

Thanks Kliment and karl.

You are right. LW for AC is quite dificult. I will miss window lite and sky lite.
Please see what the people do with lightworks...

http://221.242.58.202/~dispadio/index.html

How about to buy Lightworks rendering programm? (half joke)

Imagine.. every user has Artl.4.5 because of bargain, and updates to Artl.R ....in this case ..what kind of meaning with new rendering function from AC9?

I feel little bit kicked....

Re: Artlantis ..or LW AC 9

Thomas Holm — Thu, 14 Apr 2005 20:49:56 GMT

Guys,

one reason I've ditched Artlantis for LW (for now) is the texture mapping quirks in Artlantis. When i for instance want an identical wooden panel siding, created by using a material with a striped texture map, on all four sides of a house, I can't use one material for this, because it orients itself after the first instance applied. (This is easier to show than to explain with words, but being home at the moment I don't have an example at hand).

This mapping gets it right on the front facade of the house only (if that's where I applied it first). On the back, it's mirrored. On the right and left sides, a one pixel column of the texture map is spread all over.

(I think Dwight has explained this better somewhere).

The only workaround I've found is to create one material (identical, but with unique names, both for the material and the duplicated texture map) for each side orientation, and apply them individually. Too much work, compared to using Lightworks, where materials orient themselves correctly, perpendicular to the surface on which they're applied!

Perhaps someone knows if this is fixed in Artlantis R. If not, I'll probably jump the upgrade, radiosity or not.

Or perhaps someone can tell me what I'm doing wrong?

Re: Artlantis ..or LW AC 9

Karl Ottenstein — Thu, 14 Apr 2005 20:52:08 GMT

Jakop wrote:
Imagine.. every user has Artl.4.5 because of bargain, and updates to Artl.R ....in this case ..what kind of meaning with new rendering function from AC9?

I feel little bit kicked....

I should clarify. I think LW in AC is still a huge value, and personally I rarely use Artlantis because I can get what I need on a day to day basis from LW/AC. The ray tracing, and sun, sky (heaven) and window-light objects can produce quite pleasing illumination.

For most of the images I generate, I can produce them faster in LW/AC than I can export them to Artlantis, open Artlantis, tweek and render. But (!)... if my work required a lot of material/shader changes (perhaps sitting side-by-side with a client or interior designer), or complex lighting (interiors), or lots of VR objects or animations, I would jump to Artlantis because I would both save time and keep things visual.

There is a place for each. LW is a huge value in AC 9.

Karl

Re: Artlantis ..or LW AC 9

Anonymous — Fri, 15 Apr 2005 06:26:42 GMT

I have much time now, because the building contract situation hier is very terrible.

I decided to buy Artlantis because:
The function of prallel objection (for elevation and so on) is very nice.
very easy to control interior lighting (generall light object)
separated work is possible.
materila change with image data (like JPEG) is very good.
100€....I can pay (because I stop smoking,)
LW makes me very angry! (even thogh ..still I love LW...)

But I must drill LW because:
Window light object and rendering color from LW can show nice atmosphere.
I can take tipps from nice guys (like Dwight).

At least but not last:
I wish, Update of LW in direction to easy using.
With sun light and window light and sky light object are very slow with rendering time.

Re: Artlantis ..or LW AC 9

Steve Jepson — Sat, 16 Apr 2005 23:26:13 GMT

Thomas wrote:

The only workaround I've found is to create one material (identical, but with unique names, both for the material and the duplicated texture map) for each side orientation, and apply them individually. Too much work, compared to using Lightworks, where materials orient themselves correctly, perpendicular to the surface on which they're applied!

Perhaps someone knows if this is fixed in Artlantis R. If not, I'll probably jump the upgrade, radiosity or not.

Or perhaps someone can tell me what I'm doing wrong?

You may find it easier to give each surface a different color in ArchiCAD. Roofs for example, give each roof plain in the view a different color) then in Art*lantis you can drag&drop a texture and rotate it as needed. It also helps in getting the shade just right when adjusting the light is not an option.

Re: Artlantis ..or LW AC 9

Thomas Holm — Sun, 17 Apr 2005 20:13:51 GMT

Thanks, Steve, good idea, and problably simpler. Still a workaround, though, I would have to re-apply after every re-omport from Archicad. Nobody knows if this is fixed in R?

Re: Artlantis ..or LW AC 9

Karl Ottenstein — Mon, 18 Apr 2005 01:15:03 GMT

Thomas wrote:
Nobody knows if this is fixed in R?

Those who know cannot speak...

Karl

Re: Artlantis ..or LW AC 9

Dwight — Mon, 18 Apr 2005 02:25:55 GMT

However, here's a cryptic clue that won't violate anyone's NDA, eh?:

"Those who can speak do not know."

Re: Artlantis ..or LW AC 9

Anonymous — Mon, 18 Apr 2005 07:34:21 GMT

Any 3D modelling and rendering software is difficult to learn. Or it may not be so difficult but it definitely will need a very long time to get used to it and to try all the option and tools it provides.

I myself have always wanted to learn Maya and recently I tried it - it is definitely much easier to navigate and more interactive than MAX but I just did not have enough time, so I gave it up.

My advice is to get some 3d software - they all produce good images nowadays. For really smashing presentations you will need some plug-in like VRay or Brazil, etc.

Re: Artlantis ..or LW AC 9

stefan — Mon, 18 Apr 2005 08:16:24 GMT

Thomas wrote:
Guys,

one reason I've ditched Artlantis for LW (for now) is the texture mapping quirks in Artlantis. When i for instance want an identical wooden panel siding, created by using a material with a striped texture map, on all four sides of a house, I can't use one material for this, because it orients itself after the first instance applied. (This is easier to show than to explain with words, but being home at the moment I don't have an example at hand).

This mapping gets it right on the front facade of the house only (if that's where I applied it first). On the back, it's mirrored. On the right and left sides, a one pixel column of the texture map is spread all over.

(I think Dwight has explained this better somewhere).

The only workaround I've found is to create one material (identical, but with unique names, both for the material and the duplicated texture map) for each side orientation, and apply them individually. Too much work, compared to using Lightworks, where materials orient themselves correctly, perpendicular to the surface on which they're applied!

Perhaps someone knows if this is fixed in Artlantis R. If not, I'll probably jump the upgrade, radiosity or not.

Or perhaps someone can tell me what I'm doing wrong?

Is this still a problem in Art*lantis? That was my first and most important gripe with the software and one of the main reasons to never use it! Back in 3.1 or so there allready were mapping problems.

I have Artlantis 4.0 but never use it.

Lightworks is a good engine but the interactivity of Art*lantis can't be beaten in most applications. ArchiCAD just lacks the speedy direct interface (you need to open several dialogs and close them again to simply change one single parameter and render again). So for exploratory rendering and trial runs, this is not working. If you have a basic set of common materials, you don't need to tweak all the time and then the LW combination is very good. I think it really requires some material-library template that makes it usable by any ArchiCAD-user so it can be put to good work without much effort. I think it is possible, but not without major office-preparation.

Re: Artlantis ..or LW AC 9

Anonymous — Tue, 19 Apr 2005 14:42:27 GMT

stefan wrote:
Thomas wrote:
Guys,

I think it really requires some material-library template that makes it usable by any ArchiCAD-user so it can be put to good work without much effort. I think it is possible, but not without major office-preparation.

Yes! That is the point.

Re: Artlantis ..or LW AC 9

Anonymous — Tue, 19 Apr 2005 19:39:34 GMT

Karl wrote:
Thomas wrote:
Nobody knows if this is fixed in R?
Those who know cannot speak...

Karl

Those who know cannot know (*)

1) Export plug to Atl file ... Clearly the situation :
In the past the Artlantis 4.5 export plug was made by Graphisoft when for technical reasons, the texture orientation was difficult to realize (not impossible but difficult)

1 bis) Export plug for Artlantis R
Abvent is re-writing of a new plug for ArchiCAD.
The first version of this plug wil resolve parameters bugs existing in the old one (smoothing parameters is an sample)
and preserve the texture orientation and scaling with uv mapping as we done in the defaiting av-works add-on.
The second version will increase a lot the link but ...those who know cannot speak.. :O) toom any people in this forum

2) Artlantis ..or LW :
It's not the right question. At Abvent, we pay attention to the Architects need and the right tools to achieve it.
Remember that since more than 15 years, we sell ArchiCAD and Artlantis we also sell Artlantis to Vectors works users who have LW since a long time. (be carrefull LW raytrace is not LW radiosity it's very different technology to implment in a software.. .we experiment it last year in Artlatnis, but I cannot speak about that)

As ArchiCAD distributor, we are very happy that the new rendering basic level of ArchiCad is at the same level as competitors.
BTW , this will increase the rendering market around ArchiCAD and the Artlantis R market of course.
There is objectives reason to use internal render and other objective reasons to use an external tool.

Artlantis R is one of the candidate, of course we hope that its new features make it the most popular rendering companion for ArchiCAD, despite the ease of use, the new technology and inovator productivity feature, there is also technical and economical reasons to use external tool, just few arguments
- For large file , manipulation in CAD software become difficult, you get memory limitation etc...
- With external software, you can use a second computer to render and continue to work with your main CAD on the other one.
- Radiosity on one click is really new step in seeting the scene.
(see the attached picture..setting 15 minutes 😉
no way without radiosity

Of course I can continue to explain what are the advantages to use external solution... and Artlantis first , but I will be too long.

(*) not available for our beta tester at this time ...sorry guys
we do our best to deliver it at launching
... ATL file are always compatible ...

have a nice day
Gerard

Re: Artlantis ..or LW AC 9

Anonymous — Thu, 21 Apr 2005 06:34:13 GMT

I am using over 10years or more AC, and AC-user is used to think automatically in 3D, that means, for AC-user image is all.
During working process I check in early stage material image with 3D environment. It influence very much concept.
That means, the concept itself, in one programm to check material (with LW) is nice concept. And final rendering course with Artlantis is the next stage.

Graphisoft must consider to categorise or standardise the lighting or material shader options with LW, so that the user can use very easy (first of all in a very short time).

Is ther any information, how much the updat to Artlantis R costs?