topic Re: IFC Exporting similar walls in different ways in Collaboration with other software

IFC Exporting similar walls in different ways

Anonymous — Thu, 28 Nov 2019 11:51:02 GMT

Hello everyone,

I am an engineer collaborating with architects, and we are currently looking into optimizing the translation of ArchiCAD models for Revit using IFC.

I've managed to create a model in ArchiCAD 23, export as IFC, import to revit, and keep working on that model using revit geometry. This is a great workflow that improves the teamwork on both sides.

However, the architect was not able to do so using ArchiCAD 22. I asked him to send his geometry to me wihch I opened with ArchiCAD 23. I found out that, although looking exactly similar, his geometry is being translated differently to IFC. Namely one is a wall, the other one is a building part (see screenshot attached).

I am a complete beginner in ArchiCAD. The question is, is there any hidden parameter that I am missing which explains why, in the same model, similar walls are exported in different ways?

The archicad model is here:
https://mab.to/rJPZNoDfR

Thanks a lot for your help,
Pedro

Re: IFC Exporting similar walls in different ways

Christophe Fortineau — Thu, 28 Nov 2019 13:30:02 GMT

Hello,

"...hidden parameter..."

There is no hidden parameter
I invite you to check your ifc export translator and tell us which you use

Re: IFC Exporting similar walls in different ways

Anonymous — Thu, 28 Nov 2019 15:27:44 GMT

Thanks for reaching out Christophe.

It shouldn't be a IFC exporting problem. As I said, some walls export correctly, others don't. I am using the following parameters: IFC 2x3, and parametric geometry where possible. From the exporting tests I made, these were the most important options to get the geoemtry correctly translated.

Re: IFC Exporting similar walls in different ways

Christophe Fortineau — Thu, 28 Nov 2019 20:39:20 GMT

Hi,

So if you think it's not your translator you must check if all your wall a well classified.
Then if all your classifications are right you will check your translator about geometric conversion.
I have already seen few ifc viewer which does not read a same ifc files by the same way !
Finaly you can try to export your ifc by all the archicad translators to verify all these parameters.

Have a nice day !

Re: IFC Exporting similar walls in different ways

Anonymous — Fri, 29 Nov 2019 08:33:31 GMT

Dear Christophe,

So then I go back to my original question. From what it appears to me, the walls are the same. Why would then some would be exported as one layer, and others as two layered elements? (printscreen below)
Are there any more options that the Selection Definition tool (print screen below)

I've tried all exporting options to no avail.

Re: IFC Exporting similar walls in different ways

Christophe Fortineau — Fri, 29 Nov 2019 14:27:38 GMT

pmcmm wrote:
the walls are the same

I guess but I have to be sure and ask you to verify. We can see a difference so there os a difference ; where ?
You have to verify for example the wall classification and then check the ifc translator about geometric conversion.

Re: IFC Exporting similar walls in different ways

Ghaleb Khadra — Mon, 02 Dec 2019 14:58:27 GMT

pmcmm wrote:
Hello everyone,

I am an engineer collaborating with architects, and we are currently looking into optimizing the translation of ArchiCAD models for Revit using IFC.

I've managed to create a model in ArchiCAD 23, export as IFC, import to revit, and keep working on that model using revit geometry. This is a great workflow that improves the teamwork on both sides.

However, the architect was not able to do so using ArchiCAD 22. I asked him to send his geometry to me wihch I opened with ArchiCAD 23. I found out that, although looking exactly similar, his geometry is being translated differently to IFC. Namely one is a wall, the other one is a building part (see screenshot attached).

archicad ps.png
archicad ps 2.png

I am a complete beginner in ArchiCAD. The question is, is there any hidden parameter that I am missing which explains why, in the same model, similar walls are exported in different ways?

The archicad model is here:
https://mab.to/8qkAOe8kb

Thanks a lot for your help,
Pedro

Hi Pedro,

Thank you for posting this here and making it available to everyone in the future

I would love to help out however, when I tried to access the link you provided, I encountered a message saying the file is no longer available.

May I please ask you to provide the file to me again, via a PM, and we will have a look at it here in GRAPHISOFT and try to figure out what went wrong.

Looking forward to hear back from you.

Kind regards,
Ghaleb

Re: IFC Exporting similar walls in different ways

Anonymous — Tue, 03 Dec 2019 08:20:38 GMT

Dear Ghaleb,

Thanks for the reply.

I still haven't found the solution to it, which is a pretty big problem for our team. The link has been updated in the first message and it is below too.

https://mab.to/rJPZNoDfR

I will be sending it by PM as requested.

Looking forward to hear your insight.
Pedro

Re: IFC Exporting similar walls in different ways

Anonymous — Tue, 03 Dec 2019 13:51:55 GMT

hello again everyone,

The solution has been found by the BIM manager of the project. It turns out that it's quite a simple solution. The elements have two parameters under classification,:
* CLassification ARCHICAD 22
* Classification ARCHICAD v2.0

When opening a file from ARCHICAD22 in 23, the element gets classification 22. When drawing manually in 23, the element gets automatically v2.0 settings. When exporting, the 22 return the error explained in previous posts, whereas the v2.0 exports flawlessly.

I hope this helps someone in the future.

Thanks Christophe and Ghaleb for taking your time!

Pedro

Re: IFC Exporting similar walls in different ways

Ghaleb Khadra — Tue, 03 Dec 2019 14:06:38 GMT

pmcmm wrote:
Dear Ghaleb,

Thanks for the reply.

I still haven't found the solution to it, which is a pretty big problem for our team. The link has been updated in the first message and it is below too.

https://mab.to/rJPZNoDfR

I will be sending it by PM as requested.

Looking forward to hear your insight.
Pedro

Hi Pedro,

Thank you for your reply. Unfortunately I was not able to check the file you provided. This is due to security measures implemented with the file saving/locking mechanism for Trial files.

Nonetheless, I think this is highly related to the Classification system. Those walls which are labeled as Walls have classified correctly in ARCHICAD and those which have not, will not be labeled correctly. Furthermore, since the result you are getting is "Building Element Proxy", I highly suspect that those walls have not been classified at all as that is also the default value for unclassified elements.

1. Please open the file and select one of the walls which is not exported correctly.
2. Open the Wall Settings Dialog (can be done either directly or with the shortcut cmd+T on Mac and ctrl+T on Windows)
3. Scroll down and locate the CLASSIFICATION AND PROPERTIES tab and open it.
4. Make sure that the wall is actually classified as Wall.
If the "ARCHICAD Classification" box is unchecked, please do check it and search and choose Wall classification.
If the classification is set for something other than wall, please change it to Wall manually.

I have attached an image in hopes that it will help guide you a little.
I hope that indeed was the issue and that this solution will prove to be helpful.

I wish you a fantastic day!

Kind regards,
Ghaleb

Re: IFC Exporting similar walls in different ways

Laszlo Nagy — Sat, 07 Dec 2019 22:45:52 GMT

pmcmm wrote:
However, the architect was not able to do so using ArchiCAD 22. I asked him to send his geometry to me wihch I opened with ArchiCAD 23. I found out that, although looking exactly similar, his geometry is being translated differently to IFC. Namely one is a wall, the other one is a building part (see screenshot attached).

I think it would be beneficial for you to watch the playlist about IFC improvements in AC23. This may answer your question of why things are exported differently in AC23:

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLnXY6vLUwlWW3MmRDthnX5yeVJY7NIw6H

Re: IFC Exporting similar walls in different ways

Christophe Fortineau — Sun, 08 Dec 2019 14:19:56 GMT

Hello and thanks LaszloNagy,

IFC 4 seems to be more interessant than 2x3 but is there a free reader which is able to open an IFC 4 today (on macOS) ?

Re: IFC Exporting similar walls in different ways

Anonymous — Mon, 16 Dec 2019 08:56:51 GMT

thank you Ghaleb for your valuable post, it was exactly that the parameter that I was missing. I've seen it there however, as a beginner in ArchiCAD, I didn't realize how important they were. My question has been answered.

@LaszloNagy, thanks for the videos, I will forward them to the architect's team, I'm pretty sure they will find them useful.

Hope that other people will find this thread useful.

Re: IFC Exporting similar walls in different ways

Christophe Fortineau — Mon, 16 Dec 2019 11:21:19 GMT

Christophe wrote:
... a free reader which is able to open an IFC 4 today (on macOS) ?

I found this free software which is able to open an IFC 4 here : https://www.bimcollab.com/en/default

Re: IFC Exporting similar walls in different ways

Aaron Bourgoin — Mon, 23 Dec 2019 23:02:02 GMT

If a composite wall hosts a door or a window, it doesn't appear in Revit as belonging to The Wall System family- a native Revit wall.

If this is a related problem, is there a way for a host wall to behave as other non-hosting walls which do?

Re: IFC Exporting similar walls in different ways

Christophe Fortineau — Tue, 24 Dec 2019 09:06:28 GMT

Hello Aaron,

Do you talk about import an ifc into your BIM software then to modify it like by your original tools ?
If it is your aim, check this link :
https://archicad-talk.graphisoft.com/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=68521&p=304485&hilit=design+transfer#p304485