topic Re: IFC, Complex Profiles, SEOs and Gridlines in Collaboration with other software

IFC, Complex Profiles, SEOs and Gridlines

Nando Mogollon — Wed, 13 May 2009 07:40:52 GMT

Hi all,

I'm starting the hard self-learning process of interchanging Models trough IFC, and I would like to use your expertise on getting ahead of this problems:

1. I have experienced unexpected results with complex profiles, once we save the IFC we check it with Solibri model viewer, and 80% of the "profiled" elements are showing wrong sizes or even the wrong profile.

2. Some of the SEOs are missed.

3. I have not been able to save the Gridlines

Do you know if ther is a generic problem with IFC? or is it just a handicap from ArchiCAD in translating the SEOs and Profiles? or is it something wrong with the settings we are applying?

I would really appreciate your help.

Nando

Regards

Re: IFC, Complex Profiles, SEOs and Gridlines

Laura Yanoviak — Wed, 13 May 2009 16:03:18 GMT

NandoMogollon wrote:
Do you know if ther is a generic problem with IFC? or is it just a handicap from ArchiCAD in translating the SEOs and Profiles?

I suspect it is a bit of both -- IFC has a way to go, and the way Profiles are handled I would think is an AC issue. We've found that many time the Profiles are displayed in Solibri backwards. We use a lot of Complex Profiles, so this is a real problem. Sorry, haven't found any solution yet.

Re: IFC, Complex Profiles, SEOs and Gridlines

Erika Epstein — Wed, 13 May 2009 17:07:53 GMT

Laura wrote:
I suspect it is a bit of both -- IFC has a way to go, and the way Profiles are handled I would think is an AC issue. We've found that many time the Profiles are displayed in Solibri backwards. We use a lot of Complex Profiles, so this is a real problem. Sorry, haven't found any solution yet.

I've had the same problem with Custom Profiles. Fiddling with wall direction and/or mirroring the Custom Profile usually gets it to where I want it. If they are really bad, I will just leave of the layer before saving if the consultant doesn't need it. Consultants always get a set of pdfs of the architectural and I can point out what was left out of the IFC.

Re: IFC, Complex Profiles, SEOs and Gridlines

Nando Mogollon — Fri, 15 May 2009 10:25:02 GMT

Thanks Erika, thanks Laura,

IFC is a very good tool for interoperability, I just feel that we need a bit more advice about when and how to use it..

Regards

Nando

Re: IFC, Complex Profiles, SEOs and Gridlines

Mats_Knutsson — Wed, 20 May 2009 08:05:21 GMT

Laura wrote:
NandoMogollon wrote:
Do you know if ther is a generic problem with IFC? or is it just a handicap from ArchiCAD in translating the SEOs and Profiles?
I suspect it is a bit of both -- IFC has a way to go, and the way Profiles are handled I would think is an AC issue. We've found that many time the Profiles are displayed in Solibri backwards. We use a lot of Complex Profiles, so this is a real problem. Sorry, haven't found any solution yet.

Dear Laura,
Have you downloaded the latest IFC beta version? I forwarded your post to GS HQ yesterday and this is the reply from GS:

"Please download the latest beta version of IFC add-on on our website.
The new add-on solves the positioning problem of exported custom profiles.
Also Solibri Viewer has updated the handling of profiles.
"

GS is constantly developing the IFC and I feel really happy about that. We will start creating really down to earth IDM's for the communication between the most commonly used softwares in our region. It will take some time for sure but finally it's happening (if the engineers hadn't spent the last decade sleeping in a dark cave we would have come much further...). Luckily BIM is a strategic creature so in the long run it is better to "hurry slowly" (direct translation of a popular swedish saying).

IMO the status with IFC is that it in most cases is GOOD ENOUGH and we can fine tune as we go further and if there are things that can't be done in the current version of a specific software or within IFC, the IDM should take care of that to the greater part.

Best regards,
Mats

Re: IFC, Complex Profiles, SEOs and Gridlines

Anonymous — Mon, 03 Aug 2009 14:43:31 GMT

Came across this thread with keywords "complex profiles IFC" since I wanted to learn more about complex profile walls in IFC format. And it was here in this thread were I learned about downloading the latest betas where they are constantly working on improving complex elements. I downloaded the latest IFC 2x3 Beta for Windows (Build 63132 - Jul 20, 2009) and saved my model as .ifc out of AC12.

I downloaded a free 30-day trial of Revit so I can see the output of my IFC model being opened in Revit. And that is Revit 2010. Before I downloaded the Beta, I was able to see my IFC model and right now (after downloading the Beta) I am getting error messages when opening in Revit.

"Exception thrown in destructor (f:\dd\vctools\vc7libs\ship\atlmfc\src\mfc\winfrm.cpp:142) Encountered an improper argument."

Anyone else having this issue? I'm hoping someone would at least point me in the right direction where I can bring this issue up in a more compatible environment where more users discuss this type of issues.

Thanks!

UPDATE: Just downloaded Solibri Model Viewer and if I can see the same file in there without issues, then my recent issue must lie within Revit not being up to date with the latest IFC Beta release.

Re: IFC, Complex Profiles, SEOs and Gridlines

Anonymous — Mon, 31 Aug 2009 22:42:52 GMT

ArchiCAD 12, IFC beta 63137, and SMC 5.0.0.180 still have a problem maintaining wall joins where two walls were created with a custom profile. The walls display with correct profiles, ifc Windows appear correctly, but the mitered wall ends are missing. SEOs do not appear in the SMC IFC model, between beams and round column in the case where beams pierce a column, or between beams and a slab in the case where beams pierce a slab. I do not know about other pairs.
It seems that build 63137 does fix the problem where IFC windows in a custom profiled wall used to not appear.

Re: IFC, Complex Profiles, SEOs and Gridlines

Anonymous — Mon, 07 Sep 2009 23:12:01 GMT

didrik wrote:
ArchiCAD 12, IFC beta 63137, and SMC 5.0.0.180 still have a problem maintaining wall joins where two walls were created with a custom profile. [...]

Same results with Build 63138.

Re: IFC, Complex Profiles, SEOs and Gridlines

Anonymous — Mon, 19 Oct 2009 14:40:49 GMT

Any luck with AC13 on these issues?

Re: IFC, Complex Profiles, SEOs and Gridlines

Anonymous — Mon, 19 Oct 2009 16:00:04 GMT

didrik wrote:
didrik wrote:
ArchiCAD 12, IFC beta 63137, and SMC 5.0.0.180 still have a problem maintaining wall joins where two walls were created with a custom profile. [...]
Same results with Build 63138.

Will check soon. Meanwhile, at least some SEOs in AC13 appear not to come over to SMC 5.1 via IFC beta 64130.

Re: IFC, Complex Profiles, SEOs and Gridlines

Anonymous — Mon, 19 Oct 2009 17:12:35 GMT

At least one complex profile coming in to SMC from AC13 overruns the mitered corners. See attached file with two images.

Re: IFC, Complex Profiles, SEOs and Gridlines

Erika Epstein — Tue, 20 Oct 2009 00:24:25 GMT

You will have to redo the profiles O.H., or if sometimes they are ok, then a duplicate one, O.H.

Re: IFC, Complex Profiles, SEOs and Gridlines

Anonymous — Tue, 15 Dec 2009 09:26:26 GMT

I tested the Solid Element Operations with the latest IFC2x3 patch (AC130R1_IFC_2x3_64134_WIN.zip). ArchiCAD doesn't put SEOs into IFC yet. With empty openings it is possible to do some kind of SEOs that are exported to IFC.

The corner cutting of complex profile walls and beams are also missing from IFC export. Cutting them using SEOs do not help, because CEOs are not exported. If you can map the beam or wall as object and then in IFC settings select export object as BREP it might work.

I can tell that currently grid lines are not show in Solibri. Maybe in near future, because grids are supported in IFC.

If you want to see ArhiCAD SEOs in Solibri Model Checker, use the ArhiCAD plugin that Solibri provides. Solibri is releasing the plugin for ArchiCAD 13 this week.

- Matti