topic Re: Polyline Accessories in Collaboration with other software

Polyline Accessories

Anonymous — Tue, 29 Dec 2015 16:33:05 GMT

When creating an accessory object I saw that I could select Polyline accessory as a subtype. Does that mean that we can attach those objects to polylines as it is possible with Slabs ? How then ?
Thanks for any help.

Re: Polyline Accessories

Hmooslechner — Sun, 03 Jan 2016 08:38:26 GMT

No - not direct. You have to make all calculations by Yourself including editable hotspots for manipulating the polyline - edge. The accessories just make the simplest calculations like intersectionpoints of distorted edges, can add one polygon to another and such things - and it is way too complex to use this accessory.

Re: Polyline Accessories

Pertti Paasky — Sun, 03 Jan 2016 15:14:41 GMT

Hi, I created an object the subtype of which is Polyline Accessories. It doesn't make anything. It has some parameters that refer to roofs but it doesn´t behave like roof accessories. How to proceed?

Re: Polyline Accessories

Hmooslechner — Sun, 03 Jan 2016 19:41:07 GMT

You know this Site?

gdl.graphisoft.com/gdl-docs/gdl-guide/chapter-12-miscellaneous/polygon-operations-extension/

or this in german with an example:

www.selfgdl.de/addons/polyoperations/

Re: Polyline Accessories

Pertti Paasky — Sun, 03 Jan 2016 20:08:42 GMT

Sure. I have done a lot of work to understand polygon operations extension. It is complex but works reliably. Still I don´t see any relation between polyline accessor and polygon operations... did I miss something?

Re: Polyline Accessories

Hmooslechner — Sun, 03 Jan 2016 20:28:07 GMT

Maybe i missed something? Thanks for leading me in an other direction.

Re: Polyline Accessories

alemanda — Sun, 03 Jan 2016 21:55:04 GMT

Just googling I found that
http://newscentral.exsees.com/item/4b258665fd43561de7dca75940d68079-44466f2fbf4aaca76ad66bc87fd8839f

Re: Polyline Accessories

sinceV6 — Tue, 05 Jan 2016 02:32:43 GMT

Hi.

Olivier wrote:
When creating an accessory object I saw that I could select Polyline accessory as a subtype. Does that mean that we can attach those objects to polylines as it is possible with Slabs ? How then ?
Thanks for any help.

Kind of.

I haven't had the time to dig a lot into this. The easiest way to see it in action is to make sure you have the accessories library loaded, create a polyline (with the polyline tool, not connected/grouped individual lines), select it and apply the polyline accesory object: If I remember correctly, only a footing object is available in the library. Once placed, you can change the polyline nodes and the object will follow accordingly, arcs and all. You can even place it to several selected polylines in one go.

It seems that the subtype will get the polyline node's coordinates, and you can use that to script your object. You could also invoke the accessories command without a selection, and this will allow you to place the object like drawing a polyline, but it'll be static once done.

It could be helpful for some types of objects, specially for FlatLandia (a place where AC likes to hang out), cause I'm guessing that Z elevation would need some more parameters, arrays and scripting to make useful objects.

Best regards.

Re: Polyline Accessories

SenecaDesignLLC — Tue, 05 Jan 2016 16:19:10 GMT

sinceV6 wrote:
Hi.

Olivier wrote:
When creating an accessory object I saw that I could select Polyline accessory as a subtype. Does that mean that we can attach those objects to polylines as it is possible with Slabs ? How then ?
Thanks for any help.
Kind of.

I haven't had the time to dig a lot into this. The easiest way to see it in action is to make sure you have the accessories library loaded, create a polyline (with the polyline tool, not connected/grouped individual lines), select it and apply the polyline accesory object: If I remember correctly, only a footing object is available in the library. Once placed, you can change the polyline nodes and the object will follow accordingly, arcs and all. You can even place it to several selected polylines in one go.

It seems that the subtype will get the polyline node's coordinates, and you can use that to script your object. You could also invoke the accessories command without a selection, and this will allow you to place the object like drawing a polyline, but it'll be static once done.

It could be helpful for some types of objects, specially for FlatLandia (a place where AC likes to hang out), cause I'm guessing that Z elevation would need some more parameters, arrays and scripting to make useful objects.

Best regards.

I have started this, I almost have it working with your original polyline.

Re: Polyline Accessories

Hmooslechner — Tue, 05 Jan 2016 17:14:56 GMT

When trying it with the delivered 2 GDLs for slabs - and then You alter an edge of the slab to be round, the GDL makes a lot of little straigths out of the round edge.

I think that SenecaDesignLLC's polyline can do that better - smile..

Did You find out which number it starts and ends and a Way to turn off some edges?

One of the accessory for slabs is the floor construction object. The problem with this is - You dont need the whole slab - You need rooms! It should read out roomstamps - not slabs for this. And then it should be aware of the Doors too - to let the Floor-construction flow into the Door on the right side of it.

Seneca - Did You find any documentation for GDL about this accessory?

I simply hate this try and error game which graphisoft is playing with us at this things..

Please Graphisoft - let us know the name of the developer of this accessory - to talk directly to him to gratulate him for his invention and to make suggestions for further versions of it and how we would use it.

Re: Polyline Accessories

sinceV6 — Tue, 05 Jan 2016 18:03:00 GMT

Hi.

Yep. Arcs will be segmented. You can script smooth arcs in 2D, but in 3D you know you have to make approximations. Did this for the second version of the polyline script. I updated it about a year ago: simpler script, simpler functions, arcs, better 2D options, better 3D options, etc. I even made a multi-polyline object: as many polylines as you need in a single object, so some could be profiles, some could be paths. It is doable.

The overall problem, unfortunately, is GDL itself. It's an old technology and since it's part of the core, GS seems to be stuck, for the time being, with it. IMHO they should have moved to NURBS about ten years ago. A lot of geometry headaches could be avoided by using newer technologies.

Best regards.

Re: Polyline Accessories

Hmooslechner — Wed, 06 Jan 2016 07:40:49 GMT

The segmentation is not necessary in the addon - i think. Ok - all round objects in AC are segmentet, but its no need for these mass of Hotspots on the arc-edges. In most cases there are just flags to set in the 3d-Commands to simulate round objects - still segmented, but looking very clean with just 2 Hotspots at the end. SenecaDesignLLC did some amazing things with that options.

I just playd with the tube-command in the floor-construction-GDL and i think it should be possible to adapt our own previous gdls with the polygone-functionality. We just have to add some switches to turn on and off not needed segments of the whole polygone.

The real problem still will be that it is just an addon and not implemented direct in Archcad. So that normal Users has to install the addon first to get our GDLs for it to work. Many Users aren't able or willing to install simple addons and so our GDLs will not be used very often.. The functionality should be part of Archicad itself. And it should be possible not only for slabs, roofs and walls. It should be possible to be attached to every polygonal object.

Re: Polyline Accessories

Hmooslechner — Thu, 07 Jan 2016 21:59:06 GMT

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pRu6-FcOJ1c

Just messing around with the code and an older GDL ..german but shows what is possible with it..

Re: Polyline Accessories

Pertti Paasky — Fri, 08 Jan 2016 19:26:35 GMT

sinceV6 wrote:
Hi.

Olivier wrote:
The easiest way to see it in action is to make sure you have the accessories library loaded, create a polyline (with the polyline tool, not connected/grouped individual lines), select it and apply the polyline accesory object: If I remember correctly, only a footing object is available in the library. Once placed, you can change the polyline nodes and the object will follow accordingly, arcs and all. You can even place it to several selected polylines in one go.

So I tried in AC19 but didn´t work. The footing object´s subtype is slab accessory, not polyline accessory. The accessories add-on doesn't recognise any polyline subtype; only slab, wall, roof and zone are available.
I made a new object of polyline accessory subtype but no success.

Still missing something?

Re: Polyline Accessories

SenecaDesignLLC — Fri, 08 Jan 2016 22:12:32 GMT

Pertti wrote:
sinceV6 wrote:
Hi.

Olivier wrote:
The easiest way to see it in action is to make sure you have the accessories library loaded, create a polyline (with the polyline tool, not connected/grouped individual lines), select it and apply the polyline accesory object: If I remember correctly, only a footing object is available in the library. Once placed, you can change the polyline nodes and the object will follow accordingly, arcs and all. You can even place it to several selected polylines in one go.

So I tried in AC19 but didn´t work. The footing object´s subtype is slab accessory, not polyline accessory. The accessories add-on doesn't recognise any polyline subtype; only slab, wall, roof and zone are available.
I made a new object of polyline accessory subtype but no success.

Still missing something?

You need to code some hefty gdl to be able to use the polyline or any of the items in that add on. it requires a lot of looping functions to actually do what you want it to do.

Re: Polyline Accessories

Hmooslechner — Sat, 09 Jan 2016 09:30:04 GMT

This addon seems to be in an very early state. Functional - but far away of beeng really useful in this form now.

There is the function for roofs - but just single element-roof. No polyroofs are possible!

The wallfunction works diffrent - and an change in the wall does not change the resulting-GDL.

In the slabfunction - it does change the result after changing the slab.

Obviously there are ideas for polygones and other Elements for this addon - but not yet implemented - because in the delivered GDLs - there are some interesting Elements - but not the function in the addon.

My personal opinion would be to develop this addon and it should become a "static" member of the normal Archicad-functions - out of the box with no need to install it later. Then it should function with all existing Archicad - Elements.

Or this functionality should be implemented part of GDL itself - in a simple way to be reachable for the scripter. Not as it is in the polyline-addon. Its way too complex for the scripter...

Keep it simple - for the user - not for Archicad-Programmers - smile..

In the meantime i play around with the existing solution and think of ways for using it in my GDLS. Now i took the Slab-GDLs and tried to make it as imply as possible to get the corner-points functioning for a simply block-command on each corner - and its not so complex. All other calculations for it have been done bevore like in sinceV6 old Polygone-code or in the one of SenecaDesignLLC. Its just a Question of getting more familiar with this.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=freNChAcSkE&feature=youtu.be

Re: Polyline Accessories

sinceV6 — Mon, 11 Jan 2016 16:01:10 GMT

Pertti wrote:

So I tried in AC19 but didn´t work. The footing object´s subtype is slab accessory, not polyline accessory. The accessories add-on doesn't recognise any polyline subtype; only slab, wall, roof and zone are available.
I made a new object of polyline accessory subtype but no success.

Still missing something?

Hi.
So... when you go to Design->Design extras->Accessories do you see four types? Slab, roof, wall and polyline? Or when you select the object tool and open its settings, go to the Accessories Library folder, you don't see a Polyline Accessories subfolder with a Footing 2 object? If not, then there's something different with your addon installation.

Hmooslechner wrote:
Or this functionality should be implemented part of GDL itself - in a simple way to be reachable for the scripter. Not as it is in the polyline-addon. Its way too complex for the scripter...

Keep it simple - for the user - not for Archicad-Programmers - smile..

In the meantime i play around with the existing solution and think of ways for using it in my GDLS. Now i took the Slab-GDLs and tried to make it as imply as possible to get the corner-points functioning for a simply block-command on each corner - and its not so complex. All other calculations for it have been done bevore like in sinceV6 old Polygone-code or in the one of SenecaDesignLLC. Its just a Question of getting more familiar with this.

It's no that hard. Like I said, it looks like the addon will populate one of the parameters with the current node coordinates of the associated polyline, so the hard part of adding and removing points from the polyline script gets taken care of, and just lets you code around that. Great. The segmentation issue can easily be fixed by analyzing how the coordinates get stored for arched segments and flag those segments in GDL. The lack of documentation is a problem here...

The one thing I've always liked about the accessories addon is that it proves that there can be a link between standard tool objects and GDL objects.

Anyway... I don't think I'll be spending too much time with this. Unless you develop GDL objects for a living or your company needs a specific kind of object for a very repetitive task, the only time worth spending with this is to know what can be done. Other than that, I believe is a waste of time as there are other tools out there that will help you get similar and faster results. There are 2 things that need to happen so that GDL remains current and useful:
1. it needs a longtime overdue creation/interaction overhaul, either in the way the editor works or by creating a node based interaction.
2. GDL needs to be included in the building materials automatic priority intersections. A proof that it can be done is the "special" case of interaction between doors and finish skins in composites.
A long time ago, the flexibility, intelligence and possibilities of GDL were a plus. I now believe it just holds AC back.

Best regards.

Re: Polyline Accessories

Hmooslechner — Wed, 13 Jan 2016 22:05:52 GMT

I tried to find out how this addon works with the polygone-points and i number'd them.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7aCxa8QW9dw&feature=youtu.be

Re: Polyline Accessories

Barry Kelly — Thu, 22 Oct 2020 07:57:46 GMT

sinceV6 wrote:

Pertti wrote:

So I tried in AC19 but didn´t work. The footing object´s subtype is slab accessory, not polyline accessory. The accessories add-on doesn't recognise any polyline subtype; only slab, wall, roof and zone are available.
I made a new object of polyline accessory subtype but no success.

Still missing something?

Hi.
So... when you go to Design->Design extras->Accessories do you see four types? Slab, roof, wall and polyline? Or when you select the object tool and open its settings, go to the Accessories Library folder, you don't see a Polyline Accessories subfolder with a Footing 2 object? If not, then there's something different with your addon installation.

I know this is an old post, but I have just come across this exact situation.
There may be other posts that have solved this already, but I don't need to keep looking.

I have the 'Footing 2' objects which is a polyline subtype.
But I had no way to use it.

Yes you have to add the command for 'Polyline Accessories' to your menu in the Work Environment.
It was not there by default in the standard WE (at least not in the AUS version).

Now I have a footing that can follow a polyline.
Now I can create new objects for cornices, gutter, mouldings, etc., if I want to.

Barry.