topic Archicad 26 and DPI issue on 4K monitors under Windows 11 in Installation & update

Archicad 26 and DPI issue on 4K monitors under Windows 11

Paul King — Wed, 15 Nov 2023 10:54:58 GMT

Has anyone solved the issue of ArchicCAD 26 displaying with 'fatter' lower resolution linework than earlier versions on same workstation (i.e. same hardware, same Windows version, same graphics driver etc) ?

This is with Archicad 26 version 4019 and using same 'Advanced Redraw Options' settings in Archicad 26 as with Archicad 24.

The consequence is that adjacent linework in detailed areas visually merges together into a blob far sooner than it normally does when zooming out, and small differences in line weight are hard or impossible to distinguish.

Re: Archicad 26 and DPI issue on 4K monitors under Windows 11

Laszlo Nagy — Sun, 27 Nov 2022 15:19:56 GMT

Hi Paul,

Can you attach a few screenshots so it is easier to see the exact problem?

Re: Archicad 26 and DPI issue on 4K monitors under Windows 11

Paul King — Sun, 27 Nov 2022 21:47:54 GMT

A side by side screenshot is attached showing same project open under Archicad 24 vs Archicad 26. You may need a large 4K monitor to really appreciate the difference - which is possibly why the issue was allowed to remain unaddressed for so long since it was first reported in Beta testing (how large are the monitors used by Graphisoft developers?) - but of course those of us working in front of large 4K monitors are forced to 'appreciate' the difference all day long.

Re: Archicad 26 and DPI issue on 4K monitors under Windows 11

Paul King — Mon, 28 Nov 2022 22:05:09 GMT

OK, I have a workaround from Central innovation (my local reseller):

If I'm guessing correctly from your description, then your monitor is set to the recommended display scale too, which differs from 100% (125% presumably). If I'm correct then it is a known issue, you might want to refer to as DEF-11369. Unfortunately, there's no scheduled fix for it yet, but hopefully, it will be handled as soon as possible. The latest feedback from development is that the error seems to be that fills don't take into account the scale factor of the display.

There are two possible workarounds:
- use a 100% scale (it should be fine)
- or revert to the legacy rendering in the Registry Editor

This latter option can be achieved by opening up the Registry Editor app. Then follow this directory path to reach the rendering setting:

HKey_CURRENT_USER\SOFTWARE\Graphisoft\Archicad\Archicad XXX\Graphix\RenderingAPI. ('XXX' refers to the currently used AC version and language.)

Double-click the RenderingAPI registry line and type '-1' as Value data. This should revert back the rendering engine to the previous (25) version. Please be aware that if you change this setting, then you will have to change it back manually to '0' when an update or fix would be implemented regarding this issue.

Re: Archicad 26 and DPI issue on 4K monitors under Windows 11

Erwin Edel — Tue, 29 Nov 2022 08:51:05 GMT

So this is a AC26 issue rather than WIN11, or does this not happen in AC26 with WIN10?

Re: Archicad 26 and DPI issue on 4K monitors under Windows 11

Barry Kelly — Tue, 29 Nov 2022 09:22:23 GMT

I believe it is a general Windows issue.

Windows version (26) now uses a new method of displaying on the screen.

I am not sure it is the same issue affecting the positioning of text but I think it is.

Actually no, now I read the text issue is a separate issue - it has a separate registry fix.

But remember registry fixes only change what you see on your machine - not when the file is opened on another machine.

I have been told by Graphisoft that it is now recommended that 2D antialiasing be turned on in the Work Environment, which makes things look a little nicer.

Here are a few posts that discuss it all (in particular the text issue) further that I could find.

https://community.graphisoft.com/t5/Design-forum/Archicad-26-Update-4004-Preview-Antialising-BUG/m-p/354577/highlight/true#M161341

https://community.graphisoft.com/t5/Document-Visualize-forum/Fonts-displaying-incorrectly-after-moving-up-to-AC26/m-p/353736/highlight/true#M52888

https://community.graphisoft.com/t5/Wishes-forum/Archicad-26-review/m-p/355651/highlight/true#M21095

Barry.

Re: Archicad 26 and DPI issue on 4K monitors under Windows 11

Paul King — Tue, 29 Nov 2022 10:04:03 GMT

One way or another it is an AC26 issue related to a new 2D rendering method that has a new dependency on a windows subsystem

I can confirm that AC25 is fine under both Windows 10 and 11, and that enabling legacy rendering mode under AC26 (per the registry setting above) continues to allow AC26 work fine under Windows 11.

Very likely AC26 would have the same issue under windows 10 as under windows 11, since default scaling on large monitors is not 100% for either OS version (as I understand it)

Re: Archicad 26 and DPI issue on 4K monitors under Windows 11

Erwin Edel — Tue, 29 Nov 2022 10:50:33 GMT

Thanks for your explanation. We've been putting off upgrading to WIN11 and I think we'll still wait a bit, but it is good to know this particular problem is not a WIN11 problem so much as it is a AC26 problem.

Re: Archicad 26 and DPI issue on 4K monitors under Windows 11

Laszlo Nagy — Mon, 20 Feb 2023 21:35:17 GMT

As far as I know, in AC26, graphics on Windows is now using DirectX technology. Prior to that, it was using OpenGL technology.

On Mac, in AC25 and later, graphics is using Metal technology. Prior to that, it was using OpenGL technology as well.

I think the whole thing had to change because Apple discontinued support for OpenGL, so Graphisoft was forced to change the used technology, and now Archicad is using Metal on Mac, DirectX on Windows, both of which are Apple's and Microsoft's own technologies, respectively.

Re: Archicad 26 and DPI issue on 4K monitors under Windows 11

arkitekt — Sun, 19 Feb 2023 07:44:45 GMT

got my hands on ac26 last week (our distributer waited for the "full" apple m1 integration) and now i have troubles in 2d with the display. with the same settings (and the same project) as in ac25 the new release stutters when i pan, text is shown too fat, hatches have inconsistent lineweights - just horrible, cant work this way. the distributer gave me some tipps, but they dont help or make things even worse.

I am really disapointed from gs - half a year after the first relase of 26 no working display driver ... i guess all energy goes into m1 relateted stuff ... wtf. and this is a small residential house - how about a larger projects? has anyone experienced the same? i keep working with ac25 - i probably will miss the hole ac26 - just paying ... WTF!

have an older workstation, but far away from a weak one: i7 6950x, 32 GB, NVIDIA gtx 1070, 2 eizo montiors wqhd/hd > scale 100%!.

i would really expect that gs would test some configurations and give some advice, which cards have restrictions - i dont expect the impossible, but some honesty!

Re: Archicad 26 and DPI issue on 4K monitors under Windows 11

Paul King — Wed, 01 Mar 2023 10:11:47 GMT

Hi, 'I feel your pain' as they say, but if you read the full thread above, there is a solution, and an explanation included (The graphics engine is tuned for small monitor scaling). There is probably no problem with your graphics card or hardware.

For me, after performing the suggested registry tweak, ArchiCAD 26 looks fine again.

The only remaining issue being that the mouse pointer is tiny.

Re: Archicad 26 and DPI issue on 4K monitors under Windows 11

MASz — Sun, 10 Mar 2024 23:32:23 GMT

This is still an issue in Archicad 27.

I lodged in ac27 beta, they didnt fix it and it took a lot of encouragement (to put it mildly) getting them to recognise it as a still existing problem. At this point i still have no idea if they'll actually fix it in 28. Not that that's acceptable anyway, it is a major bug that should be fixed in Archicad 26 and 27.

Here is the claim from Graphisoft:

"The DEF-9464 bug was fixed back in AC 26, and we did not get complaints for a few months.

The scaling should be set to 100% to fix the issue as far as I know. Other workarounds are resetting the Registry Editor (which might be the best) and turning off 2D antialiasing."

The bug is not fixed. They have tried to fix it and have changed the behaviour of it, but it still a bug. It is never acceptable for Graphisoft to suggest that display scaling should be set to 100%. This is unusable in a lot of set ups, for instance laptops with higher resolutions or 4k+ monitors. Display scaling is a totally normal, recommended feature of Windows. Archicad 22 was supposed to solve all this. Workarounds are not solutions either, and even Graphisoft generally advise you not to use RenderingAPI -1. I do not know why it was acceptable to launch in this state, nor why Graphisoft consistently screws up when it comes to display scaling. It suggests they do not do their own testing correctly and have repeatedly failed from a quality control perspective. It also raises questions about Archicad support providing misinformation to customers.

I have suggested that there should be a toggle in work environment for the 2d drawing infrastructure, Given that it is bugged and the registry entry is not obvious. This was ignored.

It goes beyond looking blobby and blurry, linework doesn't even connect properly. You need to get an accurate display of your 2d drawings to be able to work effectively.

If display scaling were to work correctly, then the drawings should look same regardless of what display scaling you have set Windows to. This is the case with the old drawing infrastructure. If you set display scaling to 350% for instance, then that really demonstrates the problems with the scaling. I have attached an example.

And no, it is not valid to say "well 350% is set too high". The point of this exercise is to clearly demonstrate the erroneous scaling behaviour and it should be easily reproducible by anyone using Windows, regardless of display.

Re: Archicad 26 and DPI issue on 4K monitors under Windows 11

henryL — Tue, 12 Nov 2024 17:13:26 GMT

Sad to report that the problem is still present in version 28.

Re: Archicad 26 and DPI issue on 4K monitors under Windows 11

MASz — Sat, 16 Nov 2024 12:22:06 GMT

Yes, still present.

I had tried to lodge it yet again in the beta. It was marked as "Waiting for decision" and then never updated.

I put in a support ticket and the useless response from Graphisoft was as follows:

The original report and bug DEF-9464 were fixed in AC 26 updates and in AC 27. This was about thicker lines in 2D on Windows with 175% scale.
If you are experiencing something still, then it must be a different issue.

What do you see? Do the workarounds mentioned in the older ticket help?

Previous Notes from GS : The scaling should be set to 100% to fix the issue as far as I know. Other workarounds are resetting the Registry Editor (which might be the best) and turning off 2D antialiasing.

I would recommend keeping the graphic driver up dated and maybe trying a reinstall of AC, but it should have been fixed already.

I replied telling them that this is incorrect, the issue has not been fixed as has previously explained on multiple occasions.

Re: Archicad 26 and DPI issue on 4K monitors under Windows 11

Paul King — Sat, 16 Nov 2024 14:59:50 GMT

Although I originally started this thread, and things were certainly never 100% fixed under AC26 & 27 I am glad to say the 4K scaling display issues seem to have finally gone away for me under AC28.

Linework is now all crisp, menu text is correctly scaled, dynamic curser finally correctly scaled - all straight out of the box (no tweaks needed)

Silly suggestion - make sure you have true line weight set to OFF when testing line quality while zooming out

Hairlines should always look fine at any zoom, but fatter/true weight lines are more affected by drawing position of the line vs nearest row of screen pixels in the display, so are less perfectly consistent when zoomed right out, & you can get a bit of fuzziness/loss of detail that way - but no more than has ever been the case.

I am running:

AC28.0.0 v3001 NZE

Windows 11 23H2 Build 22635.4445

Display Scaling 175% (text etc)

Display resolution 3840x2160

Gforce RTX3080

NVIDIA Driver 560.94

Driver Type DCH

Re: Archicad 26 and DPI issue on 4K monitors under Windows 11

MASz — Sat, 16 Nov 2024 21:41:13 GMT

Attached is a screenshot from AC28 at 350%. Turning off view true line weight did not affect appearance much here. It's definitely still bugged, though the performance is inconsistent.

Re: Archicad 26 and DPI issue on 4K monitors under Windows 11

Paul King — Sun, 17 Nov 2024 11:48:33 GMT

OK, I just tested and can verify the issue when display scaling is set to 350%.

I have two 50" 4K monitors side by side, and with one set to scaling 350% and the other set to 175%, dragging the same ArchiCAD window from side to side between them, the issue appears and disappears. Line weight become cruder, and door swings and other curved lines become visibly and crudely segmented (as reflected in the screenshot above). Almost as if the windows display scale factor is being improperly applied by ArchiCAD to the display of drawing geometric content itself rather than just application menu text, icons & cursors etc.

I then tried dragging a PDF of an ArchiCAD drawing backwards and forwards between monitors, but saw no such issue with changes in line thickness or curved lines - so the issue does seem to lie squarely with ArchiCAD.

Re: Archicad 26 and DPI issue on 4K monitors under Windows 11

Laszlo Nagy — Sun, 17 Nov 2024 12:56:14 GMT

Paul,

Could you also attach screenshots about the issue?

Re: Archicad 26 and DPI issue on 4K monitors under Windows 11

Paul King — Sun, 17 Nov 2024 14:59:32 GMT

Hi Laszlo

Side by side screenshots below. True line weight is off. Larger image is 350% display scaling, smaller image is my standard 175% display scaling.

Essentially, the 350% screenshot on the left looks like the line weights are being scaled up as well, not just the application window text & icons. Ditto the polygon resolution of the curves. (may be hard to make out the 'curve' vertexes unless you view image at full size, preferably on a 4K 50" monitor - please ensure your developers all do have monitors like this, otherwise they may not recognize the problem)

While I am personally happy at 175% scaling, the reason people might need 350% is not because they can't see the line work unscaled, but because they can't make out the application window text and dynamic feedback/ cursors etc unscaled. The app window content itself should be left unscaled by default (though a separate display scaling control for content line weights might be useful for really huge monitors where user or their intended audience in a presentation sits very far away from monitor)

This issue will only get worse as people migrate to 8K 70" monitors (remember when we though 14" was extravagant & unnecessary & would never catch on? 🙂 )

Re: Archicad 26 and DPI issue on 4K monitors under Windows 11

MASz — Sun, 17 Nov 2024 20:47:47 GMT

The point is that it is bugged. 2d drawings should appear the same at whatever display scale. The display is still inaccurate at 175%, to the point where I would not recommend anyone to use this drawing infrastructure especially at 4k. It results in all sorts of artifacts, such as lines not being connected:

The takeaway should not be that it's only a problem at 350%. Graphisoft have tried to use that argument on me and it is incorrect. The only reliable option is to use the old drawing infrastructure with anti-aliasing off so you're actually able to read your own drawings. Otherwise you are subjecting yourself to unreasonable risk.

It really blows my mind that something as basic as being able to read your own drawings is not a priority for Graphisoft. I have lodged this is a bug repeatedly since the AC26 beta and they still have not properly acknowledged it or done anything to address it. That's not even getting to the performance problems with this new drawing infrastructure. And yet, this is the default drawing infrastructure.