topic Turn the model... or not? in Modeling

Turn the model... or not?

PatriciaLe_o — Wed, 04 Oct 2006 16:07:25 GMT

I'm working on a model, oriented with the north up. Normal... and I already got used on working in it like that. But to put the plans drawings on the sheets I have to turn ir somehow. My question is: HOW!?
1 - should I turn the sheet master? (but this way the plan's texts would not turn)
2 - should I turn the drawing at the layout? (the texts wouldn't turn either)
3 - should I turn the whole model!? (this way I wold have to get used to the north pointing left!)

I know that I cannot think with my old Autocad mind, but I wanted something similar to the UCS rotation... I could work on modelspace with one orientation and make the viewports on paperspace with another orientation...

Is it possible?

Re: Turn the model... or not?

Anonymous — Wed, 04 Oct 2006 16:52:57 GMT

I prefer to work on the model in the orientation that it will appear on the sheet and reset the north arrow accordingly. In cases where this is not possible or where sections of the plan are rotated in the layouts it is possible to rotate the text accordingly. I think that there are ways to do this in the layout/drawing but it may also be necessary to rotate some elements in plan. Since I align the plan and layouts 99.9% of the time I rarely have to deal with this.

Re: Turn the model... or not?

PatriciaLe_o — Wed, 04 Oct 2006 17:17:56 GMT

Thanks for the super fast reply! But I guess that I'm in an odd situation. I think I'd resign to turn the model if it was only one model used in one terrain. But my case is: I have 10 house models that will fit in more than 300 terrains with irregular limits and of course, different sun orientations. So, if I keep the project the way I'd like to see on sheets, I'd have to turn every terrain and it´s seems a little "violent" to me. Any suggestion?

Re: Turn the model... or not?

Richard Morrison — Wed, 04 Oct 2006 19:28:30 GMT

It probably makes the most sense, then, to orient the models as orthogonally as possible to the sheet based on convenience, and have a separate file for each terrain, with the building model hotlinked into it.

Re: Turn the model... or not?

PatriciaLe_o — Wed, 04 Oct 2006 20:06:49 GMT

Richard wrote:
It probably makes the most sense, then, to orient the models as orthogonally as possible to the sheet based on convenience, and have a separate file for each terrain, with the building model hotlinked into it.

For sure I'll have one file per terrain (the whole terrain measures 200ha, so I think I'd need a NASA computer to work with it!). I think that the most sense would be insert the models in the terrains, as modules, keeping the terrain orientation BUT be able to show the plans orthogonally on sheets... I "just" don't know how I could do it in order to also keep the text orientation correct...

Re: Turn the model... or not?

Anonymous — Wed, 04 Oct 2006 20:54:00 GMT

Your situation is easily handled. I have done this many times.

The buildings are each modeled and documented in their own file orthagonal to the screen with the model and drawings at the same orientation. The various buildings are then hotlinked into the site model (or models) which are independently documented.

If you need some of the annotations to carry over from the building models they should still orient themselves properly (ie. not be upside-down) in the site plan. I usually carry minimal or no annotations from the building models into the site since it becomes redundant information and no one should be referring to a site plan to lay out partitions (or whatever) anyway.

Re: Turn the model... or not?

Richard Morrison — Wed, 04 Oct 2006 20:54:33 GMT

PatriciaLeão wrote:
I "just" don't know how I could do it in order to also keep the text orientation correct...

Easy. Archicad will do it for you. You have the option when hotlinking to have angled objects, including text orientation, fixed or automatically adjusted. There is a checkbox for this. Look for this in the hotlink dialog box.

Re: Turn the model... or not?

PatriciaLe_o — Wed, 04 Oct 2006 21:41:10 GMT

Thank you again Matthew and Richard for helping me!

Matthew wrote:

If you need some of the annotations to carry over from the building models they should still orient themselves properly (ie. not be upside-down) in the site plan. I usually carry minimal or no annotations from the building models into the site since it becomes redundant information and no one should be referring to a site plan to lay out partitions (or whatever) anyway.

My idea was to carry everything from a complete model (I mean a detail phase project) so there will be lots of information.

My problem is not how to insert the model, rotating and keeping the text right... I've already used the feature on Place Hotlink box that Richard just mentioned. The problem, I think, is making the texts look right at a rotated view plan drawing in a layout.

I think I must be having problems on explaining myself, and I'm sorry I don't have print shots to post, because I'm still planning how I'm going to manage this huge project (for me, at least!) while modelling the houses final versions.

Re: Turn the model... or not?

Brad Elliott — Fri, 06 Oct 2006 04:14:03 GMT

I think 1 & 2 from your original message will give you the exact same result. Which can give you some text issues.

I think that the best way to insure that the drawings show the way you want them to on paper is to orient them that way while working on them. Are they 10 completely different plans? What I have done when they are similar is have them all oriented the same way on the drawings and let the North arrow fall where it may. It breaks convention but I find the contractors can understand the drawings better when they are all oriented the same when they are looking at them.

Re: Turn the model... or not?

Djordje — Fri, 06 Oct 2006 10:56:56 GMT

Patricia,

Take a look at the Modules topic:

http://archicad-talk.graphisoft.com/viewtopic.php?t=12786

The message by Eric Batte, quoted by Link, addresses just your situation.

HTH,

Re: Turn the model... or not?

SeaGeoff — Fri, 06 Oct 2006 15:49:17 GMT

Patricia, you don't mention which ArchiCAD version you are using. Please make that part of your signature.

Anyway, another option is to annotate the layouts. This is much easier in ArchiCAD 10. Dimensions, S/E & Detail markers must be placed in model views, but notes and text labels can be added in layout, ensuring proper orientation if the drawing is rotated. Normally I would not recommend this practise as it requires an additional level or coordination but when a lot of view rotation is required it may be the easier solution.

I do think view rotation would be great addition to ArchiCAD.

Re: Turn the model... or not?

PatriciaLe_o — Sat, 07 Oct 2006 17:58:22 GMT

Thank you all for the precious help! You are really amazing guys! Sorry I didn't answer as fast as you, but I didn't work yesterday... So let's see...

Brad wrote:
Are they 10 completely different plans? What I have done when they are similar is have them all oriented the same way on the drawings and let the North arrow fall where it may.

Yes... They are 10 different models from different houses that make part of a real state enterprise or condominium (sorry but I don't know the exact word in english! ). So... I'd like to keep the terrains' orientations when modeling, but just show them orthogonally on layouts...

Djordje wrote:
Patricia,

Take a look at the Modules topic:

http://archicad-talk.graphisoft.com/viewtopic.php?t=12786

The message by Eric Batte, quoted by Link, addresses just your situation.

HTH,

GREAT!!! It seems like it will solve my problems! I'll try it monday at work and I'll tell you the results. I just looooove those workarounds! Oh and thanks for fixing my name on your post!

Geoff wrote:
Patricia, you don't mention which ArchiCAD version you are using. Please make that part of your signature.

Anyway, another option is to annotate the layouts. This is much easier in ArchiCAD 10. Dimensions, S/E & Detail markers must be placed in model views, but notes and text labels can be added in layout, ensuring proper orientation if the drawing is rotated. Normally I would not recommend this practise as it requires an additional level or coordination but when a lot of view rotation is required it may be the easier solution.

I do think view rotation would be great addition to ArchiCAD.

Sorry, I always forget to put the signature...
But putting the dimensions and texts on layout!? I hope Djordje's solution work, for my mental health! Doing all the same annotation in plans (3 at least) for each house (10) in each terrain (more than 300)!!!??? I have better plans for the next year! But thanks anyway... Maybe in another situations it can help. I agree with you... view rotation would be great.

Re: Turn the model... or not?

PatriciaLe_o — Thu, 12 Oct 2006 21:28:11 GMT

The Eric Batte workabout works really well, but unfortunately doesn't solve my problem. I think there's no other way to get what I want so I'll have to turn every terrain, so that the house models are oriented to fit well on pages... although I still have the hope that someone might know the solution.
Thanks again everybody for trying to help...