topic Re: Log Walls in Revit in Collaboration with other software

Log Walls in Revit

Anonymous — Mon, 09 Oct 2006 18:25:57 GMT

Can I? I've seen some pretty lame 'tutorials' on how to do it, but I'm looking for something more like what ArchiCAD has. Anyone? I would ask at the other forums, but I'm guessing someone here knows the answer.

Re: Log Walls in Revit

Djordje — Mon, 09 Oct 2006 18:33:43 GMT

sirduncan wrote:
Can I? I've seen some pretty lame 'tutorials' on how to do it, but I'm looking for something more like what ArchiCAD has. Anyone? I would ask at the other forums, but I'm guessing someone here knows the answer.

I know at least two people who should know ...

Scott? Wes?

Re: Log Walls in Revit

Laszlo Nagy — Tue, 10 Oct 2006 18:46:36 GMT

This is funny.
Someone is asking for Revit advice on the Archicad Forum.
Maybe it is because people generally get pretty good advices around here.

Re: Log Walls in Revit

Anonymous — Tue, 10 Oct 2006 19:16:39 GMT

laszlonagy wrote:
This is funny.
Someone is asking for Revit advice on the Archicad Forum.

Yes - maybe a little odd, but if Revit can't do log walls in a decent manner, than we won't be switching over from ArchiCAD. So there is no reason to register at the other (revit) forums only for a single question. Even through my searching and reading on those forums, I can't find the answer.

And yes - I usually get good responses to my questions posted here.

Re: Log Walls in Revit

Dwight — Tue, 10 Oct 2006 19:44:12 GMT

On this forum, all REVIT advice should start:

1: First, install Archicad,

then…

Re: Log Walls in Revit

Djordje — Wed, 11 Oct 2006 03:26:55 GMT

sirduncan wrote:
Yes - maybe a little odd, but if Revit can't do log walls in a decent manner, than we won't be switching over from ArchiCAD.

What are the other reasons?

IMHO, not getting an answer - official or not - is a good reason NOT to switch.

Re: Log Walls in Revit

Anonymous — Wed, 11 Oct 2006 10:31:51 GMT

Log walls are a snap in Revit. Go into the wall type you want to make out of logs. Go to the tab edit the structure of the wall and add sweeps and reveals to create the wall of your liking. I just did this for a coffee shop that will have half log siding. All of what you do here will be accurately displayed throughout your model including sections. It took me about 5 minutes to create the wall type I mentioned including a search of AUGI on how to do this.

This might be the link that helped me.
http://forums.augi.com/showthread.php?t=345&page=1&pp=10

Cheers - Chris

Happy BIM modeling regardless of the software you use!

Re: Log Walls in Revit

Anonymous — Wed, 11 Oct 2006 13:58:24 GMT

Djordje wrote:
What are the other reasons?

The company I work for uses ADT with HSB in the production department because it interfaces with their machines in the yard. Despite their best efforts(they say), they can't get ArchiCAD to interface with the machines. So they (the production department) can't switch to ArchiCAD. But ArchiCAD has such a visual appeal, we use it to 'wow' the customer up front - and it does a good job of that.

So - we design it up front in AC - make it pretty - the customer likes it - then production takes over and they have to completely redraw it in ADT/HSB. So - they would like the front end to move to Revit so that we can send them the full 3D model data to save time in their redraw. However - I'm not sure that I can do that either.

First - we decide if it can do Logs - then we decide if I can give ADT the full 3D model so as to skip the redraw process.

cgorgas wrote:
... add sweeps and reveals to create the wall of your liking ...

fyi - Your link didn't work for me.

But what if I decide to make my log wall 14 courses instead of 13 - or 15 1/2? Do I have to 'edit' the wall again? How about switch from an 8" log to a 10"? Completely redo the sweeps? What about doors and windows? If I need to move my door over - do I have to edit the reveals? Do I have to 'hide' a 'regular' wall inside my sweep to put in doors and windows? Somehow - I get the feeling that the 'snap' with log walls that so many revit users talk about is actually well more than a workaround - much worse than the 'workarounds' for which they (revit users in general) constantly condemn ArchiCAD.

Don't get me wrong - if Revit can do what they want (logs and export 3D model to ADT) then I'll be a hero and be forced to switch to Revit - which I'm not too against if it can do what it is touted to be able to do. But I honestly can't see that coming.

Care to prove me wrong? Please do.

Re: Log Walls in Revit

Thomas Holm — Wed, 11 Oct 2006 14:39:18 GMT

I'm not an expert in either. But:
- you have to register for the link to work.
- My sources tell me Revit files are NOT compatible with ADT. You 've got the same conversion issues there as from Archicad. Perhaps someone else can advice you on how to smooth the process.

Re: Log Walls in Revit

Anonymous — Wed, 11 Oct 2006 15:23:12 GMT

Thomas wrote:
- My sources tell me Revit files are NOT compatible with ADT.

So I'm finding. Thanks. Anyone know where I can get a difinitive answer on this issue?

Re: Log Walls in Revit

Anonymous — Wed, 11 Oct 2006 17:31:12 GMT

I would think that the export to ADT would be easier from AC, since both are level based. Since Revit exports the whole model together, I can't see it easily exporting to ADT. But I really haven't tried either. Just a side question, where do you work so that everything hinges on log walls?
j

Re: Log Walls in Revit

Anonymous — Wed, 11 Oct 2006 18:14:54 GMT

joshcookie wrote:
Just a side question, where do you work so that everything hinges on log walls?

Being from Montana and using ADT for CAM, my guess is that they are a log home manufacturer/builder.

Re: Log Walls in Revit

Scott Davis — Wed, 11 Oct 2006 18:43:28 GMT

Djordje wrote:
IMHO, not getting an answer - official or not - is a good reason NOT to switch.

Sorry, no. I wasn't going to answer a Revit question in an ArchiCAD forum. It can be done, as others have now posted.

How is it done in AC?

Re: Log Walls in Revit

Scott Davis — Wed, 11 Oct 2006 18:47:15 GMT

sirduncan wrote:
Thomas wrote:
- My sources tell me Revit files are NOT compatible with ADT.
So I'm finding. Thanks. Anyone know where I can get a difinitive answer on this issue?

I haven't tried this, but I've heard IFC is the way to go. Export an IFC model from Revit, import IFC to ADT.

Otherwise, you can export from Revit to 3D DWG, and open the 3D model in ADT, but there is no "intelligence" in the model. It's simply 3D forms.

Re: Log Walls in Revit

Anonymous — Wed, 11 Oct 2006 18:50:50 GMT

sirduncan wrote:
The company I work for uses ADT with HSB in the production department because it interfaces with their machines in the yard. Despite their best efforts(they say), they can't get ArchiCAD to interface with the machines. So they (the production department) can't switch to ArchiCAD.

I would be curious to know what the production department has tried so far. ArchiCAD is certainly no CAM solution out of the box, but then neither is ADT. It seems that once the geometry is in place it shouldn't be too hard to get out the cut lists and patterns. I guess a lot depends on the details of how LHS works.

I worked on a stick framing add-on back in the early 90's. I had it pretty well sorted out in principle but the sponsor went bust before we got very far with the details of development. I have also used ArchiCAD for direct output for millwork but that was just profiles and take-offs. It occurred to me at the time that it wouldn't be too hard to expand that to making custom trim packages sorted and labeled by room, but we didn't have time to pursue that.

Since I originally come from a cabinet making and construction background I have always been fascinated by the possibility of hooking the building model directly to the means of production. I wish I had an excuse to pop up to Montana to see what you all are doing up there.

Re: Log Walls in Revit

Anonymous — Wed, 11 Oct 2006 19:32:34 GMT

Scott wrote:
How is it done in AC?

AC has a built in Log Feature that is fast and effective for what we are doing. Plus, if you add the Log Home Solution - you can do far more.

Scott wrote:
... but I've heard IFC is the way to go.

This was the initial response from the Revit dealer I spoke with. And this may well work, but the log issue is the other stopper for us for now.

Matthew wrote:
I would be curious to know what the production department has tried so far.

I would be too. I was originally going to do some looking into the conversion myself, but have been a little too busy to work on it.

Matthew wrote:
I wish I had an excuse to pop up to Montana to see what you all are doing up there.

Come on up. (plug - is this allowed? :] ) Rocky Mountain Log Homes in Hamilton Montana. http://www.rmlh.com

Re: Log Walls in Revit

Scott Davis — Wed, 11 Oct 2006 20:54:05 GMT

I'd really rather not answer these here, but hopefully the AC users will be patient, since you do not want to sign up on AUGI....very easily....for free.... 🙂

sirduncan wrote:
But what if I decide to make my log wall 14 courses instead of 13 - or 15 1/2? Do I have to 'edit' the wall again?

No, you base the sweep geometry on the tallest log wall you will build. In the properties of the Wall Style, you add sweeps to 20 feet tall (if this is your tallest wall used as a standard wall type). The actual wall in the project will only show the sweeps to the height of the wall.

sirduncan wrote:
How about switch from an 8" log to a 10"?

Since you are a production home builder, you will spend some time up front creating your Template file, which will include "standard" wall types. Maybe you have predefined a 6", 8", 10" and 12" log walls. To switch sizes, highlight the wall, go to the Type Pull down, and select another size.

sirduncan wrote:
Completely redo the sweeps?

Not necessary as they are part of the defined "type". you would have to add sweeps if your "typical' wall only went to 20 feet, and for some special reason you had a 30 foot tall wall.

sirduncan wrote:
What about doors and windows?

Sweeps are cuttable (or not, you decide) by doors and windows. Move or delete the door, and the log wall "heals".

sirduncan wrote:
If I need to move my door over - do I have to edit the reveals?

No, same as above, walls/sweeps/reveals all will "heal".

sirduncan wrote:
Do I have to 'hide' a 'regular' wall inside my sweep to put in doors and windows?

You have two types of walls available in Revit; System Walls and In place Family Walls. System walls are the "typical" type of wall, with two parallel faces floor to ceiling with a structural core and some assembly of components including sheathing and finishes, but can include sweeps and reveals (which is the basis for all the answers above). In Place wall Families are created by the user with extrusions, sweeps, revolves, blends, or other modeling operations. Therefore, these In Place walls can be any geometry you can think of, but each wall must be modeled. System walls with sweeps will have a "hidden" wall to place doors and windows. In Place Family walls will NOT have a hidden wall, but will still host doors/windows.

Hope that helps!

Re: Log Walls in Revit

Anonymous — Wed, 11 Oct 2006 23:03:29 GMT

Scott wrote:
Hope that helps!

As a matter of fact it helps a whole lot.

Scott wrote:
... you will spend some time up front creating your Template file, which will include "standard" wall types.

Indeed. And that is just fine with me. So if I understand correctly, I setup all of my different log sizes/diameters - up to 20 feet tall each. Then they should work just like a regular wall. if I set the height to some odd number, it would show 12.37 courses - or whatever? That would be great for now.

Furthermore - These walls will work just like any wall when I add a window but then need to move it over 4 1/4" - the 'whole' for this window will move with the window - or change the size of the window.

If these things are true, then I guess I better get Revit installed and try it out. (we only have a 30 day trial so I didn't want to install it until we had some of these answers). Also - I'm not sure on the concern for answering this question on the ArchiCAD board - I'm sure there are others doing the AC vs Revit for log walls and your answers here - or anywhere - will be very helpful for anyone looking into the differences. Beyond that - now probably needing to install Revit - I'll probably be registering over there too.

As for the AC board - thank you for your patience and comments/questions regarding a Revit issue. I hope this thread becomes useful for more than just myself. I believe that the AC vs Revit discussion will go on forever - this is just one small step. :]

Now - about that exporting to ADT thing . . . . . . . . . . :]

Re: Log Walls in Revit

Anonymous — Thu, 12 Oct 2006 01:21:24 GMT

sirduncan wrote:
Now - about that exporting to ADT thing . . . . . . . . . . :]

There's gotta be a way to go straight from BIM to the machines. This seems the better path than figuring out how to translate to a moribund half-BIM product. Whether the modeler is ArchiCAD or Revit this has to be the solution in the long run.

Re: Log Walls in Revit

Dwight — Thu, 12 Oct 2006 01:47:23 GMT

"Moribund."
There's a word you don't hear every day.