topic Re: Clean wall intersections in Modeling

Clean wall intersections

Anonymous — Fri, 27 Nov 2009 11:40:06 GMT

I'm trying to intersect multiple composite walls with different thicknesses made up of a single core and a plaster finish to both sides. I've tried every way i've remembered (priorities, reference lines, etc.) so that they can cleanly intersect to no success. The closest i ever came to it was as described in the image. Can anybody help me?
Thanks in advance.

Re: Clean wall intersections

Anonymous — Fri, 27 Nov 2009 12:42:49 GMT

Hi Gassis,

Welcome

This is a well known ArchiCAD's weak link.

In this situation I usually try to achieve the best 3d/2d (in this order) result and finally apply a patch/fragmento to the walls connection.

You could create a special polygonal wall for the junctions... but IMO and in this special situation I prefer the patch/fragment... which in this case could be mirrored.

HTH.

Re: Clean wall intersections

Anonymous — Fri, 27 Nov 2009 15:28:38 GMT

Hi Braza,

From what i see in your model, the only problem is that the inside plaster finish isn't continuous, showing both cores at the top of the thickest walls. That's the result i want to avoid, so that i can get a plaster finish without being interrupted by wall cores showing up.
As of patches, i've heard about them but don't know how to make them!
Thanks all the same.

Cheers

Re: Clean wall intersections

Erich — Fri, 27 Nov 2009 16:11:10 GMT

gassis,
I believe that you will need to modify your work environment to include the menu item that allows you to create a patch. Look for the command "Create Patch" and add it to your work environment. You then marquee an area, select the "Create Patch" command. This will automatically create a 2D GDL object which can automatically be placed in the correct position in your plan, elevation, etc. Then if you select the patch object and open it and go to the 2D symbol window you can modify the appearance of the patch to suit your needs using standard drawing tools. Save the modified patch and you are done.

Re: Clean wall intersections

Anonymous — Fri, 27 Nov 2009 20:15:29 GMT

You also might just find it already part of your work environment under:
Document > Document Extras > Create Patch

In attached image you can see I've added it to; My Tool Bar, (a custom tool bar I made), but it can be added other places as well.
lec

Re: Clean wall intersections

Laszlo Nagy — Mon, 30 Nov 2009 13:32:28 GMT

I tried this both in AC12 and AC13.
In AC12 it is buggy indeed.
But in AC13 it is working fine for me.
Core Intersection number is 12, plaster Intersection number is 8.
All Walls are set to Enable Skin Priorities.

Re: Clean wall intersections

Anonymous — Mon, 30 Nov 2009 15:30:39 GMT

Hi Laszlo,

laszlonagy wrote:
But in AC13 it is working fine for me.

That's good news!

How about the 3d view?

Re: Clean wall intersections

Laszlo Nagy — Mon, 30 Nov 2009 15:44:10 GMT

Unfortunately in 3D there is a vertical line both with the Internal 3D Engine and the OpenGL Engine.
That's strange, I thought that was working already.

Re: Clean wall intersections

Anonymous — Mon, 30 Nov 2009 15:55:48 GMT

Well... At least 2d is working now.

Thanks for the feedback.

Re: Clean wall intersections

Anonymous — Mon, 30 Nov 2009 18:46:00 GMT

Hi everyone,

First of all i want to thank you all for your help.
I've tried what Laszlo suggested and the result was a lot cleaner in 2d, although you can notice some interrupted lines as well as some that were not supposed to be there as shown in the attached image.
From what i understand the vertical lines that show up in the 3d window (they show in elevations as well!) are the result of the same little lines that are indicated in the plan.
As for 2d plan, as braza and erich said, this could be fixed by patching, but how can you solve this in 3d as well as elevations or sections?

Re: Clean wall intersections

Anonymous — Mon, 30 Nov 2009 19:21:33 GMT

Hi Gassis,

Patches only work in 2d/section/elevation views...

This problem is like a short blanket... if you cover the head, the feet get off and vice versa.

Thats why I first fix the 3d view and finally I apply a patch to cover all the mess in the 2d view.

HTH.

Re: Clean wall intersections

Laszlo Nagy — Tue, 01 Dec 2009 14:10:54 GMT

Found some curious things about this and continued to experiment.
What I found it that the Wall Priority number still has some role even when the Enable Skin Priorities checkbox is checked.
I always thought that when you check Enable Skin Priorities, then the Wall Priority number assigned to the Wall has no role to play. It looks like this is not the case.
Basically what I did now is I set the Wall Priority of the Left and Right thicker Walls to 8, and all other three Walls in the middle to 12.
This way it works both in AC12 and AC13 in 2D.

Re: Clean wall intersections

Karl Ottenstein — Tue, 01 Dec 2009 18:39:58 GMT

James Murray's mind-bending article here:

http://www.onland.info/archives/2009/11/composite_wall_priorities.php

may be of some help. 😉

Re: Clean wall intersections

Anonymous — Tue, 01 Dec 2009 22:26:04 GMT

I've already read James Murray's article (onland is always a good reference) and it makes it clear for a situation where a T intersection is made of two wall. My problems come up when i try to have a clean T intersection between three different wall where none has the same thickness as the other (the case in point is related to an intervention in an old preexisting building where no wall has the same thickness!), now imagine intersecting four wall in a cross (I also have this situation) where every single one is different from the other. As I've also learned, wall thickness also plays an important role in priorities.
It looks to me there's no way i can achieve a clean intersection in these particular cases. In plan, section or elevation i can always patch (thanks Braza and Erich!) but in 3d there's a bit of a headache concerning unwanted lines.

Re: Clean wall intersections

Laszlo Nagy — Wed, 02 Dec 2009 19:40:07 GMT

Please show the exact situation on a screen shot and we will see what can be done.

Re: Clean wall intersections

Anonymous — Thu, 03 Dec 2009 11:04:54 GMT

Hi Lazlo,

Here's the example of the previous situation (T intersections made up of 3 different wall thicknesses) with a cross intersection where none of the 4 walls has the same thickness.

Thanks

Re: Clean wall intersections

Anonymous — Thu, 03 Dec 2009 11:07:07 GMT

Here's the 3d view with the unwanted lines as i've previously said

Re: Clean wall intersections

Laszlo Nagy — Mon, 07 Dec 2009 00:23:51 GMT

Unfortunately I do not know a solution for the junction with the 4 Walls. You will have to draw over it will Lines/Fills or place a Patch.
Ditto for the 3D Lines.

Re: Clean wall intersections

Aussie John — Mon, 07 Dec 2009 03:51:57 GMT

Looks like a good place for a control joint

Re: Clean wall intersections

Rod Jurich — Mon, 07 Dec 2009 11:03:56 GMT

laszlonagy wrote:
Unfortunately I do not know a solution for the junction with the 4 Walls. You will have to draw over it will Lines/Fills or place a Patch.
Ditto for the 3D Lines.

Well not exactly. Seek here