topic Re: AC27 IntelMacs: 3D view causes the freezing of all views in Installation & update

AC27 IntelMacs: 3D view causes the freezing of all views

Romans — Sun, 08 Oct 2023 20:27:27 GMT

This misbehavior started with the AC27 Technical Preview and is still happening in the now available final release:

Opening the 3D view or selecting something in the 3D view, or changing something in the 3D view almost always leads to the freeze of all open views. Sooner than later. No more interaction within the views is possible.

Saving and also BIMcloud operations (Send and receive, release all, etc.) are still possible.

But only a restart of Archicad resolves that issue.

It is a problem mainly (only?) happening on Intel-based Macs.

And yes, 3D Antialiasing (with Hardware antialiasing mode) and the new Physically based renderer in 3D Window (Work Environment settings) are turned off.

Also, miscellaneous MacOS systems make no difference.

Any news /workarounds about this critical problem?

A 3D application without the option to work in the 3D view is rather weird.

Re: AC27 IntelMacs: 3D view causes the freezing of all views

Rex Maximilian — Mon, 09 Oct 2023 23:54:22 GMT

So glad they took four extra months to release 27 so that all the bugs could be worked out. Sheesh!

Thanks for reporting this! This means I can't use my office computer but will always have to lug my laptop from my home office to my downtown office just to work in 27. I'll of course have to confirm it, but with the other buggy stuff I've seen, I can believe it.

Re: AC27 IntelMacs: 3D view causes the freezing of all views

fabioferrini — Mon, 09 Oct 2023 16:14:42 GMT

Some issues in our office, 3 iMac 27intel based AMD 5k 😞

Re: AC27 IntelMacs: 3D view causes the freezing of all views

Chuso — Mon, 16 Oct 2023 10:27:10 GMT

Hi Romans,

I am having exactly the same problem.

A fresh project started on AC27 with an iMac 27 intel and at some point when opening the 3D window all archicad windows freeze.

I tried installing AC solo, and same problem. Even upgraded to Sonoma despite the known issues, but still happening.

I hope it gets sorted in the next update...

Re: AC27 IntelMacs: 3D view causes the freezing of all views

Romans — Mon, 16 Oct 2023 12:39:50 GMT

I strongly recommend addressing this problem with your local support/distributor to generate the necessary relevance and priority.
As you can see, here in the forum there is no communication from GS about this. Rather disappointing.

Re: AC27 IntelMacs: 3D view causes the freezing of all views

Oleksandra Vakariuk — Tue, 17 Oct 2023 09:45:05 GMT

Hi everyone,

This is a known issue, DEF-14953, Archicad's windows become unresponsive (and might turn red or grey) on some macOS machines. As to our knowledge, those with AMD and a few Intel graphics cards are affected. It has been our top priority ever since we discovered it, and our developers are actively and continuously working on it.
The problem appears to be triggered by 3D Antialiasing. However, disabling it may work only temporarily or not work at all due to another issue where Work Environment enables 3D Antialiasing even though it's disabled in the settings.

We have been in contact with Apple’s developer support regarding these issues, and we have a fix under way. As for now, we've made a decision to disable 3D Antialiasing on all affected machines. This temporary solution will be included in Archicad 27 Update 1, and we'll revert it as soon as the final fix is ready.
We sincerely apologize for the inconvenience caused by these issues.

Kind regards,

Re: AC27 IntelMacs: 3D view causes the freezing of all views

fabioferrini — Tue, 17 Oct 2023 10:04:28 GMT

Hi Oleksandra,

Thanks for your replay,

Unfortunately, we have noticed that disabling 3D antialiasing works when working with new files created in AC 27. However, this does not work with some older files created in AC 26 that are opened and saved in AC 27. For example, we have a file converted from AC 26 to AC 27 that creates the same 3D crack issues. The same file, on the other hand, crashes when attempting to upload it to BIMcloud as a service, right at the end of the download process. Work perfect in AC 26. I have sent this particular file to my local Italian distributor. Nonetheless, I can provide a link for you to download it and run some tests if you send me a private message. Thank you. Fabio

Re: AC27 IntelMacs: 3D view causes the freezing of all views

Romans — Tue, 17 Oct 2023 11:45:12 GMT

Dear Oleksandra,

Thank you for updating the community about this critical issue. 👍
On the other hand, it is clear that not only "some" macOS machines are affected, but almost all Intel-based Macs (with AMD GPUs) and all macOS.

Disabling the 3D Antialiasing is not a real 'workaround' as we already know.
Also is it disheartening that the so badly needed fix will not be included in the upcoming update 1.
A 3D application without the ability to use the 3D window is just hard to use.

Kind Regards
Roman

Re: AC27 IntelMacs: 3D view causes the freezing of all views

Oleksandra Vakariuk — Thu, 19 Oct 2023 13:46:47 GMT

Hi Fabio,

Unfortunately, I cannot offer any workaround regarding the issue you're experiencing with migrated projects. I can only recommend to continue using Archicad 26 until Archicad 27 Update 1 is released.

Regarding your other issue, I have received the file from our colleagues and I could reproduce the crash. On Tuesday, I sent the file to our developers for further investigation. I'll let you know as soon as I hear from them.

Kind regards,

Re: AC27 IntelMacs: 3D view causes the freezing of all views

HeadF — Thu, 19 Oct 2023 18:57:40 GMT

As far as I can tell, there is no solution at hand. Graphisoft has known about this issue since July and still hasn't found a fix for it. And I wouldn't count on one. What gets me is that Graphisoft knew about this issue and said nothing to us about it, No Warnings, no nothing. Let us Download, install, and burn.

I also believe that part of the blame rests with Apple as well. They no longer fully support the Intel chips (or half-heartedly) and are focused on the silicon chip Macs. Thus, there is clearly a glitch in the conversion from silicon macOS to macOS software for Intel machines, one which most likely will be ignored or not fixable. The 2019 iMac is the last iMac that Apple is going to support after that...... Nothing. The only real solution to this issue is a new silicon chip machine, which I have no interested in purchasing right now.

Re: AC27 IntelMacs: 3D view causes the freezing of all views

Romans — Thu, 19 Oct 2023 19:24:15 GMT

It is a weird thing, as AC26 (and earlier) doesn't have this problem and there was no change with the 3D engine for AC27, as far as I know.
So it is hard (for me) to understand why is this behavior now...

Re: AC27 IntelMacs: 3D view causes the freezing of all views

Rex Maximilian — Sat, 21 Oct 2023 00:48:59 GMT

Aaaaaaand... they increased SSA by another 10% in June for an update that is unusable. They owe us a rebate for the months from our latest SSA renewal until a fix is out. Utterly disappointed in them that they knew about this months ago and didn't fix it...

Re: AC27 IntelMacs: 3D view causes the freezing of all views

Rex Maximilian — Sat, 21 Oct 2023 00:58:06 GMT

@Oleksandra Vakariuk Can we have an immediate statement on when the quick fix update 1 will be available.

1) Disable the 3D anti-aliasing as mentioned

2) Release update tomorrow. Do not wait for other fixes. This is urgent!

I need to know when we can expect a fix. Do I need to go out and buy an ARM Mac immediately because we can't expect a fix before the end of the month? the end of November? The end of the year?

Re: AC27 IntelMacs: 3D view causes the freezing of all views

DGSketcher — Sat, 21 Oct 2023 08:00:42 GMT

Arggghicad - Designed by accountants for architects.

Re: AC27 IntelMacs: 3D view causes the freezing of all views

DGSketcher — Sun, 22 Oct 2023 11:10:30 GMT

I am regularly seeing lock ups without the grey out in AC27 3001. From what I can see they are caused by perhaps impatience on my part, but the lock ups all seem to follow selecting the 3D window tab and my assumption that the 3D window has completed its redraw, if I then provide input, typically mouse, but sometime shortcut keys the beach ball appears for a short while. In my case all the windows are as expected but frozen. Fortunately Save works, but it requires restarting AC.

Re: AC27 IntelMacs: 3D view causes the freezing of all views

DGSketcher — Tue, 24 Oct 2023 14:41:01 GMT

One further observation there seems to be some correlation between having an element selected on plan and switching to the 3D view (using tabs), possibly associated with locked elements. 🤔 Will keep an eye on it, but if anyone else sees a pattern...

Re: AC27 IntelMacs: 3D view causes the freezing of all views

Rex Maximilian — Wed, 13 Dec 2023 02:32:38 GMT

As of today, December 12, 2023, the 4003 hotfix still does not fix the Intel Mac 3D window issue that crashes the computer. Why in the name of all that is sacred hasn't this been fixed after several months (including beta testing where it was first reported)?

I had to leave my office to return home to work on my ARM Mac to be able to work in 3D. My office logistics should not depend on a software's dependability that costs me $1000 per year.

It's time Mac users band together and ask for a rebate or an extension of our SSA start date.

I purchased a drone from DJI in late-2021 that did not have all of its advertised features implemented yet. It took them three months to do so. Once the feature set was complete, then and only then, did they start everyone's warranty and extended warranties. It is only right that Graphisoft do the same for a software that crashes so much we cannot use it.

Re: AC27 IntelMacs: 3D view causes the freezing of all views

fabioferrini — Wed, 13 Dec 2023 08:45:18 GMT

Good morning Maximilian,

I wholeheartedly agree with your sentiments, and I believe it's crucial for us to come together and make our voices heard. On another note, I'd like to share that Graphisoft recently approached me to test a limited version of AC27 INT specifically designed to address "our" issues. I'm pleased to report that it performed exceptionally well—I worked seamlessly for a week on various files without encountering any problems, even with hardware acceleration active.

Unfortunately, the trial period for this specialized build has concluded, and I've returned to using my ITA 27.1.1 build with disabled hardware acceleration. Regrettably, this version continues to exhibit the known issues, forcing me to save and exit Archicad repeatedly and resulting in the loss of valuable hours.

The challenge we face is that the release date for the AC27 version intended to resolve our issues is set for February 2024 due to the ongoing validation period. While I understand the necessity of adhering to technical timelines, I'd like to address a straightforward question at this juncture: How will the period of impaired usability be addressed or compensated?

Fabio

Re: AC27 IntelMacs: 3D view causes the freezing of all views

Rex Maximilian — Wed, 13 Dec 2023 22:06:34 GMT

Yes, your last sentence is the key... For me, it translates to "How can I work in an impaired fashion on a modern computer at my office!" I shouldn't have to buy a new computer because they can't fix their bugs. Every other software I used hums along perfectly.

Seriously, it should be $100 off every month we have to put up with this towards our next SSA costs.

Re: AC27 IntelMacs: 3D view causes the freezing of all views

Rex Maximilian — Tue, 19 Dec 2023 00:04:29 GMT

Tech Support has stated this isn't expected to be fixed until early- to mid-2024, probably March or April. Let's see, how many months we will be due a credit on our SSA?