topic Re: Parallel and Perpendicular in Arch 10 in Modeling

Parallel and Perpendicular in Arch 10

jzarmin — Tue, 23 May 2023 15:12:38 GMT

Hello there,

We have been using Arch 10 987 USA full now for a couple months on our MAC's in the office.

Can someone please explain step-by-step how to draw a line of a specific length (using numeric input) parallel to an existing angled object? I cannot successfully do this using either Guidelines or the old Relative Construction Methods.

Back before Arch 10, I would click at the origin of the new line, then select the Relative Construction parallel box, then click on the existing angled object, then (after relocating the cursor to the origin point) numerically input a relative R distance.

However, under Arch 10, this method no longer works because once I return the cursor to the origin point of the new line it seems to forget the parallel angle I have specified for it and instead the line is drawn perfectly horizontal as if the angle were 0. If I don't return the cursor to the origin point of the new line before inputing the relative R distance, then the resulting line length is wrong but the angle is correct.

I've been having the same trouble trying to draw new lines of specific lengths perpendicular to existing objects. Does anyone know what either I or ArchiCAD 10 is doing wrong?

thanks!

Joe
San Francisco

Re: Parallel and Perpendicular in Arch 10

Anonymous — Tue, 07 Nov 2006 19:45:08 GMT

Relative construction methods and guidelines are working fine for me (on 1010, pretty sure they did on 987build). I'm starting to quite like the guidelines. Hover over an existing line/wall, guideline pops up parallel to it, go back to original point, guideline appears, hover over that, key in dimension (no need for D or R, just the number). Multiple guidelines for projected intersections. I have a little trouble sometimes with angles, where it reads relative to guideline and i want it relative to horizontal.

Re: Parallel and Perpendicular in Arch 10

Anonymous — Tue, 07 Nov 2006 19:59:19 GMT

Joe,
It is true that AC 10 does forget the last angle used
but you can "remind" it by clicking the parallel or perpendicular
button then click on a line that is at the angle you want then
draw the new line and give it a length using "R".
I tend to use this method rather than guidelines.
Peter Devlin

Re: Parallel and Perpendicular in Arch 10

__archiben — Tue, 07 Nov 2006 20:14:34 GMT

guidelines are nowhere near as intelligent as they need to be . . . and certainly don't come close to sketchup's intelligent constraints.

i still use the 'P' single-key shortcut to invoke the parallel/perpendicular constraint toggle because it's far quicker than generating guidelines. as peter says, it's a shame that archicad now 'forgets' custom angle constraints forcing you to keep repeating the command . . .

~/archiben

Re: Parallel and Perpendicular in Arch 10

jzarmin — Tue, 07 Nov 2006 20:18:45 GMT

Peter,
I've tried exactly the method that you've explained. Once I have started a new line with an origin point, then after I have specified an existing angle to match using the parallel button, as I return to drawing the new line, the visible angle value (visible in the box that follows the cursor around) becomes 0 once I return the cursor to the new line origin point and thus the specified angle is lost.

Like I said in my original post, if I don't return the cursor to the new line origin point before completing the new line, the specified angle for the new line is maintained but then the resulting line's R value is wrong. You aren't having this problem?

s2art, I don't understand what you meant by "no need for D or R, just the number". I do want to specify the new angled line length using R, I don't know any other way.

Thanks

Joe

Re: Parallel and Perpendicular in Arch 10

__archiben — Tue, 07 Nov 2006 20:25:57 GMT

jzarmin wrote:
Peter,
I've tried exactly the method that you've explained. But after I select the parallel or perpendicular button and then click on an existing angled line, when I draw a new line using "R", the line (as I wrote in my original post)

you have to begin the creation/editing command before you invoke the parallel/perpendicular constraint . . .

- begin drawing your line
- press 'P' until you get the desired constraint
- click the line you want to constrain to
- finish drawing the line

HTH
~/archiben

Re: Parallel and Perpendicular in Arch 10

Anonymous — Tue, 07 Nov 2006 20:30:36 GMT

Joe,
Are you pressing the shift key when you start drawing your new line ?
This is what one did in previous versions but now you should not
do so but simply start drawing the new line after "reminding" AC
of the angle.
Peter Devlin

Re: Parallel and Perpendicular in Arch 10

jzarmin — Tue, 07 Nov 2006 22:25:49 GMT

ArchiBen,
I am starting the line before selecting the constraint. Same result.

Peter,
I am not pressing the shift key.

I still don't know why we're having this trouble.

Here's from an earlier post of mine:

Once I have started a new line with an origin point, then after I have specified an existing angle to match using the parallel button, as I return to drawing the new line, the visible angle value (visible in the box that follows the cursor around) becomes 0 once I return the cursor to the new line origin point and thus the specified angle is lost.

Like I said in my original post, if I don't return the cursor to the new line origin point before completing the new line, the specified angle for the new line is maintained but then the resulting line's R value is wrong.

Joe

Re: Parallel and Perpendicular in Arch 10

Anonymous — Tue, 07 Nov 2006 22:50:16 GMT

Joe

Peter made a good point. You don't need to press Shift anymore to constrain the angle. If guidelines are on, start drawing your line, move in direction you want to go, guideline appears, if cursor is still hovering over guideline just start typing your distance. You used to have to press R for Radial dimension (which changed in AC10 to D for Distance, you can use either), but now there is no need (unless you press Shift).

Or do it Ben's way (~/Ben - "P" does nothing for me, was it a default or have you modified your shortcuts?)

Have I confused you enough yet?

Summary:

Using Shift to constrain angle, press D (or R) then input dimension
Using guidelines or relative construction methods, just input dimension

HTH

Re: Parallel and Perpendicular in Arch 10

Anonymous — Tue, 07 Nov 2006 22:51:36 GMT

Joe,
Are you using the "Tracker" ?
I have heard that it has some problems.
Try turning off Tracker and using the coordinate box instead.
I am sorry you are having these troubles.
I tried to reproduce what you describe but could not.
Peter Devlin

Re: Parallel and Perpendicular in Arch 10

Anonymous — Tue, 07 Nov 2006 22:54:36 GMT

Sorry, Joe, got delayed in the middle of writing the last response, and you replied again in the meantime. So most of what I said was irrelevant. (No surprise there).

Your angle 0 is what I was eluding to when I said "I have a little trouble sometimes with angles, where it reads relative to guideline and i want it relative to horizontal" in my first reply.

Re: Parallel and Perpendicular in Arch 10

Link — Tue, 07 Nov 2006 23:21:53 GMT

Joe

It doesn't matter when you invoke the parallel constraint. Before or during is fine. What matters is that you are placing your cursor back at the start of the line. There's no need to do this, in fact it looks like you've found a bug that overrides the angle to 0 if you do.

So for a start don't place your cursor back at the origin.

The more perplexing problem is why your length is incorrect? The length of a line is usually measured from the Edit Origin. That's the origin that jumps to the start of your line temporarily while you are drawing it. Do you see that? Assuming you are using relative coordinates (make sure the delta sign next to the R value in the coordiante box is indented), all distances will be measured from the start of your line.

Are you absolutely sure the angle is correct, but the distance is not? How far out is it? Are you inputting your coordinates into the Tracker or the Coordinate box?

Maybe an image will help.

Cheers,
Link.

Re: Parallel and Perpendicular in Arch 10

TomWaltz — Tue, 14 Nov 2006 18:08:49 GMT

I'm working on a video tutorial on this, should be done in the next week or so (part of a larger "Drafting & drawing in Archicad" topic)

Re: Parallel and Perpendicular in Arch 10

jzarmin — Tue, 14 Nov 2006 18:27:47 GMT

Hello again,
I'm really sorry- I disappeared because of a deadline. So, Link, I read your reply. I think what is happening is that before Arch 10 came out, I have used this certain sequence of commands to draw a specific-length line parallel or perpendicular to an existing reference line. Somehow, something has changed in Arch 10 that renders that sequence of commands faulty. Others must be using a different sequence of commands and thus are not encountering the problem.

In the pre-Arch 10 era, my edit origin would remain at the line origin location while I was clicking on the reference line (to obtain the desired angle). Now it appears, that the edit origin moves around when I'm moving the cursor to go click on the reference line. Thus whatever distance it is from the line origin at the time that I input the R value (using the coordinate box), gets added to the R value and thus the line length ends up incorrect. Like I said before, if I return to the line origin and then input the R value (to avoid the incorrect resulting line length) the angle defaults to 0. I hope this is description is understandable.

By the way, Peter, I haven't been using the Tracker nor have I been pressing the shift key- so that isn't the problem, but thanks.

So I must ask what specific sequence of commands others are successfully using to draw a specific-length line parallel or perpendicular to an existing reference line?

thanks

Joe

Re: Parallel and Perpendicular in Arch 10

Link — Tue, 14 Nov 2006 21:53:42 GMT

jzarmin wrote:
Hello again,
Now it appears, that the edit origin moves around when I'm moving the cursor to go click on the reference line.

This is very alarming! Are you sure you don't have Grid Snap on? I would also suggest going to Help > Check for Updates... and making sure you are using the latest build (1010).

jzarmin wrote:
So I must ask what specific sequence of commands others are successfully using to draw a specific-length line parallel or perpendicular to an existing reference line?

If you have your Statusbar active, most of the instructions will be given to you. Window > Palettes > Statusbar.

1. Start your line*;
2. Hit the parallel relative construction method in your control box;
3. Make sure it is indented;
4. Click on the edge of another element (i.e. a line, slab, wall, etc - not an object), using the mercedes cursor**;
5. Hit R or D and then the distance then enter***

* You can start your line after hitting the parallel relative construction method too.
** Alternatively you can define your own reference vector, by selcting two points anywhere you like.
*** If you have the Tracker active and prefer polar coordinates & direct numeric input enabled in your Work Environment, you don't need to hit the R or D first, just the distance and enter.

Otherwise you can just use Guide Lines, which is probably easier in AC10 anyway. If you have guide lines active and Parallel to the active Guide Line enabled in your Work Environment, you simply need to do this:

1. Hover over the parallel edge until the instant guide line appears*;
2. Make this an active guide line by running your cursor along it until it turns bold and orange;
3. Start your line and snap it to the guide line that appears with the parallel symbol on it;
4. Enter the distance as above.

* If you don't have an edge you can place a guide line between two points bystart to draw an edge of any tool and before finishing, use the context menu to place a guide line or convert to a guide line segment.

Hope that helps.

Cheers,
Link.

Re: Parallel and Perpendicular in Arch 10

Anonymous — Tue, 14 Nov 2006 22:11:56 GMT

Hello Joe,
I am doing what you suggest and will describe what I do.
I have both delta buttons ON for absolute and relative coordinates.
I select the line tool and draw a line of arbitrary angle and length.
Then, with the line tool still selected, using the left mouse button
I click on the parallel button.
I click on the line I have just drawn and then move the cursor
to some arbitrary position in the plan and with just the mouse
draw another line that is automatically constrained to the angle
of the first line. Pressing the shift key has no effect and
entering an "R" value and hitting enter makes the line exactly
the length entered in the "R" field.
I do exactly the same procedure for perpendicular lines.
Unlike previous versions I have to "remind" Archicad of the
angle I want by clicking on the perpendicular or parallel button,
then click on a line that is at the angle I want,
just before I draw a new line.
I hope you can get this to work.
Peter Devlin

Re: Parallel and Perpendicular in Arch 10

Djordje — Wed, 15 Nov 2006 04:06:12 GMT

... and you have to have your Control Box on, or choose the Parallel and Perpendicular form the pulldown menu (much slower ...)

Re: Parallel and Perpendicular in Arch 10

jzarmin — Wed, 15 Nov 2006 17:51:56 GMT

Thanks Link and Peter,

I didn't know there was a new ArchiCAD patch out there. We are using Arch 10 987. Under this version, I tried the series of steps both of you prescribed with not good results.

Unfortunately I have another deadline and my employer is worried about the time invested in upgrading before the deadline is completed. So it may take me a few days to get to upgrade to Build 1010 and see if that cures our ills!

I will post a status report at that time.
Thanks a lot for the help!

Joe

Re: Parallel and Perpendicular in Arch 10

jzarmin — Tue, 28 Nov 2006 01:06:56 GMT

Aha!

After installing the Arch 1010 patch, I finally figured out what the problem was. In pre-10 versions of ArchiCAD I had drawn angle lines by first drawing an origin point, then specifying the angle and then inputting the R length. At the end of inputting the R lenght I always then typed the "+" key as in a relative distance. This never was a problem if my curser was no longer at the origin point of the line. However, somehow from version 10 on, the "+" key would cause the R length inputted to be measured from where on the line my curser was, not from the origin point, hence my problem I described in earlier posts.

I now realize that the "+" which wasn't a problem before but now is, was never necessary and thus I don't type it and I now get the line length I wanted while working in Arch 10.

Thanks for your help, everyone.

Joe

Re: Parallel and Perpendicular in Arch 10

Anonymous — Tue, 28 Nov 2006 01:18:17 GMT

Joe,
Thank you for posting back.
We were all worried that you had some mysterious
unsolvable problem causing you to be unable to
control angle, length, and origin in AC 10.
I am glad you got things working and have
described how you did so for the benefit of others.
Peter Devlin