topic Re: CodeMeter Sticks in Installation & update

CodeMeter Sticks

Steve Jepson — Fri, 02 Oct 2009 23:14:56 GMT

I was just informed by my local distributer that you can not mix code meters with the old dongles. Everyone using the server has to have the same kind of software protection devise.

Upgrades are not being shipped with the new code sticks. The new programs are. They have no code meter sticks to sell us at this time.
Also, I don't think the license borrowing features of ArchiCAD 13 are in the progam yet. We will have to wait for the next hot-fix to get that ?

Can a person order a new ArchiCAD 13 with a dongle instead of a code meter stick so they can log into a dongle server?

Re: CodeMeter Sticks

Karl Ottenstein — Fri, 02 Oct 2009 23:52:05 GMT

Steve wrote:
I was just informed by my local distributer that you can not mix code meters with the old dongles. Everyone using the server has to have the same kind of software protection devise

Checking in from on the road.... have not heard of this before, Steve, and find it highly unlikely. I cannot image why the server would care how a local copy of ArchiCAD is licensed.

The only thing that I know of that the server cares about is that everyone accessing it is on exactly the same build of ArchiCAD. The server and all clients must be on the same build number - initial release build being 3000.

Maybe someone from GS can comment.

Karl

Re: CodeMeter Sticks

Steve Jepson — Sat, 03 Oct 2009 00:11:14 GMT

It sounds unlikely to me too.

I think it is also strange that the license borrowing features are not actually avaialble yet either. We will have to wait for the hot-fix.

Here is what Frank told me.

[Moderator deleted: Frank does not give permission to have his message published.]

What this means is that a person who just bought a new ArchiCAD 13 and got a code meter stick will not be able to collaborate with anyone except other new program users. Upgrade users will not be able to collaborate with new progam users. ????

Something is not right about this.

The reason this is important to me is becaue I would like to buy my own code meter stick. The one they are sending out with the new progams does not have memory. I want a nice chrome one with memory and a case. I want to be able to activate it via the Graphisoft upgrade site.

I want answers about this before I upgrade so I can do it right and also so GS does not take advantage of me. I do not trust them not to try and sell me someting at a high price something I could have gotten on my own with out having to wait.

http://codemeter.com/us/hardware.html

Re: CodeMeter Sticks

Karl Ottenstein — Sat, 03 Oct 2009 00:30:13 GMT

Thanks for letting me know where you heard the information from, Steve. I believe that there was a misunderstanding from the person who passed the information on to your contact. I have a message into GS HQ to clarify. Being the weekend, it may take a couple of days...

One thing is certain - the information that you shared is definitely being passed around North American resellers - so we need to clear it up.

Thanks,
Karl

Re: CodeMeter Sticks

Steve Jepson — Sat, 03 Oct 2009 02:38:29 GMT

So is there any reason I can't upgrade my own code meter stick or does it need to be one from GS only.

When they are avaialble from the distributors I hope we will have the option of choosing the kind we want.

Re: CodeMeter Sticks

Greg Kmethy — Mon, 05 Oct 2009 16:37:17 GMT

Steve wrote:
I was just informed by my local distributer that you can not mix code meters with the old dongles. Everyone using the server has to have the same kind of software protection devise.
(...)
Can a person order a new ArchiCAD 13 with a dongle instead of a code meter stick so they can log into a dongle server?

Steve,

What your distributor probably told you is that it is not supported to have two keys of different kind in the same office. So you should either have the new Codemeter stick, or the old WibuKey, but not both in the same network.

This has nothing to do with the BIM Server. If two offices collaborate using the same BIM Server, it does not matter at all if one has CodeMeter and the other WibuKey.

Re: CodeMeter Sticks

Steve Jepson — Mon, 05 Oct 2009 17:35:20 GMT

gkmethy wrote:
Steve wrote:
I was just informed by my local distributer that you can not mix code meters with the old dongles. Everyone using the server has to have the same kind of software protection devise.
(...)
Can a person order a new ArchiCAD 13 with a dongle instead of a code meter stick so they can log into a dongle server?
Steve,

What your distributor probably told you is that it is not supported to have two keys of different kind in the same office. So you should either have the new Codemeter stick, or the old WibuKey, but not both in the same network.

This has nothing to do with the BIM Server. If two offices collaborate using the same BIM Server, it does not matter at all if one has CodeMeter and the other WibuKey.

With all do respect, there would be no reason for you to presume what my distrubutor has told me if Karl had not censored my post.

I know exactly what my distrubutor told me and I posted it here word for word and with his contact information.

Thank you for confirming that what he said is true.

Graphisoft is not providing current users with CodeMeter keys. Once they determine pricing, you will be able to order them to replace your USB key for a fee (that has yet to be determined). Anyway, if you’re working on any teamwork projects with other persons of firms utilizing USB keys & you switched to the CodeMeter key, you would not be able to collaborate anymore as that mixed key environments are not supported. You all need to be on one type of key or the other to collaborate.

.

Re: CodeMeter Sticks

Steve Jepson — Mon, 05 Oct 2009 17:58:32 GMT

gkmethy wrote:
Steve wrote:
I was just informed by my local distributer that you can not mix code meters with the old dongles. Everyone using the server has to have the same kind of software protection devise.
(...)
Can a person order a new ArchiCAD 13 with a dongle instead of a code meter stick so they can log into a dongle server?
Steve,

What your distributor probably told you is that it is not supported to have two keys of different kind in the same office. So you should either have the new Codemeter stick, or the old WibuKey, but not both in the same network.

This has nothing to do with the BIM Server. If two offices collaborate using the same BIM Server, it does not matter at all if one has CodeMeter and the other WibuKey.

If an office can not collaborate with it's own teammates unless they are all using the same kind of dongle how can it make no difference when they collaborate with another office using the BIM server.

The BIM server is how they are able to collaborate in the office too isn't it?

Also, can you confirm that license borrowing is not actually available in this version of ArchiCAD 13. (See ArchiCADWIKI)

Using the CodeMeter Control Center to transfer a license, can that be to the CodeMeter or Flashdrive of our choice ?
Has any one tried it?

Re: CodeMeter Sticks

Greg Kmethy — Tue, 06 Oct 2009 07:58:29 GMT

Steve wrote:
If an office can not collaborate with it's own teammates unless they are all using the same kind of dongle how can it make no difference when they collaborate with another office using the BIM server.

The BIM server is how they are able to collaborate in the office too isn't it?

Also, can you confirm that license borrowing is not actually available in this version of ArchiCAD 13. (See ArchiCADWIKI)

Using the CodeMeter Control Center to transfer a license, can that be to the CodeMeter or Flashdrive of our choice ?
Has any one tried it?

Steve,

That sentence is certainly misleading. Let me give you a more technical description:

It is not allowed to have both CodeMeter and WibuKey in the same subnetwork. A subnetwork is a network of computers that can directly communicate with each other without going through a router. An office is typically one subnetwork, although you can divide up an office into several subnetworks. Large offices may break up their network into different subnets, to control access of resources. Since ArchiCAD searches the subnetwork for available licenses, it is not recommended to have both types of keys and it will confuse license management.

However, if you collaborate with another office through the internet, the other office is definitely in a different subnetwork. You can't access their protection key, and they can't access yours. Therefore it does not matter if the keys are different. The BIM server itself does not need a Protection key to run. Only the ArchiCAD clients need protection keys.

License Borrowing will be a new product, coming later this year. License borrowing will only be available with CodeMeter sticks. You can not use just any flash drive, nor can you use CodeMeter sticks other than the one you bought from Graphisoft.

Greg

Re: CodeMeter Sticks

Steve Jepson — Tue, 06 Oct 2009 15:51:00 GMT

A GS CodeMeter stick with out any flash memory seems like a very unfortunate choice to me.

I hope it is not too late for GS to reconsider which CodeMeter stick we can have.

A tool like the CodeMeter stick is not just for ArchiCAD. I don't want to buy one that is disabled to work only with my ArchiCAD, and another one that works with everything else. The whole idea of a CodeMeter is defeated if you need a fist full of them.

ArchiCAD is never the only software needed by it's users. It is only one of the many programs we need to have.

I hope GS has considered how the CodeMeter stick relates to all of the other software we use.

Will we be able to use the GS CodeMeter stick as intended for our other programs too, or will it be disabled so it can only be used with ArchiCAD?

Is there any documentation available yet answering these kind of questions about the GS CodeMeter stick or is this the best place to get answers about it ?

Shot at 2009-10-06

.

Re: CodeMeter Sticks

Anonymous — Wed, 07 Oct 2009 00:52:56 GMT

Reading through this and info on GS site, I'm confused!
Let me see if I got at least some of this somewhat right.
A Code meter key's primary function is for offices with keys that are multiple keys?

Hence, if an office person goes off site they take the Codemeter with them that has one of the multiple licenses assigned to it, with a time limit,
and the multiple key in the office now has temporarily one less "key" available to use/assign?

When set Codemeter time is up, the Codemeter "borrowed" license goes back on record as being assigned to main multiple key license for office use or others to reassign back to another Codemeter?
lec

Re: CodeMeter Sticks

Anonymous — Mon, 12 Oct 2009 22:42:37 GMT

Wow, it sounds like there is a lot of confusion about this yet-to-be-released product.
At present we have a net dongle and a couple of standalone keys if a license needs to be taken out of the office.

The principle of being able to use legit licenses when employees need to work remotely sounds fantastic, but I too am a little unclear. I'd appreciate clarification on these items:

In order to share a lisence:
a. A network codemeter key can either distribute a license onto another (solo) codemeter key for taking out of the office. As many (solo) codemeter keys can be 'created' as there are net licenses available on the network codemeter key (also one has to buy all these (solo) codemeter keys!!).
OR
b. The network codemeter key can be accessed over the network and a license delivered electronically (no key hardware required on 'remote client').

Option b sounds the best, in that the transaction is completely electronic. Looking at the forum people seem to be getting their head around sharing TW2 files over the internet.

If I am working remotely, how can I obtain a license from the network codemeter key?
1. Can the electronic 'key' be emailed over the internet
and/or
2. can I take it home on my own electronic media (ipod, mem stick etc)
and/or
3. Is there an interface accessable over the internet to obtain a key? e.g. I'm at home and I'd like to work on a file. It's the weekend and no one is in the office. Can I grab a license remotely?

Finally, the lack backward compatibility is a worry for long time users of ArchiCAD (Codemeter will only support 10-12 AFTER a patch is released). Is it an option to keep a standalone WIBU key dongle in the office for older projects and then have the network codemeter dongle serving out all the other licenses? At lease then old files can be opened in their version if required!

Final aside: I don't know what other software uses codemeter dongles, but given all this confusion frankly I prefer the REVIT/ARTLANTIS model of activation of the internet. It would give GS a much better handle on how licenses are being used and give users a lot less confusion regarding the plethora of complex techniques to share licenses. But then I know they'd be some who might see it as an invasion of privacy...etc.

Re: CodeMeter Sticks

Karl Ottenstein — Mon, 12 Oct 2009 23:34:27 GMT

This topic is unfortunately going to be really confusing for offices that need to run older versions of ArchiCAD.

This Wiki article describes the key situation - WIBU vs Codemeter:
http://www.archicadwiki.com/ProtectionKey

Note that with a WIBU key (blue USB keyplug), you can run versions 6 through 13 (current).

Codemeter keys can currently ONLY run 13. As noted in that Wiki article, patches for 10, 11 and 12 are supposed to be released later this month that will allow them to be run with Codemeter. But, it sounds like there is no intention of supporting any earlier versions which will limit Codemeter users to the read/write capabilities (for older projects) listed here:
http://www.archicadwiki.com/ArchiCAD%20versions

This versioning thing won't matter to most firms. But, for a few, they will have no way of opening really old projects if they switch to codemeter.

I like rwallis' idea of giving firms an old WIBU key so that they can run older versions if necessary. That WIBU could be set to only run AC 9, for example, so that it could not be used as an extra license for current versions, thus being of limited risk/value to Graphisoft.

As far as mixing Codemeter and WIBU keys in the same network, I believe that only matters if you are using the network functionality of these keys - what has until now been called a 'network key', containing multiple licenses. Apparently the key server software cannot cope with having both devices on the same subnet.

What is still not clear to me is if an office has individual keys (single license - not network/multi-license) and they do not install, or otherwise disable the Wkserver functionality, then each key is a standalone, workstation device and I do not see why it should matter if there are both types of keys in the office.

Example case: as a consultant, I go to a firm to provide training and they want me to connect to their network to review one of their projects on the projector. I've got my WIBU key in my laptop (with wkserver disabled) and they have all Codemeter in their network. I don't think there should be a problem, but this isn't crystal clear in anything I've read yet.

Just as you can access a WIBU key over the internet, I believe that there will be a remote access for the Codemeter license. Haven't seen the details though, if so. (If you set up a VPN, you can access the key and all network resources as if you are in the office, so that's another way of getting at things remotely.)

The negatives of the Artlantis (Revit too?) method of internet activation/deactivation of licenses, which permits transferring a license to another computer are several. If you forget to deactivate a license at work before you go home, then you don't have a license. If the license server in France is down, or the internet is down, you cannot activate a license. If someone activates a license at home just before they go on a one month vacation, then you can't get that license back very easily (like a codemeter expiration). Most of these are things you just get used to, though. (Although there is one more: if you are running out the door, it is easy to grab the WIBU without turning your computer on. With Artlantis, you've got to boot up, run Artlantis, deactivate, quit, shut down.)

I'm sure clarity is on the horizon. 😉

Karl

Re: CodeMeter Sticks

Karl Ottenstein — Mon, 12 Oct 2009 23:45:33 GMT

PS. Just reading here:

http://www.archicadwiki.com/CodeMeter

and was surprised to see that while a codemeter key will work with AC 10 through 13 (after the patches for 10 through 12 are released) ... that license borrowing will ONLY work with 13. That seems like a problem for a lot of firms that will be finishing projects in 12 (or 11) while starting them in 13, yet who want the license borrowing feature.

Borrowable licenses are only available for ArchiCAD 13, MEP Modeler for ArchiCAD 13 and EcoDesigner for ArchiCAD 13. You can not run ArchiCAD 12 and earlier with a borrowed license.

I have a headache from reading all of the 'gotchas' on that page...

Karl

Re: CodeMeter Sticks

Anonymous — Tue, 13 Oct 2009 02:20:16 GMT

I agree Karl - way too many gotchas!

From the wiki:
#

CodeMeter "Act" (Soft) License Borrowing: The borrowed license is represented by a license file on your computer - this license file is specific to the computer and can not be transferred to another computer. This license type is recommended for laptop users who wish to travel without a physical hardware protection key.
#

CodeMeter "Key" License Borrowing: The license is borrowed into a physical CodeMeter hardware key. This is recommended for users who wish to take a license away to be used on their home (or any other) computer. The advantage of this compared to having a single-license hardware key is that loosing the key does not mean loosing the license, as borrowed licenses are automatically returned to the server after the expiration date.

I'm hoping there are some more details coming out soon on the "Act" system, seeing as we need to commit to one or other type! As it is computer specific how is it assigned - does the computer have to be in the office to get a key? lots of questions unanswered
As for the "key" option - it remains to see what the price of these new options are, and how much GS will charge for their (GS specific) codemeter dongles....