topic Re: Archicad on Mac Studio? in Installation & update

Archicad on Mac Studio?

genarch — Fri, 01 Apr 2022 21:56:50 GMT

Has anyone run Archicad on a new Mac Studio? If so how was the performance?

Re: Archicad on Mac Studio?

blgp — Sat, 02 Apr 2022 09:58:17 GMT

Yes, two times the following one:

M1 Max mit 10‑Core CPU, 32‑Core GPU und 16‑Core Neural Engine, 64 GB, 1 TB SSD

But we have only started testing and in a week I can say more. Both workstations had an iMac i9 from 2019 with 40 GB RAM, 1 TB SSD before.
We won't do time measurements specifically, but will mainly work on the large, currently very sluggish projects.

Re: Archicad on Mac Studio?

Rick Thompson — Sat, 02 Apr 2022 13:48:03 GMT

This is a response from GS for what it might be worth >>>

As the Mac Studio computer is unproven in the market, and we haven't concluded our testing, it's not prudent to give a green light on recommending it.

That said, if it becomes approved by our testing and is proven in the market, below is the Mac Studio configuration that would likely be recommended for most Archicad users with one or two monitors/displays:

Processor: Apple M1 Max with 10-core CPU, 24-core GPU, 16-core Neural Engine (A higher number of GPU cores would likely be unwarranted for most Archicad users using one or two monitors/displays)
Memory: 32 GB (Mid-range Archicad project size (Apartment and office buildings) and detail) or 64 GB (High-range Archicad project size (High rises, hospitals, campuses) and detail)
Storage: 1 TB or higher (Though a 512 GB machine may suit some users, a storage drive of 1 TB or higher in size will allow for numerous larger applications to be installed; keeping the storage drive from becoming overly full will maintain optimal performance)

Re: Archicad on Mac Studio?

Rick Thompson — Sat, 02 Apr 2022 13:54:51 GMT

That was from March 22

Re: Archicad on Mac Studio?

RWARCHPC — Sat, 02 Apr 2022 16:59:35 GMT

Thanks for posting that. I just ordered one last week, with 32 core GPU and 64G of memory.

Re: Archicad on Mac Studio?

Rick Thompson — Sat, 02 Apr 2022 17:16:32 GMT

Great.. please post your results. I have a 2017 iMac/27" and it seems to have some old system level junk interfering so it's matter of wiping and a clean install.. or move on to a new computer. A new one seems like a much better idea than doing all that work 🙂 The new Studio monitor sounds pretty nice too.

Re: Archicad on Mac Studio?

genarch — Sat, 02 Apr 2022 18:43:31 GMT

No one going with the M1 Ultra, aka The Big Guns? I’ll be transitioning from an iMac Pro.

Re: Archicad on Mac Studio?

genarch — Mon, 04 Apr 2022 21:33:58 GMT

Another poster here posted on another issue but as a side note was complaining a lot about the performance of Archicad on an M1 Max chip: Mac M1 Max and Archicad 25 bug in 3D

Doesn't make me feel good about moving to Apple's chips...

Re: Archicad on Mac Studio?

David Shorter — Tue, 05 Apr 2022 03:53:18 GMT

I find this reply from Graphisoft very strange "As the Mac Studio computer is unproven in the market, and we haven't concluded our testing, it's not prudent to give a green light on recommending it." Apple silicon has been around for nearly 2 years and THAT is the issue. Apple are going over completely to their own chips and that is the question being asked, not which computer but when will Archicad be able to run natively on Apple silicon.

I literally can't run the latest Apple OS so I HAVE to get a new computer.

I wouldn't get a intel Mac mini because the spec is too low

I wouldn't get an intel based Mac Pro because the spec is too high (and its old tech)

All the remaining Mac products use Apple Silicon

So what choice do I have ! Its time to take Apple Silicon seriously

Re: Archicad on Mac Studio?

genarch — Tue, 05 Apr 2022 04:30:23 GMT

I find it strangely upsetting. What I would like to hear is Graphisoft’s timeline for getting Archicad to run natively on Apple silicon.

Re: Archicad on Mac Studio?

Barry Kelly — Tue, 05 Apr 2022 05:20:35 GMT

@genarch wrote:

I find it strangely upsetting. What I would like to hear is Graphisoft’s timeline for getting Archicad to run natively on Apple silicon.

No specific date, but later this year.

https://community.graphisoft.com/t5/Setup-License-articles/ARM-Mac-support/ta-p/304108

Barry.

Re: Archicad on Mac Studio?

blgp — Wed, 06 Apr 2022 18:49:12 GMT

We now have a few days of experience with both Mac Studios (M1 Max with 10-core CPU, 32-core GPU, 64 GB RAM and 1 TB SSD storage).
There is no noticeable performance difference compared to the iMac 24" with M1. The larger projects are exactly as sluggish as on a 2019 iMac i9 (the comparison model in our case).
For example, if a projectile is changed with active transparency pause, you can easily wait 20 seconds or longer (for larger projects)!
Presumably, this was to be feared, since Archicad has not managed to use multiprocessors smartly and thus only the maximum singlespeed is decisive (and this is now unfortunately comparable with the i9 from 2019).
If this is not significantly better in the summer with the native version, Graphisoft probably has no real desire for Apple computers and we will probably have to write off Archicad as a bad investment!
Even a sculpture of Steve Jobs at the headquarters will not help ;-(

So we can only hope that the homework will be done and at least the same speed increases will be realized as VectorWorks has done. Maybe in this case, twice as long to develop also means twice the speed increases?
Fingers crossed 😉

Re: Archicad on Mac Studio?

jtaarud — Sun, 10 Jul 2022 15:19:41 GMT

I have an Ultra 128MB and I have to say it's like butter compared to my 2014 Intel MAC 4GHz.

I've noticed that, for quick and dirty photo renderings, IradLegacy produces very quick renderings with 20 cores. In that setting, the GI phase doesn't take advantage of cores, but Render portion was quite fast. For low-resolution movies, lack of parallelism hurts during the GI phase. Of course, legacyIrradiance suffers from sparkle-noise in movie renderings, but for still-renderings it creates a cleaner look than the more accurate QMC.

The "Standard 20core" Render in AC25 appears to run in 1/3 the time of the "Redshift w/ internal GPU" at equivalent settings.

Re: Archicad on Mac Studio?

David Shorter — Thu, 14 Jul 2022 01:38:43 GMT

I just downloaded (again) GRAPHISOFT_Archicad_Sample_Project-S-Office_v1.0_AC25.pla

I run the following....

Model Name: Mac Studio

Model Identifier: Mac13,1

Chip: Apple M1 Max

Total Number of Cores: 10 (8 performance and 2 efficiency)

Memory: 32 GB

Chipset Model: Apple M1 Max

Type: GPU

Bus: Built-In

Total Number of Cores: 32

Vendor: Apple (0x106b)

Metal Family: Supported, Metal GPUFamily Apple 7

-------------------------

I opened the above file in 26RC1 (rosetta 2 only)

Went to 3D (default 3D view and settings) and generated a 3D PHOTORENDER using Redshift.

It took about 2min 30 used (80% CPU to start then settled at 30%) Used 1% GPU

Using Standard took about a second longer with similar CPU and GPU loads.

Rotating the whole model in 3D used about 85% CPU snd 45% GPU

Using Detailed shading (shadows) changed the CPU to about 95% and the GPU to 65% (shadows still need to regen after move.

Re: Archicad on Mac Studio?

genarch — Thu, 08 Dec 2022 18:30:00 GMT

Now that GS has released a specific software for Apple Silicon, has anyone tried it on their M-chipped machines? Noticeable difference?

Re: Archicad on Mac Studio?

jkershaw — Wed, 14 Dec 2022 15:59:38 GMT

Bumping this. Please post experiences from Archicad running natively on Apple Silicon.

Re: Archicad on Mac Studio?

RWARCHPC — Wed, 14 Dec 2022 17:20:04 GMT

Everything like refresh, panning and orbiting, opening views, etc. seams a bit faster but rendering in Cineware does not show any real improvement. I'd like to know if a future update will fix this.

Re: Archicad on Mac Studio?

mthd — Tue, 20 Dec 2022 05:09:04 GMT

Thank you for testing this product DS, this reply was very helpful to me.

I guess an AC25 redshift render for a low rise residential home would be done in less time ?

I am looking at one for me to use part time. I always used PC’s in the past but I think I had enough problems with those types of machines.

Re: Archicad on Mac Studio?

David Shorter — Tue, 20 Dec 2022 07:28:35 GMT

Before I start please note an error in the times above. The photorender using standard took 1 minute longer at 3min 31 sec NOT 2min 31sec. Sorry about that.

I opened the same file “GRAPHISOFT_Archicad_Sample_Project-S-Office_v1.0_AC25.pla” using the Australian version of Archicad 26 build 4024 on the same computer recently upgraded to MacOS 13.1 (22C65) as follows:-

Default 3D window, default Photorender settings using Redshift 1min 32sec compared to 2min 30sec a saving of approx 1 min.

Default 3D window, default Photorender settings using Standard 2min 17sec compared to 3min 30sec a saving of approx 1 min 13sec

I then fired up the INTEL version of Australian Archicad 26 build 4019 opened the same PLA.

These are the result (running through rosetta2)

Default 3D window, default Photorender settings using Redshift 1min 48sec slightly longer than silicon build (but I assume the INTEL version of Archicad uses a silicon build of redshift?)

Default 3D window, default Photorender settings using Standard 3min 07sec again slightly faster than the previous INTEL build (RC1) running under rosetta2

At some point I will fire up my 2014 MacBook Pro and run the same tests

In essence (and just using this average size project and a very basic test) it can be seen that there is an approximately 30% speed increase. This is significant but actually irrelevant because Apple have now completed their transition to their own Apple silicon chips. No more Macs with INTEL chipsets.

Re: Archicad on Mac Studio?

David Shorter — Thu, 22 Dec 2022 06:24:29 GMT

Bit more info following on from my previous post (‎2022-12-19 11:28 PM)This time using my 2014 MacBook Pro (INTEL)

same file GRAPHISOFT_Archicad_Sample_Project-S-Office_v1.0_AC25.pla” using the Australian version of Archicad 26 build 4019

Default 3D window, default Photorender settings using Standard 4min 46sec (compared to 3min 07sec on Mac Studio MacOS 13.1 above)

Default 3D window, default Photorender settings using Redshift. Redshift not supported by previous OS "Big Sur"

Times to open project 2014 MacBook Pro:- 29 sec to library dialogue 55sec in total

Times to open project Mac Studio Max:- 15 sec to library dialogue 26sec in total

Times to open 3D widow 2014 MacBook Pro:-7.25 secs

Times to open 3D widow Mac Studio Max:-4.07 secs

All times are approximate.