topic Re: New/custom composite walls ? in Modeling

New/custom composite walls ?

Anonymous — Sat, 23 Jan 2010 12:30:19 GMT

Hi,

I'm looking for any new(er) wall fills in Archicad. I've been researching and I'm not sure if you can actually make custom walls. When I mean custom, I mean 'greener' walls, or at least new technologies in wall structure.

Thank You

Re: New/custom composite walls ?

Anonymous — Sat, 23 Jan 2010 15:55:53 GMT

It is possible to make all sorts of new and custom fills, composites and profiles which may be used to represent pretty much whatever you want. I'm not quite sure what your question is. Do you not know how to create new wall types or is there a particular assembly you are trying to make?

Re: New/custom composite walls ?

Anonymous — Sat, 23 Jan 2010 16:04:14 GMT

Both. Wer'e not ' allowed' to use traditional walls i.e block, air space,insulation, block,plaster... I don't know how to make profiles either.

I think that a wood clad would be good for the outside of my design, but not too sure what to use as the wall structure.

Thank You

Re: New/custom composite walls ?

Anonymous — Sat, 23 Jan 2010 16:23:34 GMT

For the details of making new wall types I suggest you check out the manual. Composite walls are multiple skins (we don't call them layers to avoid confusion with the organizational layers) making up assemblys of uniform thickness. Profiled walls allow you to make assemblies of just about any cross section. These will be uniform along their length nso any discontinuous parts have to be added (or subtracted)

Re: New/custom composite walls ?

Anonymous — Sat, 23 Jan 2010 16:33:43 GMT

Ok, I will do that. I take it you can just change the wall, without actually drawing it again ?

I've got another basic question, the floor slabs have a weird render, why is that and what are the orange lines over the windows for ?

Thank you very much.

Re: New/custom composite walls ?

Anonymous — Sat, 23 Jan 2010 17:13:52 GMT

NStocks wrote:
I take it you can just change the wall, without actually drawing it again ?

Yes just select it and make changes in the Info Box or settings dialog.

I've got another basic question, the floor slabs have a weird render, why is that and what are the orange lines over the windows for ?

Those are graphic devices to show the opening/swing direction. They are mostly for elevations (which are special case 3D views). I have never undestood why any one would want them in perspective views. They can be turned off. This has changed with AC13 and I haven't time for the details.

Have you tried running the tutorial? It should cover a lot of your basic questions and save the good will of the folks around here for more troublesome problems.

Re: New/custom composite walls ?

Anonymous — Sun, 24 Jan 2010 21:31:20 GMT

The "weird" slab is most probably a wall or other object on the story below whose height happens to exactly match the top elevation of the slab. Try shortening the wall (or other object) by an inch or so.

Use the marquee, in its heavy line setting, to cut through the offending area, then hit F5 to see only this area in 3d, that should give you an idea as to what is going on.

"Wood clad" is pretty traditional, requiring studs, air cavities, insulation, etc. I think looking a little further out is what the teacher is after. Once you decide which part of "green" you are focusing on, the answer will follow.

Snap
PS Matthew is right, give the tutorials a go.

Re: New/custom composite walls ?

Anonymous — Sun, 24 Jan 2010 21:44:13 GMT

snapcrackle wrote:
The "weird" slab is most probably a wall or other object on the story below whose height happens to exactly match the top elevation of the slab. Try shortening the wall (or other object) by an inch or so.

Use the marquee, in its heavy line setting, to cut through the offending area, then hit F5 to see only this area in 3d, that should give you an idea as to what is going on.

"Wood clad" is pretty traditional, requiring studs, air cavities, insulation, etc. I think looking a little further out is what the teacher is after. Once you decide which part of "green" you are focusing on, the answer will follow.

Snap
PS Matthew is right, give the tutorials a go.

I understand exactly what you mean. The problem is that the University put too much work on students and there isn't enough time for us first year students to research things in detail ( most staff and student agree with that ). Like this project, we have 2 weeks to design it, make a model, draw it in CAD, explain why we want to use the materials we've chosen and show analytical data, on top of a assignment we have in another module.

I'm not at all moaning about it, I really enjoy learning and I know that Architecture requires a lot of effort and knowledge, but I'm learning. I've started to read a few books in the past weeks to boost my knowledge on construction, but most books cover construction methods and technology from the ' past ' . ( I also subscribe to ' Detail ' magazine which has a few newer technologies but their so new, they haven't been incorporated into domestic buildings which is what we design at the moment.

Thank you all for your help, I've learnt more from this forum than from my studio tutor !

Re: New/custom composite walls ?

Anonymous — Sun, 24 Jan 2010 23:20:16 GMT

Good luck! Enjoy the process.
Snap

Re: New/custom composite walls ?

Anonymous — Mon, 25 Jan 2010 17:47:10 GMT

Well, I've spoken to my Tutor and after all that, she said that I can use a timber frame structure. I questioned this because it's not at all a new technology or construction method, and she said that's ok because it's economical..

Now I just need to create a fill that represents timber frame wall. Could I also show the timber frame wall in 3d ( which in turn would create the plans etc. with the stud wall properties ). I'm guessing you could use the' Beam' tool and set all parameters to match wood?m but this is before I checked the manual...

Thank You

Re: New/custom composite walls ?

Anonymous — Mon, 25 Jan 2010 23:27:30 GMT

NStocks wrote:
Now I just need to create a fill that represents timber frame wall. Could I also show the timber frame wall in 3d

You should probably build the timber frame in 3D with the beam and column tools. Fancy joinery, chamfers and other details are a bit of a chore but you probably don't need them at this point anyway. Curved bracing can be accomplished with profiles. You could also do full bents with Trussmaker. It is a bit limited but quite easy and quick.

You might also want to check out Ralph Wessel's tools at:

www.encina.co.uk/

He has a great all around modeling tool called OBJECTiVE and a full on timber framing tool called FrameWright. I don't know his educational policies but they may be surprisingly generous.

Your talk of walls confused me a bit. It sounds like tour assignment is not to use walls at all but rather to use a frame with skins and partitions. In modern timber framing it is quite unusual to use exterior stud walls at all. The preferred method in my experience is to wrap the frame with exterior panels.

Re: New/custom composite walls ?

Anonymous — Tue, 26 Jan 2010 11:22:20 GMT

Matthew wrote:
NStocks wrote:
Now I just need to create a fill that represents timber frame wall. Could I also show the timber frame wall in 3d
You should probably build the timber frame in 3D with the beam and column tools. Fancy joinery, chamfers and other details are a bit of a chore but you probably don't need them at this point anyway. Curved bracing can be accomplished with profiles. You could also do full bents with Trussmaker. It is a bit limited but quite easy and quick.

You might also want to check out Ralph Wessel's tools at:

www.encina.co.uk/

He has a great all around modeling tool called OBJECTiVE and a full on timber framing tool called FrameWright. I don't know his educational policies but they may be surprisingly generous.

Your talk of walls confused me a bit. It sounds like tour assignment is not to use walls at all but rather to use a frame with skins and partitions. In modern timber framing it is quite unusual to use exterior stud walls at all. The preferred method in my experience is to wrap the frame with exterior panels.

Well the external walls are just like studs aren't they, where you have a exterior cladding for weatherproofing and aesthetics. Then you have the studs that actually hold everything together and for support, then insulation then plaster. I've not yet looked at timber frame construction but hopefully when I do, I can create it in CAD more accurately.

I've got OBECTiVE and I've used it before, it's a brilliant tool. I've just installed framewright, but it won't show the actual frame tool or the framing menu, I've referred to the ' read me' with framewright, but even if I follow those instructions it doesn't show up.

If I created a timbers frame, and then placed a custom curtain wall, would I need to manually re draw the timber frame so that there are no gaps or would they be automatically placed ?

Thank You

Thank You

Re: New/custom composite walls ?

Anonymous — Tue, 26 Jan 2010 18:54:06 GMT

NStocks wrote:
Well the external walls are just like studs aren't they...

In my experience here in the states the enclosure panels are typically sandwiches of insulation, lining and cladding. They may or may not have sticks in them which may or may not be the same dimensions as studs. In any case the panels are only structural in the same sense as sheathing is to a stick framed structure.

My main point is that timber framing is like heavy steel construction in that whatever "walls" there might be are not structural and so are not subject to the same constraints and construction methods as stick framed buildings.

Re: New/custom composite walls ?

Anonymous — Tue, 26 Jan 2010 19:30:02 GMT

Matthew wrote:
NStocks wrote:
Well the external walls are just like studs aren't they...
In my experience here in the states the enclosure panels are typically sandwiches of insulation, lining and cladding. They may or may not have sticks in them which may or may not be the same dimensions as studs. In any case the panels are only structural in the same sense as sheathing is to a stick framed structure.

My main point is that timber framing is like heavy steel construction in that whatever "walls" there might be are not structural and so are not subject to the same constraints and construction methods as stick framed buildings.

After reading a few books, for cross referencing, I'm going to make the wall studs ( if you call the external walls studs ) 100mm x 50mm, and insulate them with Kingspan, then add cladding and lining, followed by plaster as you mentioned.

I'm just going to use the " Beam " tool and " column " tool for this construction, I really only need to show the ' rough ' construction i.e no fancy corners are needed.

One other question: If I have all the walls built in colums then add a curtain wall ( my windows are very freeform), will I need to manucally re join all the joists with beams ? I'm also having problems with curtain walls and walls, I've used the SEO but no matter how I set it, the wall won't subtract from the curtain wall to create an opening.

Thank you so much for your help.

Re: New/custom composite walls ?

Anonymous — Thu, 28 Jan 2010 01:37:59 GMT

N,
Hm... I'd like to tell you to forget using the curtain wall tool at this point. Build your timbers piece by piece.
You already started by using individual columns and beams. Personally I find it easier to make custom
windows than to handle the curtain wall in what must be several conditions of either infill or true curtain wall
that passes outside of all structure. Under help you will find the Reference Guide, look under virtual building
for making custom or freeform windows.

You can model the timber frame as you suggest, AND use a wall also in the same plane. You'll want to make use
of the display order command available on the pet palette. Are you familiar with the "layer intersection group"rules and the
ability to modify them? If not, check it out, they will be most useful to you in this process.

I can't see reason why use of the curtain wall tool would force you to relocate your joists. BTW, AECBytes has a cool article
on how to use the curtain wall tool to represent all of the studs in your wall. I think their specific example was a deck boards,
but the concept is the same. http://www.aecbytes.com/tipsandtricks/2009/issue42-archicad.html

Snap