topic Re: Colorbond panel fence created with editing a preset railing in Australia in Modeling

Colorbond panel fence created with editing a preset railing in Australia

mthd — Tue, 09 May 2023 13:11:29 GMT

Hi there, has anyone in Australia successfully created colorbond fencing with an edit of a preset railing ? I don’t need a high level of detail except to show the metal sheet profile in the panel settings. How do I get a colorbond panel to show up in my railing panel setting ? A standard Bunnings fence kit with inserts is what I am trying to model up.

I do have “CI tools Coverings” installed so I might just draw a standard railing with a few edits and just clad the rail or even draw a wall and just add the colorbond profile to it ? If you have a better method please reply.

Please see the PDF below for a picture of what I am trying to model.

Thank you.

https://www.steeline.com.au/wp-content/uploads/2019/04/Panel-Fencing-Installation-Guide-Stee495_Product_Brochure_47.pdf

Re: Colorbond panel fence created with editing a preset railing in Australia

Lingwisyer — Thu, 08 Dec 2022 06:11:52 GMT

Given kit sizes, could you just model the profile using a shell on the floor plan, then save it as a custom panel? Or if you are going rib to rib, save it as a custom baluster?

Ling.

Re: Colorbond panel fence created with editing a preset railing in Australia

Gerry Leonor — Thu, 08 Dec 2022 06:32:30 GMT

if you don't plan to be too accurate, i'd just use a standard post + rail + solid panel.

With the solid panel using a Surface with the Colorbond vertical cladding.

the issue with this is that you won't be able to set a unique starting point of each of the solid panels. meaning the vertical sheeting won't ever start from, say, the bottom left of each panel. but that would just be splitting hairs at this point.

Re: Colorbond panel fence created with editing a preset railing in Australia

mthd — Thu, 08 Dec 2022 07:04:04 GMT

Good tip LW, that is a more precise method of creating a colorbond panel sheet by the looks ?

Thanks GL, You mean I could get problems like this thread below shows ?

https://community.Graphisoft.com/t5/Design-forum/Using-AC21-Railing-for-Metal-Fence/m-p/219845#M119171

I think I am going to have to follow these and your steps closely unless things have changed a bit in newer versions of Archicad ?

I ill let you know how I go.

Re: Colorbond panel fence created with editing a preset railing in Australia

Gerry Leonor — Thu, 08 Dec 2022 07:10:53 GMT

if you used my recommendation, i doubt you'd have problems like that.

they've added another element to my proposal. this is so they could get one that not only looks OK in elevation, but also in 3D if you, say, want to have shadows acting upon the fence. mine is a lot simpler with less parts, but not enough 3D detail.

Re: Colorbond panel fence created with editing a preset railing in Australia

mthd — Thu, 08 Dec 2022 07:34:01 GMT

That’s good to hear that I will not get those problems in the older post.

I was hoping to somehow substitute the solid panel for a colorbond fence sheeting panel if that is actually possible ? And then try and get the top and bottom rails flush with the sheeting ? I think once I get that right I might be able to have that set as a template item hopefully ?

LW is suggesting that I model that panel with the shell tool somehow ?

This video shows the modelling of a colorbond sheet profile with the morph tool not the shell tool ?

https://youtu.be/IDC6TWDewNA

Re: Colorbond panel fence created with editing a preset railing in Australia

Gerry Leonor — Thu, 08 Dec 2022 07:42:47 GMT

yep, then your going a little bit more detailed than how i'd do it.

try it out. i haven't had the need to create custom panels for Rails, however.

Re: Colorbond panel fence created with editing a preset railing in Australia

Lingwisyer — Thu, 08 Dec 2022 07:54:16 GMT

You draw the profile on the floorplan using the polyline extrusion option in the shell tool.

You can then save it as a custom railing panel or baluster. The issue with saving as a custom panel is that they do not curve, and with both options, you will want your posts to have a spacing matching some multiple of your panel or baluster else you will get the gaps as show in your linked post. Sort of workable to an extent with the end offsets as shown, but not ideal.

Balusters use custom posts. Do not recall the orientation required, but if need be, quite likely, use a reference block to rotate the shell in 3D.

Custom panels, unless properly scripted, will always be orthoganal, so there maybe some complications if you need to slope the fence down a hill. See this thread.

Ling.

Re: Colorbond panel fence created with editing a preset railing in Australia

mthd — Thu, 08 Dec 2022 08:12:02 GMT

Thankfully the site is flat and the fence has no curves in it. It’s good to know what problems to look out for too.

I am not bothering with any scripting language, I will draw the line there. I surely appreciate you sharing your master class method above for all of us to benefit from.

Thank you very much to both of you for the tips and clear methods, both of you are champions.

I may opt for the easier method that Garry has outlined for me because that’s all I might be capable of these days lol !

Re: Colorbond panel fence created with editing a preset railing in Australia

Barry Kelly — Thu, 08 Dec 2022 08:44:17 GMT

Railings can not have custom panels.

The best you can do is a plane panel with a surface material that has a vertical hatch pattern to represent the sheeting ribs in elevation/3D and a texture of the sheeting so it looks good in 3D renders.

You can use custom profile balusters as linked to in one of the previous posts.

I stand corrected - they can.

Just save as a library object and choose custom panel

The other problem with railings is the top & bottom rails and panels, will follow the rake of the railing.

So if on a sloping site you will not get stepped panels unless you break up the length into separate rails.

Even with segments in the rail I don't think you can have vertical changes in height.

I don't think it is possible to have a single railing that steps in height - at least it is not obvious to me.

Fine though if you do want it to rake.

Barry.

Re: Colorbond panel fence created with editing a preset railing in Australia

Barry Kelly — Thu, 08 Dec 2022 08:19:52 GMT

I stand corrected on the custom panel, thanks Ling.

I was looking in the railing to select from a custom panel - like a custom profile.

It seems when you create a custom panel it just appears as an option the same as custom door leafs.

Barry.

Re: Colorbond panel fence created with editing a preset railing in Australia

mthd — Thu, 08 Dec 2022 08:25:08 GMT

Yes that’s fine, segmented railing is not a problem if the site was sloping.

If you could somehow disconnect a stair railing and use that without the stairs, you would think that would follow an incline or that is should be scripted to do so ?

A future incline railing tool created from a stair slope maybe possible in the future and that can also have substitutable panels placed in it as well.

Re: Colorbond panel fence created with editing a preset railing in Australia

Barry Kelly — Thu, 08 Dec 2022 08:42:13 GMT

Not sure I understand.

A single railing can follow any incline already.

It doesn't have to be a stair.

In fact you can just grab (create if need be) a node on the reference line and drag it vertically in 3D or elevation.

It doesn't even have to associate to any other element.

It is just the segments will rake and not step vertically.

Barry.

Re: Colorbond panel fence created with editing a preset railing in Australia

Lingwisyer — Thu, 08 Dec 2022 08:59:43 GMT

The issue is that your custom panel will not slope with the rest of the railing without proper scripting, so you would have to model a panel for each inclination.

Re: Colorbond panel fence created with editing a preset railing in Australia

mthd — Thu, 08 Dec 2022 09:00:20 GMT

That information is all very helpful. So if I want a stepped fence, I just have to use railing in segments.

Thank you all for the help on this forum, it’s outstanding, I am glad I chose to use Archicad in Australia as its very well supported down here.

Re: Colorbond panel fence created with editing a preset railing in Australia

Barry Kelly — Thu, 08 Dec 2022 09:06:37 GMT

So the custom panel will not rake if the railing rakes and the top & bottom rails can not be horizontal if the railing rakes.

You just can't win. 🤔

Barry.

Re: Colorbond panel fence created with editing a preset railing in Australia

Barry Kelly — Thu, 08 Dec 2022 09:18:14 GMT

That is why I created my own GDL object.

Sorry I can't share being company IP.

Not sure if there are any fence objects in default library now, or they may have all been removed now the railing is there.

If you have an old version pre railing tool (20 I think), there may be some fence objects.

Or there could be some in BIMComponents if you search in the object settings.

Or maybe Param-o could help create an object without the need for GDL.

Still would be a bit of a learning curve.

That would be a good one for the current challenge.

https://community.graphisoft.com/t5/Parametric-Object-Factory/con-p/parametric-object-challenge

Barry.

Re: Colorbond panel fence created with editing a preset railing in Australia

Jim Allen — Thu, 08 Dec 2022 12:52:52 GMT

I don't think Param-o can do everything without custom gdl scripting.

It can create objects which are parametric, but they can't follow paths on plan.

You could create a single panel as a parametric param-o object, with end posts whose visibility can be toggled on and off, but then you would have to copy/array the object for every single panel and group them.

It would show in 2D and 3D and should work correctly - it would just be a pain to edit.

If only we had a command to create parametric arrays of objects... 😉

Re: Colorbond panel fence created with editing a preset railing in Australia

Jim Allen — Thu, 08 Dec 2022 13:17:47 GMT

You can do something like this using custom balusters, where you model each complete repetitive profile unit like this:

This creates a fence like this:, which even copes with gradients.

The custom baluster profiles (just like fence panels, posts etc) do not display correctly in 2d though. This is a limitation which I've put on the wishlist.

Re: Colorbond panel fence created with editing a preset railing in Australia

mthd — Fri, 09 Dec 2022 01:03:03 GMT

Oh yeah, I searched some of the library parts before making the post but I will go back and search in earlier versions as well.

Barry you could pass or sell your fence object on for the Australian Essential Library ? Central Innovations might be interested in it ?

I am still going to use the railing tool with a metal sheet profile appended to the panel section.

I also hope I can also use the CI Coverings tool to clad the railing panel in some way ? If I can’t I will ask CI to update their AEL.

Archicad should me much easier to use for standard items like colorbond metal fences.