topic Re: multiple design versions in Modeling

multiple design versions

Anonymous — Sat, 04 Sep 2010 22:36:19 GMT

Aloha,
I am looking for a good way to create multiple design versions of a project in ArchiCAD. On almost every project I have multiple design versions while I am in schematic design and design development. I'd like to find a good way to manage these multiple design versions in ArchiCAD.

One way is to create multiple PLNs for each version by using the SAVE AS feature each time I start down a new design path. This can get pretty bulky and hard to manage as the option tree branches out. This gets really difficult to manage when I am working on multiple projects over a period of months and years which is more often the case than not.

I'd like to know how other people are managing multiple design versions of projects.

Many thanks for sharing your ideas and input.
Aloha,
John

Re: multiple design versions

Eduardo Rolon — Sat, 04 Sep 2010 23:05:21 GMT

The naming scheme I use:

xxx R001x

Where:
xxx= project name and phase i.e. BRP - CDs, BRP - Schematic, BRP - DD, BRP - CAdmin

R001x = Revision Number, x is a variation of that revision.

-----

My files then are named

BRP - AB R001 = BRP as built drawings revision 01

BRP - DD R100 = first design development for project BRP

BRP - DD R101a = first alternative to Revision 1 of development drawings.

-----

Hope this makes sense.

Re: multiple design versions

Anonymous — Sun, 05 Sep 2010 01:10:41 GMT

There is no single best way. It depends on the project.

I have used the multiple file approach as well as linked multiple files. This approach is generally best in early phases.

You can also use Teamwork and create multiple drafts from the same shared file (I haven't tried this yet in 13 or 14 but imagine it should still work. This is useful for significant alterations of largely settled designs and is good in the design development phase.

For minor alternates I usually use layers. This is really for very limited scope alternates though, like two roof options for the side porch. Anything even remotely complex can quickly turn this into a major pain.

For the first two methods the only way I know to keep track of the alternates and changes is with notes. On a Mac these can be put into the "Spotlight Comments" field in the Finder which allows you see the comments in list view.

I'm not sure that this aspect of design practice can really be highly automated. The parameters are tremendously complex.

Re: multiple design versions

Anonymous — Sun, 05 Sep 2010 01:38:30 GMT

Matthew wrote:
There is no single best way. It depends on the project.

I have used the multiple file approach as well as linked multiple files. This approach is generally best in early phases.

You can also use Teamwork and create multiple drafts from the same shared file (I haven't tried this yet in 13 or 14 but imagine it should still work. This is useful for significant alterations of largely settled designs and is good in the design development phase.

For minor alternates I usually use layers. This is really for very limited scope alternates though, like two roof options for the side porch. Anything even remotely complex can quickly turn this into a major pain.

For the first two methods the only way I know to keep track of the alternates and changes is with notes. On a Mac these can be put into the "Spotlight Comments" field in the Finder which allows you see the comments in list view.

I'm not sure that this aspect of design practice can really be highly automated. The parameters are tremendously complex.

Aloha Matthew,
I am intrigued by the Teamwork idea using drafts. How can I learn more about this option?
BTW I completely agree about no using the custom layer option. I have spent a lot of time trying to unravel that mess.
Aloha,
John

Re: multiple design versions

Anonymous — Sun, 05 Sep 2010 02:34:06 GMT

johncassel wrote:
I am intrigued by the Teamwork idea using drafts. How can I learn more about this option?

I believe it has been discussed here before so a search might turn up something useful. It's been a while since I've done it so I don't recall all the details.

There are limitations though (of course).

Extensive alternates (as I recall) can be done by making multiple copies of a single draft sign-in (typically with exclusive access). These can each be worked and published independently. The main limitation is you can't send the changes until one of the alternates is selected. Once selected and sent the others can be saved as PLNs for future reference using copy/paste or saved modules if any of the work needs to be brought back at a later date. I'm not sure that this approach offers much more than the multiple PLN method.

A more compelling use is to apply this same approach to various parts of the project when distinct areas are subject to variations which will be recombined in the shared model once approved. In this method you create multiple sign-ins (one for each distinct area) and then use the same multiple draft copies to develop the alternates. The advantage of this is that you can easily combine, for example, alternates A3, B1, C4, D3, etc. into the same master file.

I have spent no time thinking about how this might be different in TW2.

In any case it is always advisable to take good notes so you can remember what's what.

Re: multiple design versions

Link — Thu, 09 Sep 2010 00:47:14 GMT

This method simply does not work in TW2, so don't get too used to it.

I would recommend using multiple projects for each option and moduling them into one master file. It's easy enough to relink to them required option at any time.

And if you hotlink published MOD files (instead of hotlinking the whole project), you have the ability to filter out any unwanted data by hiding it in your published layer combos.

Cheers,
Link.

Re: multiple design versions

Anonymous — Thu, 09 Sep 2010 00:59:13 GMT

TW2

Look at the AC Collaboration Guide Part 2, Chapter 7, step 5. the title of this section is, drum roll ...
Version Management with Mark-Up. It specifically addresses following multiple ongoing versions in the same model.
And, "compare several design proposals to each other", nice after dinner treat, huh?

Just another tool in the arsenal.

Snap

Re: multiple design versions

Link — Thu, 09 Sep 2010 02:02:51 GMT

snapcrackle wrote:
TW2

Look at the AC Collaboration Guide Part 2, Chapter 7, step 5. the title of this section is, drum roll ...
Version Management with Mark-Up. It specifically addresses following multiple ongoing versions in the same model.
And, "compare several design proposals to each other", nice after dinner treat, huh?

Just another tool in the arsenal.

Snap

And we know how well that's working out...

Cheers,
Link.

Re: multiple design versions

Anonymous — Thu, 09 Sep 2010 02:20:15 GMT

Sheesh. Ugly. Oops.

Snap

Re: multiple design versions

Anonymous — Thu, 09 Sep 2010 20:53:48 GMT

Where can I find a copy of the AC Collaboration Guide? What is wrong with it?

Re: multiple design versions

Link — Thu, 09 Sep 2010 21:30:01 GMT

It is under the AC13/14 Help menu. Not much wrong with the guide, it's ArchiCAD that doesn't always behave as expected!

Cheers,
Link.

Re: multiple design versions

Anonymous — Thu, 09 Sep 2010 22:03:49 GMT

woops...
I'm still back here on v11 so I guess I don't get the guide.

I'm hesitant to upgrade because of the poor performance of some of the library parts that came with AC v11 (and previous versions) and the cost to upgrade vs. switching over to a program (like Revit) that has library parts that have a better understanding of how things are built in the US.

Example: The pocket door in the v11 library does not work even though the pocket door in previous versions worked fine. When repeatedly alerted to this problem we got a message from one of the developers cajoling us to upgrade. Why would I buy a new one when the last one didn't work.

Example: In ArchiCAD v11 3/4" thick door and window casing is a custom setting. Most builders in the US know that anything but 3/4" casing is custom. I invite the developers to spend some time working construction projects in the US so they can see how things are really built here.

Re: multiple design versions

Anonymous — Thu, 09 Sep 2010 22:06:20 GMT

Link wrote:
It is under the AC13/14 Help menu. Not much wrong with the guide, it's ArchiCAD that doesn't always behave as expected!

Cheers,
Link.

One more reason not to upgrade.

Re: multiple design versions

Link — Thu, 09 Sep 2010 22:44:21 GMT

On the contrary, I think you will notice a big difference going from AC11 to AC14, especially once the upcoming hotfix is released.

ArchiCAD has never been perfect, never will be, but comparing it to a switch to Revit is like comparing an upgrade to AC14 with a downgrade to AC7, IMHO.

Stay the course mate!

Mahalo,
Link.

Re: multiple design versions

Anonymous — Thu, 09 Sep 2010 23:03:31 GMT

Link wrote:
On the contrary, I think you will notice a big difference going from AC11 to AC14, especially once the upcoming hotfix is released.

ArchiCAD has never been perfect, never will be, but comparing it to a switch to Revit is like comparing an upgrade to AC14 with a downgrade to AC7, IMHO.

Stay the course mate!

Mahalo,
Link.

Aloha Link,
Good to hear from you. If you have a moment please open a door or window from the ArchiCAD library an see what it takes to show 3/4" thick casing. Please let me know what you find.

I'm just curious to see if Graphisoft is aware of US construction standards yet.
Mahalo,
John

Re: multiple design versions

Anonymous — Thu, 09 Sep 2010 23:04:48 GMT

Better yet, how can I get a gig beta testing the software. I seem to be able to find a good many flaws.

Re: multiple design versions

Link — Thu, 09 Sep 2010 23:20:52 GMT

I'll PM you.

Cheers,
Link.