topic Re: How to crash AC12 - Complex Profiles and Sketch Render in Modeling

How to crash AC12 - Complex Profiles and Sketch Render

Eduardo Rolon — Fri, 26 May 2023 12:47:07 GMT

I was teaching an AC class yesterday and managed to crash every single AC12 session, Mac and Win, 16 in total.

Procedure;

1. Open the attached mod file
2. Open the 3D window and select "save view and place on layout"
3. Open the view settings and change the 3D settings from "3D Window" to "Photo render…"
4. Update the placed view, it should be Sketch Render.
5. Switch to the 3D view
6. Open Complex Profiles and select the "00 crash" profile.
7. Still in the 3D window apply the profile to the 3 walls, it is the same as already applied.
8. Without deselecting the walls, switch to the Layout without going to the floor plan first either Exposé or clicking on the Navigator is ok.
9. CRASH
___
AFAIK it has to do with the curved profiled walls if they are straight sometimes it does not work.

Re: How to crash AC12 - Complex Profiles and Sketch Render

Karl Ottenstein — Thu, 21 Aug 2008 16:20:44 GMT

No problem here with your MOD, Eduardo.

So, the issue may be in your PLN file, something not included in the MOD. For example, the Sketch Render settings are not part of a MOD...I had the default render settings for the last file opened (standard US template - only used by me for bug reproduction), which was a LW render.

There was no profile 00 Crash in the mod file - the walls were assigned 'Custom'. I retreived the profile and saved it with a name, but it made no difference.

Perhaps you can reduce a PLN to the minimal file that reproduces the problem and post a zip of it?

Cheers,
Karl

Re: How to crash AC12 - Complex Profiles and Sketch Render

Eduardo Rolon — Thu, 21 Aug 2008 16:32:16 GMT

The pln is here.

http://homepage.mac.com/ejrolon/Shared_Proj/FileSharing34.html

Still crashing, in this file you don't have to place the view just open the 3d view apply the profile and switch to the layout.

Re: How to crash AC12 - Complex Profiles and Sketch Render

Dwight — Thu, 21 Aug 2008 16:45:21 GMT

Did it.
Works fine.
Sympathy.

Re: How to crash AC12 - Complex Profiles and Sketch Render

Eduardo Rolon — Thu, 21 Aug 2008 16:59:10 GMT

Ok, I tried again and did a screen cast of the crash. The movie is at the same link.

Re: How to crash AC12 - Complex Profiles and Sketch Render

Dwight — Thu, 21 Aug 2008 17:01:19 GMT

We believe you.

Re: How to crash AC12 - Complex Profiles and Sketch Render

Eduardo Rolon — Thu, 21 Aug 2008 19:38:45 GMT

Dwight wrote:
We believe you.

I know but can you duplicate?

Re: How to crash AC12 - Complex Profiles and Sketch Render

Karl Ottenstein — Thu, 21 Aug 2008 20:08:27 GMT

ejrolon wrote:
just open the 3d view apply the profile and switch to the layout.

Yes, crashed for me.

Tested further (as I'm sure you have!) - and if I again apply the profile in the 3D window, then open the view to see the Sketch Render and/or go to Drawing Manager to update the drawing, there is no problem. The crash is only when the drawing update is begun automatically by AC 12 from the layout sheet.

Have you submitted this to tech support, or do you want me to enter it?

Sorry,
Karl

Re: How to crash AC12 - Complex Profiles and Sketch Render

Eduardo Rolon — Thu, 21 Aug 2008 22:49:24 GMT

Karl,

You can submit it you have a more direct line and I am not clear to whom I have to email the info (except Bug reporter). I'll keep the files online for the next couple of days just in case.

Yep, it looks as if the auto update is the problem, but only if it is a curved custom profile.

Re: How to crash AC12 - Complex Profiles and Sketch Render

Karl Ottenstein — Thu, 21 Aug 2008 23:46:27 GMT

Submitted. 😉

I notice that both Eduardo and I are on MacTel OS 10.5

It would be interesting to hear (and save GS some time) if the crash happens on Windows too...?

Cheers,
Karl

Re: How to crash AC12 - Complex Profiles and Sketch Render

Eduardo Rolon — Thu, 21 Aug 2008 23:55:58 GMT

Karl,

I was teaching a AC class my macbook pro and 15 Dell's all crashing at the same time as my students dutifully followed my instruction to switch to the layout.

Re: How to crash AC12 - Complex Profiles and Sketch Render

Barbara Sommer — Tue, 26 Aug 2008 11:25:43 GMT

The crash is only reproducible on Mac, i have tested on 10.5 as well, thanks Karl for mentioning it. The crash happens as soon as the up-date of the drawing starts, we have started the investigation.

Re: How to crash AC12 - Complex Profiles and Sketch Render

Eduardo Rolon — Tue, 26 Aug 2008 12:46:05 GMT

Well Barbara I did manage to crash windows but the students were working with a file that was created on a Mac so that might be a difference.

On another note I have found another strange behavior with Complex Profiles and it works on both platforms.
Steps;
1. Capture a Profile
2. Edit the profile
3. Split the profile to assign different materials i.e., yellow paint on the base and red on top.
4. Click store profile keeping the fill settings as they were.
5. Watch as AC auto heals the fill consolidating the 2 separate fills.
6. in order to edit the materials again you will have to split the fill and reassign.

Re: How to crash AC12 - Complex Profiles and Sketch Render

Eduardo Rolon — Tue, 26 Aug 2008 12:46:52 GMT

step 03

Re: How to crash AC12 - Complex Profiles and Sketch Render

Eduardo Rolon — Tue, 26 Aug 2008 12:48:14 GMT

Step 04 and 05

Re: How to crash AC12 - Complex Profiles and Sketch Render

Eduardo Rolon — Tue, 26 Aug 2008 12:50:14 GMT

Feature or Bug?

You can still apply the profile to the object and it will apply the 2 materials without problems. The obvious workaround is to have 2 different fills but if it is a concrete wall with 2 different colors then the section will not look correct.

Re: How to crash AC12 - Complex Profiles and Sketch Render

TomWaltz — Tue, 26 Aug 2008 13:28:08 GMT

Another workaround would be to offset the edge by 1/128" to create a jog there

Re: How to crash AC12 - Complex Profiles and Sketch Render

Karl Ottenstein — Tue, 26 Aug 2008 14:43:44 GMT

TomWaltz wrote:
Another workaround would be to offset the edge by 1/128" to create a jog there

This should never be done IMHO This creates additional polygons.

Identical fills which touch will heal. The key is not to avoid touching...which would introduce more polygons and slow down the model... but to use different fills.

Eduardo, the behavior you have seen is normal AFAIK. After you split, you must assign a different fill to each piece. This is the same concept as wall-healing (e.g.). You may need to duplicate a fill so that it has the same appearance, but a different name (and index number).

Using this 'fill' technique, if you want a wood sill plate to have an 'X' through it, you split it into 4 parts diagonally and use two fills - one assigned to each opposite fill. A 'wall' or 'beam' created from the result will have only 6 polygons as it should. If you use the 'trick' of separating things by some tiny distance - which is harder to model anyway - then the result would have 20 polygons.

Cheers,
Karl

Re: How to crash AC12 - Complex Profiles and Sketch Render

Eduardo Rolon — Tue, 26 Aug 2008 15:27:01 GMT

Another draw it as it is built misunderstood, My logic was that it is a concrete wall with different finishes and changing the material would have changed the ID for the purpose of the CP.
The correct procedure would have been that different finishes are different fills than the concrete core.

Maybe I was just surprised that the Fills fixed themselves.

Re: How to crash AC12 - Complex Profiles and Sketch Render

TomWaltz — Tue, 26 Aug 2008 15:45:45 GMT

Karl wrote:
TomWaltz wrote:
Another workaround would be to offset the edge by 1/128" to create a jog there
This should never be done IMHO This creates additional polygons

It's a matter of priority. Do you want 2 less polygons or a rendering that looks right?

Adding 2 polygons to even 1000 walls would barely make a difference. One tree has more polys than that.