topic Re: connecting composite walls and slabs in sections in Modeling

connecting composite walls and slabs in sections

Anonymous — Wed, 24 May 2023 11:03:18 GMT

here is video of connecting composite walls and slabs in archicad:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-5JcBsKdpyE
It's the way I do it.
so watch it. Hope it will help anybody.

Re: connecting composite walls and slabs in sections

Anonymous — Tue, 11 Oct 2011 18:30:40 GMT

I prefere to model 2 different slabs: 1 for Structural propose and 1 for finished floor (non bearing); even put them on a separate layers.
Your method has a disadvantage in floor plan views - Target elements in SEO operations mantain original contours of the subtracted parts.

Re: connecting composite walls and slabs in sections

Anonymous — Tue, 11 Oct 2011 18:40:29 GMT

there is no disadvantage in floor plan since slabs contour are under the lines of the wall so they don't interfere with my floor plan.
I know for your method sometimes I have used it, but that method has disadvantage. I have to draw two slabs or even more if you put finishing slabs in every room. So you have to draw a lot more slabs and on every door you can see contours of your slab which bothers me more.
so that is why I am more pleased with this method presented here.
Don't get me wrong your method is OKe.

Re: connecting composite walls and slabs in sections

Anonymous — Wed, 12 Oct 2011 12:59:57 GMT

@mzex

Main issue with your method is how to model different type of floor finish?
especially with different heights...

Lines that bothers you, are actually connection lines of two different floor type, so they should be there...if floor finish is the same, then use one finish slab for multiple rooms...

Re: connecting composite walls and slabs in sections

vfrontiers — Wed, 12 Oct 2011 15:38:19 GMT

Also important is the ability to represent different FINISHES in plan.. With the ADDED floor finish SLABS, you can have different FILLS and create a nice looking PRESENTATION PLAN without a bunch of extra 2d fills.

AND.... If you use your structural slab as TOP OF SUBFLOOR, you can place LEVEL DIMENSIONS based on your structural slab (turn off FINISH FLOOR layer)...

Re: connecting composite walls and slabs in sections

JaredBanks — Wed, 12 Oct 2011 16:28:19 GMT

Also adding lots of SEOs to a file can slow things down. So anytime I find two options that are roughly equal, I tend to pick the one without SEO. Except when I get lazy...

Using the magic wand (space+click) adding in finish floor slabs is super fast.

Re: connecting composite walls and slabs in sections

Anonymous — Thu, 13 Oct 2011 09:17:57 GMT

dasneboja wrote:
@mzex

Main issue with your method is how to model different type of floor finish?
especially with different heights...

Lines that bothers you, are actually connection lines of two different floor type, so they should be there...if floor finish is the same, then use one finish slab for multiple rooms...

if I SPACE+click slabs into my rooms lines that bother me goes to the wall sides not to the door frames and I get two of them on both sides instead od just one. If I have different floor types I can set doors to show treshold and I get that line, or I can draw another that slab with different height in that room. It is not often situation that you have a lot of different floor types.
In scales of 1:50 I don't find important to draw that 1 cm as important.

I am familiar with your method. It has some advantages but I find this more suitable to my needs. I don't find good idea to have two slabs since you have to change thing in process of designing the house. it could be annoying to stretch two slabs instead of one.

Re: connecting composite walls and slabs in sections

Anonymous — Thu, 13 Oct 2011 09:22:25 GMT

vfrontiers wrote:
Also important is the ability to represent different FINISHES in plan.. With the ADDED floor finish SLABS, you can have different FILLS and create a nice looking PRESENTATION PLAN without a bunch of extra 2d fills.

AND.... If you use your structural slab as TOP OF SUBFLOOR, you can place LEVEL DIMENSIONS based on your structural slab (turn off FINISH FLOOR layer)...

first part of your post I find unimportant since I don't do any hatching on my floor plans, but if you like that no one said that you can't draw another slab in the room that has different finishing.

the second part with dimensioning is interesting and good point if you need that to be displayed. But I have custom level dimension that shows me top of the floor and top of construction slab. unfortunately it is not automatic.

Having SEO was never problem to me. My computers ran always good with models full of SEOs.

Re: connecting composite walls and slabs in sections

Anonymous — Thu, 13 Oct 2011 09:51:04 GMT

Best thing about your method is that works fine for you...

If you're ok with tracing custom levels whenever you change something,
and not having right volume of your slabs (for BOQs) that's ok with me

SEO will slow you down on large scale project no matter how powerful you hardware is...

Re: connecting composite walls and slabs in sections

Anonymous — Thu, 13 Oct 2011 12:43:12 GMT

dasneboja wrote:
Best thing about your method is that works fine for you...

If you're ok with tracing custom levels whenever you change something,
and not having right volume of your slabs (for BOQs) that's ok with me

SEO will slow you down on large scale project no matter how powerful you hardware is...

I don't have problems with calculating volume of the concrete, and finishes are calculated in m2, so I get that from zones.

Why I do this like this is that I want to have insulation on outer wall connected and if brick is construction material to have beam on the height of the slab. So in that case you will still have to SEO the below wall, while upper one is not SEO.
Alternative to that is to use complex profiles, what I did for gutter and foundations in that project that is on the clip.
If I want to have different finishes I draw another composite slab with different finishes.
I have recently modeled 4 skyscrapers (one was model and other 3 were modules) that was about 80000 m2 and no problems with SEO.

I don't say that your method is not good. I have to admit that I eill try it on the next project.

Re: connecting composite walls and slabs in sections

Anonymous — Thu, 13 Oct 2011 12:51:02 GMT

dasneboja wrote:
@mzex
if floor finish is the same, then use one finish slab for multiple rooms...

and what happens when you make a cross section through wall inside of the the building?
you have that wall overlapping with floor finishes, so to clean that up you have to SEO or go to worksheet to delete lines.
It is the situation you can see on the right part of the video I have posted.(close to SEO palette)
I am trying to do as much as I can in model.

Re: connecting composite walls and slabs in sections

Anonymous — Thu, 13 Oct 2011 13:36:52 GMT

You misunderstood my suggestion,

My finish slab is single slab drawn by inner contour line of the walls,
and it goes trough door to other room with same finish(if there is no threshold),
so it is perfect in section, no SEO,
exact volume, surface and everything I need...

How do you get slab volume out of zone?

It can be annoying to move finish slabs whenever you change something,
but with using marque tool instead of moving nodes it is ok...

Always model as it should be built, that is how I work.

Re: connecting composite walls and slabs in sections

Anonymous — Thu, 13 Oct 2011 21:30:19 GMT

dasneboja wrote:
You misunderstood my suggestion,

My finish slab is single slab drawn by inner contour line of the walls,
and it goes trough door to other room with same finish(if there is no threshold),
so it is perfect in section, no SEO,

perfect in section, but not in floor plan. you get two lines on every side of the wall.
well not quite perfect in section.
here is illustration of your method.
two rooms with same finish. space+clicked are finish layers of the floor.
I have two lines on the place of the doors and in section under the door I have part of the wall which is not something that is done in real world.

Re: connecting composite walls and slabs in sections

Anonymous — Thu, 13 Oct 2011 21:42:38 GMT

here I have one finish slab through the multiple rooms. It is OKe in floor plan, but in sections we have a problem. under the doors we have some strange square. what is that that is not how the buildings are buit. this can be solved with SEO or with door settings. In this case SEO is not the right answer to this problem.
if we create section outside the door we have partition wall overlapping with floor finish. and as I know buildings are buit the way that walls are put on the construction slab not on the finish. in this case you have to SEO to get this how it is in the real life.

so please, if I got you wrong, show me how you solve those problems.

Re: connecting composite walls and slabs in sections

Anonymous — Thu, 13 Oct 2011 21:53:22 GMT

dasneboja wrote:
How do you get slab volume out of zone?

under schedule you have two major folders. one is element and the other one is component.
you should use component to get volume out of composite.
here is picture with that.

everything is possible in archicad if you spend some time to discover diverse features.

and as I said finishes are calculated in m2 so you can get them out of the zones, but if you like you can use the same method as shown in pic.

Re: connecting composite walls and slabs in sections

Anonymous — Fri, 14 Oct 2011 08:09:56 GMT

One picture thousand words

I have ONE finish slab for the same rooms,
so NO two lines around door on the floor plan,
and NO seo in sections...

I never said I use only space click to create finish slab,
in this kind of situation I space click to get slab for first room,
and then add other slab(s) to the first one...so I end up with ONE slab for ALL room with same finish, if they are connected with door(s)...

Re: connecting composite walls and slabs in sections

Anonymous — Fri, 14 Oct 2011 08:24:13 GMT

mzex wrote:
dasneboja wrote:
How do you get slab volume out of zone?
under schedule you have two major folders. one is element and the other one is component.
you should use component to get volume out of composite.
here is picture with that.

everything is possible in archicad if you spend some time to discover diverse features.

I was asking for volume out of zone...
I do use schedule/component to get volume out of slabs,
and that is one of the major reasons why I use "two slabs method"
cause I have in model everything exactly as it should be built...

One more q for u
Do you SEO all slabs and all walls, or just one shown in sections?

Re: connecting composite walls and slabs in sections

Anonymous — Fri, 14 Oct 2011 11:18:58 GMT

dasneboja wrote:
mzex wrote:
dasneboja wrote:
How do you get slab volume out of zone?
under schedule you have two major folders. one is element and the other one is component.
you should use component to get volume out of composite.
here is picture with that.

everything is possible in archicad if you spend some time to discover diverse features.
I was asking for volume out of zone...
I do use schedule/component to get volume out of slabs,
and that is one of the major reasons why I use "two slabs method"
cause I have in model everything exactly as it should be built...

One more q for u
Do you SEO all slabs and all walls, or just one shown in sections?

it depends on my mood. If I have a lot of time that I SEO all the slabas, if I am in the hurry I SEO only those visible in sections.
If you use SEO and component schedule it recognizes all the cuted out parts of the slab, so my schedules are right. if some finishes are not SEO from model than this inaccuracy in their quantity is negligible, since all my quantities I increase for 5% for cost estimation.

About your method. I find it interesting but I think is time consuming to draw that finish slab. Maybe it is more accurate but you have to draw room by room and door by door to get that and it can be tricky when changing the project, but I will try it.