topic Re: ARCHICAD 27 - Slow zoom and pan in Installation & update

ARCHICAD 27 - Slow zoom and pan

HK ARCHITECTURE — Tue, 09 Jul 2024 06:50:06 GMT

Hi,

I recently been using Archicad 27 and i clearly notice that this version is very slow when i pan and zoom (in or out) in 2D. It seems to get worse the more time i spend working and the more object the project has displayed. This does not happen in 3D. The zoom is slower when the mouse is over an object or wall or something...I worked before on Archicad 25 and never had this issue. The PC specs are good : I9 13900KF, RTX 3090, 64GB RAM, SSD disks...

Can someone give me some advice to what's seems to be happening here ?

Thanks !

Re: ARCHICAD 27 - Slow zoom and pan

Barry Kelly — Fri, 10 May 2024 01:24:20 GMT

Do you have Trace & Reference turned on?

If so try turning it off.

Also check your Advanced Redraw Options in the Work Environment.

And this may sound strange, but if you have any floating palettes, try turning them off or docking them.

Barry.

Re: ARCHICAD 27 - Slow zoom and pan

Botonis — Fri, 10 May 2024 07:05:46 GMT

Is this floating issue still a problem??

I am using two monitors. One is the working/design window of Archicad without any palletes docked.

The other monitor has all the palletes (Navigator-organizer-Toolbox etc.....)

Apart from the DirectX problems in comparison to the OpenGL (flashing windows) I am not noticing any lagging.

The mouse polling rate is causing problems if it is above 500hz.

Re: ARCHICAD 27 - Slow zoom and pan

Barry Kelly — Fri, 10 May 2024 07:10:06 GMT

@Botonis wrote:

Is this floating issue still a problem??

I don't know, but I have read it has caused problems for some others in the past, so I thought I would mention it.

I can't say i have noticed any problems except when my RAM runs low.

Barry.

Re: ARCHICAD 27 - Slow zoom and pan

HK ARCHITECTURE — Fri, 10 May 2024 09:39:07 GMT

Hi,

Thanks for the replies. But i've tested all those things and the problem persists.

Trace & reference : Trace & reference disabled

Work environnement : I have disabled 2D and 3D antialiasing options.

Palettes : There are no floating palettes on my workspace.

Mouse : My mouse is a Logitech Master 3, so the polling rate is under 500hz (125hz).

Test : I tried Archicad 27 on a laptop and the issue is the same, so i believe the issue comes from Archicad 27 and its not a hardware factor... (laptop specs fyi : I7-9750H, 16gb RAM, RTX 2080, SSD disk).

I recorded a short video demonstration to what's happening : I opened the same .pln file on both Archicad 25 (left) and Archicad 27 (right). You can see my work environnement options and then i show the lag I'm experiencing on Archicad 27 that does not exist in comparaison to Archicad 25 (i have also tried this with other files and new files, and the result is the same). Also, from now and then, when navigating on 3D on Archicad 27 the software crashes suddenly (nvlddmkm error from the Windodws event log).

I hope someone can help me with this issue. My company is still using Archicad 25 due to this problem...

Thanks in advance,

HK ARCHITECTURE

Re: ARCHICAD 27 - Slow zoom and pan

MASz — Fri, 10 May 2024 11:14:16 GMT

Have you tried using the old drawing infrastructure?

Open Registry Editor and navigate to Computer\HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\GRAPHISOFT\Archicad\Archicad 27.0.0\Graphix
Change RenderingAPI value data from 0 to -1

Re: ARCHICAD 27 - Slow zoom and pan

HK ARCHITECTURE — Fri, 10 May 2024 13:13:09 GMT

Hi MASz,

I changed the Rendering API and It worked ! I dont have the cluess idea to how this works or what i just did, but now, all I know is that it all runs very smoothly and fine on Archicad 27 !

Thank you very much for your help !! I've spent hours trying to solve this problem i would not have found the solution withour your answer !

Re: ARCHICAD 27 - Slow zoom and pan

Botonis — Fri, 10 May 2024 13:23:13 GMT

It seems that I am already used to this bad performance that started with the release of 26 and the change of the OpenGL to DirectX.

There has been so many discussion about it that at the end I got bored and never changed the registry.

@HK ARCHITECTURE can you check the graphics quality after the change? Antializing performance, text, lines etc whether it is better with the previous rendering API?

Thanks.

Re: ARCHICAD 27 - Slow zoom and pan

HK ARCHITECTURE — Fri, 10 May 2024 13:49:38 GMT

Hi,

I just made a video showing Archicad 25 (left) vs Archicad 27 (right) after set the RenderingAPI to -1. As you can see, all works the same as Archicad 25, which is great !

- 2D navigation : Works perfectly now

- 3D navigation : Does not crash anymore

- Antializing : I don't like to use it for 2D but it works pretty well, just a little bit slower on both versions..

- Text : Works well, I don't see any difference on inputs and display

- Lines : Works well, same, I don't see any difference between before and now

- Object : Same

Hope this can help !

Re: ARCHICAD 27 - Slow zoom and pan

MASz — Sat, 11 May 2024 04:36:52 GMT

The new 2d drawing infrastructure was introduced in Archicad 26. You can read about it here. It may be faster in some cases, but much slower in others. I tried to get answers from Graphisoft on this and to try and encouraged them to have a more reliable solution. Nobody could tell me anything about the performance and this didn't go anywhere.

I also tried to tell Graphisoft that this is problematic and they should have a setting in the Work Environment at least since it's really not going to be obvious to a lot of users. The display scaling is also bugged on the new drawing infrastructure and there's really no indication they will fix this. Other than forum posts, none of this is properly documented and it also means that technical support don't have the tools necessary either without deeper knowledge of the program. In general, there's complete disregard of whether the full releases are going to be usable for people or not.

In 3d, DrawShadowsDuringNavigationOGL is also bugged and affects performance, even without shadows enabled. Open Registry Editor and navigate to Computer\HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\GRAPHISOFT\Archicad\Archicad 27.0.0\GSModeler and change DrawShadowsDuringNavigationOGL to 0.

Re: ARCHICAD 27 - Slow zoom and pan

Botonis — Sat, 11 May 2024 11:33:48 GMT

So I gave one more try and reverted back to the OPENGL API.

It seems that the antialising performane of DirectX is far more better and the graphics are far more clearer. I have been working with DirectX API since the beginning of 27 (In 26 there was a serious problem with text fonts so I had enabled the OpenGL API) and now that I tried for once more the registry fix I realised that texts and lines look much clearer and detailed with DirectX.

I guess this improvement has a performance cost.

OpenGL gives thicker lines. I prefer the DirectX API. Maybe I got used to it....

OPENGL NO ANTIALISINGDIRECTX NO ANTIALISINGOPENGL WITH ANTIALISINGDIRECTX WITH ANTIALISING

Re: ARCHICAD 27 - Slow zoom and pan

TMA_80 — Sun, 12 May 2024 07:28:01 GMT

The worst part is, even in the 2d area where archicad used to shine, Revit 2024 on the same old machine, without changing any registry key or settings is performing way way better that ArchiCAD 27 does ( I won't even talk about trace reference performance here) ...I was shocked.

Re: ARCHICAD 27 - Slow zoom and pan

MASz — Sun, 12 May 2024 00:22:21 GMT

Personally I just stick to the old drawing infrastructure with no anti-aliasing. Seems like the most reliable solution.

Re: ARCHICAD 27 - Slow zoom and pan

jdub_iom — Tue, 14 May 2024 09:16:34 GMT

I'm having exactly the same issue on the intel Mac version of 27solo. We were kind of forced to upgrade from 22solo due to compatibility with newer versions of macOS.

Drawings that were perfectly fine in 22 are now near unusable if there is a DWG underlaid. Tried altering the Plist file (mac's version of the registry editor) as explained above but it made it worse! any idea whether there's another underlying cause?

We've had to adjust our advanced redraw options to structural contours only, which is ok but a much less smooth experience than we had with much older software.

Re: ARCHICAD 27 - Slow zoom and pan

Barry Kelly — Tue, 14 May 2024 09:21:48 GMT

Be sure to get your local support involved.

See what they have to say about it.

Also you might want to update your signature that still says Archicad 21.

Barry.

Re: ARCHICAD 27 - Slow zoom and pan

jdub_iom — Tue, 14 May 2024 09:28:35 GMT

Thanks Barry, must've set up my signature when we originally switched over to AC and never touched it again!

We contacted local support and they were stumped as to the issue as they couldn't get it to occur at their end. All three of the systems here have the same issue. I'm yet to try on my personal MacBook Pro thats on apple silicone to see if the ARM version is any better... could be just our iMacs are getting old but it's frustrating they were fine on the much older software.

Re: ARCHICAD 27 - Slow zoom and pan

Botonis — Fri, 02 Aug 2024 08:06:12 GMT

I guess it is inevitable when the software becomes complicated and demands more resources (speed-graphics-calculations etc) that older hardware will not handle the demands.

Re: ARCHICAD 27 - Slow zoom and pan

joelsdg — Tue, 14 May 2024 17:55:08 GMT

jdub:

Please let me know your results if you run it on the Apple Silicon. I've also had these slow redraw problems, on an Intel MacBook Pro (i9 processor from 2019) and am stepping back to ArchiCAD 25 to see if it helps (nothing else has worked) as ArchiCAD 26 has the same problem.

I agree that I shouldn't have this problem on hardware that was less than 2 years old when AC27 came out.

Thanks for anything you discover,

Joel

Re: ARCHICAD 27 - Slow zoom and pan

jdub_iom — Wed, 15 May 2024 21:10:50 GMT

@joelsdgI tried a few files tonight that were particularly slow and they are running smoothly on my 2021 MacBook Pro with an M1pro chip (8 core base model). When I ran the file direct from a usb there was a lot of ghosting and artefacts left over in a strip across the top of the screen but when I dragged the folder to the desktop they ran perfectly.

With regard to 26 having the same issue I read that it was updated how AC handles visuals an edition earlier on Mac than windows, which may be why 26 is still having trouble for us on the intel chips when windows users are only getting issues in 27.

I will contact my local support again with a link to this thread and the windows solution to see if it helps them diagnose the issue.

Re: ARCHICAD 27 - Slow zoom and pan

joelsdg — Wed, 15 May 2024 22:49:36 GMT

Thanks jdub, I appreciate your effort.

Part of me is glad it's not just me having these problems. I don't suspect we'll ever get an update to either 26 or 27 that helps us.

Also, part of me is irritated that AC26 or 27 don't run on a laptop that has the "Recommended Configuration" from Graphisoft's own webpages for building "High End Projects" like hospitals when all I'm building are single-family residences. Maybe I'm gullible.

Joel