topic Re: showing walls as dashed lines on other stories in Modeling

showing walls as dashed lines on other stories

Anonymous — Tue, 02 Feb 2010 22:17:27 GMT

Is there a way to show walls as dashed lines on stories other than there home story? If so please tell me how.
I would like to show the walls as dashed lines on the framing and foundation plans. Currently I am drawing the walls on these stories with the pline tool. It would be great if there is a way to show the walls as dashed lines on other stories.
Thank you,
John

Re: showing walls as dashed lines on other stories

Anonymous — Sun, 07 Feb 2010 23:45:24 GMT

This is a situation I thought you'd get many opinions on....

I just use the magic wand to create polyline shapes in every room. Those polylines will be on a unique layer such as A-Wall-frmg or something.
It is fast and therefor no biggie to toss and redo if need be.

Then use layer mangement to create the correct view.

Of course, this is not pure VB. Sure would be nice if model view included a "Wall Options" in the construction elements.
For that matter I have always wondered why walls have such obvious limitations in the "Floor Plan Display".
To paraphrase Higgins, "Oh why can't a wall be more like a roof?".

Snap.

Re: showing walls as dashed lines on other stories

Erika Epstein — Mon, 08 Feb 2010 00:25:21 GMT

If your view cut plane settings is set to show higher than the floor of the story above, then the walls be shown dashed.

In the attached screen shot I arbitrarily picked 1', but an inch would have done as well.

HTH

Re: showing walls as dashed lines on other stories

Anonymous — Mon, 08 Feb 2010 01:55:43 GMT

Thanks Erika,

Nice technique.
I can get this to work in AC-12, but not in AC-13.
Suggestions?

Snap
PS In AC-12 I had to change the uncut lines to dashed,
they did not change automatically as per your example...
Perhaps I am missing some pre-condition?

Re: showing walls as dashed lines on other stories

Erika Epstein — Mon, 08 Feb 2010 02:16:34 GMT

Show on stories:All Relevant Stories
Floor Plan Display:Projected w/ Overhead

Outlines>Overhead Lines: select the dashed line of your heart's desire.

The other settings don't affect this ability to see the dashed lines of the walls above.

HTH

Re: showing walls as dashed lines on other stories

Anonymous — Mon, 08 Feb 2010 02:22:53 GMT

Ah, ... Thanks again.
Snap

Re: showing walls as dashed lines on other stories

Anonymous — Fri, 05 Nov 2010 20:44:10 GMT

Aloha Erika,
Thank you for the tip on the dashed line setting. For some reason I'm not quite able to get what I want.

What I have is a single floor residence. I need to show a Floor Plan, Site Plan, Foundation Plan, Floor Framing Plan, Roof Framing Plan and a Roof Plan.

Ideally what I would like is that the walls showed up on each plan as follows. I could use your help and guidance on how to achieve this.

Site Plan with the walls show as solid line outlines showing where the doors and window openings are without any door or window details.

Floor Plan with the walls, doors and windows shown as solid lines showing all of the door and window details and markers.

Foundation Plan, Floor Framing Plan and the Roof Plan showing dashed outlines of the walls with the openings and contours for the doors and windows.

Roof Framing showing dashed outlines of the walls with openings and without the contours for the doors and windows. I prefer not to show the contours for the doors and windows on the Roof Framing Plan so I can draw in the door and window headers.

Is it possible to get this as live projections of the modeled walls?

I have a work around for the Site Plan that is working for me. The thing I would really like to be able to do is to show structural plans with the walls as dashed lines and the doors and window openings as dashed lines. Can you tell me how to do this from the live version of the walls, doors and windows?

Thank you,
John

Re: showing walls as dashed lines on other stories

Anonymous — Sat, 06 Nov 2010 00:21:06 GMT

johncassel wrote:
Aloha Erika,
...
Ideally what I would like is that the walls showed up on each plan as follows. I could use your help and guidance on how to achieve this.

Site Plan with the walls show as solid line outlines showing where the doors and window openings are without any door or window details.

If all the Site information is placed on the same Story as the Said walls just set your Model View Options for Doors and Windows to "Show Opening Only" and check the "with Contours".

Floor Plan with the walls, doors and windows shown as solid lines showing all of the door and window details and markers.

Model View Options with Doors and Windows to "Show On Plans" and check the "with Markers".

Foundation Plan, Floor Framing Plan and the Roof Plan showing dashed outlines of the walls with the openings and contours for the doors and windows.

Foundation -On the Foundation story (usually one or two stories below story 1, depending if there is a Pony [build-up story]) I use a Complex Profile for the Stem and Footing and Like the Stem Solid and the Footing as Hidden Line. So I set the Floor Plan Cut Plan (FPCP) through the Stem Wall (Which does not always work well on a Sloped lot that has Foundation walls that may be 6 to 10 feet in elevation difference to the top of wall). Then set the walls Outlines > Uncut Lines to Hidden (or Dashed as you like)

Floor Framing - On the Foundation Story have the FPCP above your Foundation walls and again have the walls Outlines > Uncut Lines to Dashed

Roof Framing Framing - I don't know if I like any of my Dashed options here because the solutions involve having the FPCP Above the walls and I would prefer having the FPCP go through the Openings so that they are seen. So on the Story which containd teh main walls set the FPDP above tallest wall and in the Relative Floor Plan Range: Show Up to: 1 Story above (or Current story) but Offset by the Same distance as the previously set cut plan height oif current story. And again have the walls Outlines > Uncut Lines to Dashed

And for all these views set Model View Options for Doors and Windows to "Show Opening Only" and check the "with Contours".

Roof Framing showing dashed outlines of the walls with openings and without the contours for the doors and windows. I prefer not to show the contours for the doors and windows on the Roof Framing Plan so I can draw in the door and window headers.

Yes My above options do not allow for the Openings to be Shown. Maybe that is why it is a Problem.

So I would look into making a Composite wall with the Core Lines as Dashed (although maybe not good for other views) and set the Framing Plans to Partial Structure Display to Core only.

Is it possible to get this as live projections of the modeled walls?

I have a work around for the Site Plan that is working for me. The thing I would really like to be able to do is to show structural plans with the walls as dashed lines and the doors and window openings as dashed lines. Can you tell me how to do this from the live version of the walls, doors and windows?

I blew it with most of the above discription(but look at that word count) because the started Splaining before I have all the facts. I would look into the Dashed Composite core option

Thank you,
John

Re: showing walls as dashed lines on other stories

Anonymous — Sat, 06 Nov 2010 00:57:38 GMT

Aloha Jay,
Thank you for your response. I think that your solution does well to illustrate the problem.
Someone recently explained to me that the Graphisoft's focus is commercial/multi-story architecture rather than residential architecture. This explains a lot to me. It explains why it is so difficult to create the simple and very common set of plans that I've outlined above using ArchiCAD.
The set of plans that I outlined above should be a snap for the software that I use not an arcane ritual involving a complex array of settings. It is disappointing to realize that ArchiCAD has not been designed to easily do what I need it to do which is quick and easy modeling and drafting of relatively simple residential architecture. More often than not I have used ArchiCAD as a drafting tool which cannot easily deliver the live model views that I need it to do.

I would be happy to sit down or communicate with the ArchiCAD developers the simple features that are needed to easily create a simple set of architectural plans for residential architecture. I would imagine that there might be a pool of ArchiCAD user who would be willing to to do this. I think that it would a great for the developers to open up to this kind of informed input from the users.

Thanks for listening,
John

Re: showing walls as dashed lines on other stories

Brett Brown — Sat, 06 Nov 2010 10:43:00 GMT

johncassel wrote:
The set of plans that I outlined above should be a snap for the software that I use

It's called Revit Architecture

I would be happy to sit down or communicate with the ArchiCAD developers the simple features that are needed to easily create a simple set of architectural plans for residential architecture. I would imagine that there might be a pool of ArchiCAD user who would be willing to to do this. I think that it would a great for the developers to open up to this kind of informed input from the users.

It's called the Wishes section which you have rightly posted in, but the only problem is, 99% of them fall on deaf ears.

I assume you haven't upgraded because there has been nothing in the last 3 releases to warrant it for us residential users.

Do yourself a favour (if you have not already) and check out Revit. There are many Blogs out there that show a project from start to finish, you can judge for yourself if it is worth the change.

Re: showing walls as dashed lines on other stories

Eduardo Rolon — Sat, 06 Nov 2010 16:05:09 GMT

John,

Is this closer to what you want to do?

The recipe is to use "Layer Sets" and "MVOs" to control how you want to view the model and to create a fill with the pattern you need that is composed of white lines and transparent background. This fill will be overlayed on top of the drawing.

Re: showing walls as dashed lines on other stories

Anonymous — Sat, 06 Nov 2010 16:59:16 GMT

The only time I ever heard back from the developers was to be snidely told to upgrade so I could upgrade to a version that fixed the broken library part (pocket door v11).

I would like to say that I did later get an apology from the developer who posted the comment that I mentioned here. That was nice.

Re: showing walls as dashed lines on other stories

Anonymous — Sat, 06 Nov 2010 17:11:54 GMT

ejrolon wrote:
The recipe is to use "Layer Sets" and "MVOs" to control how you want to view the model and to create a fill with the pattern you need that is composed of white lines and transparent background. This fill will be overlayed on top of the drawing.

Ejrolon,
Yesterday Karl told me about the workaround using the fill overlay. He mentioned that other users use it. It doesn't work well for my work because of the variety of angles and organic shapes in my work. I'm sure that it works fine for square or rectilinear architecture.

So does Chief Architect.

Re: showing walls as dashed lines on other stories

Eduardo Rolon — Sat, 06 Nov 2010 17:40:55 GMT

Since you have already decided that it can not be done…

Re: showing walls as dashed lines on other stories

Eduardo Rolon — Sat, 06 Nov 2010 17:42:22 GMT

Solid Lines

Re: showing walls as dashed lines on other stories

Eduardo Rolon — Sat, 06 Nov 2010 17:43:40 GMT

Using Partial Structure Display.

Is this closer to what you want?

Re: showing walls as dashed lines on other stories

Anonymous — Sat, 06 Nov 2010 18:31:53 GMT

ejrolon wrote:
Using Partial Structure Display.

Is this closer to what you want?

Erjolon,
You are showing a work around that looks like it needs to be custom altered for each different wall condition. Thank you for sharing this workaround. Next time I have time I will experiment with it.

Would please tell me and the forum how many steps it takes for this solution from creating the object wall to having a working drawing?
How many different views and fill masks would you need to use for an entire set of working drawings with a complete set of structural plans?
I ask this because I am concerned with the time it takes to go from design to working drawing. I think that this is a concern for working architects everywhere.
When ArchiCAD was first shown to us by the local ArchiCAD rep back in version 6 the idea was that once the template was set up we would be able to go from the live model to working drawings. I like that idea. Each additional step that it takes to do this defines for me a problem in the software.
We can continue to create workarounds that solve deficiencies in the software. We can also try to communicate with the developers what we need the software to do.

Re: showing walls as dashed lines on other stories

Eduardo Rolon — Sat, 06 Nov 2010 20:37:25 GMT

It is a workaround, but to answer the questions.

Would please tell me and the forum how many steps it takes for this solution from creating the object wall to having a working drawing?

1. The only wall conditions that you have to create are for different walls widths i.e. 6", 8", 12" etc. It should take the same amount of time as it takes now provided you have predefined the wall widths the first time. For this example doing it for the first time it took my about 5 mins. Once you create your first one and you are happy with it the others should take less than a minute to do since you only have to alter one parameter.

How many different views and fill masks would you need to use for an entire set of working drawings with a complete set of structural plans?

2a. 1 View for the normal view, 1 View for structure. Or one view type for the architectural plans and one view for the structural plans.

2b. No fills or masks needed. I did not do any extra 2d work.

I ask this because I am concerned with the time…

3. It should take the same time as it takes now to define views for different consultants.

----
- Possible coordination problems that I foresee is defining how to do the annotations/dims, to core or to finish but that is basically it.

- Once you have created your basic wall composites you can reuse them in your projects, same with the views so the "template" will help you work faster.

- The only additional steps to be taken are the ones needed to create the template to your specific custom needs. Those steps will have to be done no matter the software you use. This does not imply that GS should not look at your request. In my case not being able to do this does not affect my practice so it is not high on my priority list.

- One final comment, it does not matter what software you use there will always be a need for workarounds and finding them will take time. IMO the steps needed to create a set of working drawings depends more on the user than the software. For some type of projects I can draw them faster by hand, for others SketchUp and Illustrator, for others AC and there are Revit users that are very fast at doing their working drawings. Therefore not all of those steps are the fault of the software more likely they are a lack of training in that specific software or lack of experience.

Re: showing walls as dashed lines on other stories

Anonymous — Sat, 06 Nov 2010 22:13:03 GMT

ejrolon wrote:
1. The only wall conditions that you have to create are for different walls widths i.e. 6", 8", 12" etc. It should take the same amount of time as it takes now provided you have predefined the wall widths the first time. For this example doing it for the first time it took my about 5 mins. Once you create your first one and you are happy with it the others should take less than a minute to do since you only have to alter one parameter.

2a. 1 View for the normal view, 1 View for structure. Or one view type for the architectural plans and one view for the structural plans.

2b. No fills or masks needed. I did not do any extra 2d work.

I may be misunderstanding your process. Here is what I thought that your process is:
1) Create a floor plans showing the doors and windows.
2) Create a custom view of the floor plan with the Model View Setting set to show the door and window openings.
3) In this view show the walls with only the outer lines of the wall composite showing. How do would this be done?
4a) Cover the walls in this view with a masking fill that has white blocking hashing to give the walls of the appearance of being dashed lines.
4b, c, d, e, f...) Draw this fill over every wall that has a unique orientation or curved line.
Maybe this is the step that I am misunderstanding. Please explain your process if is different.
If I am understanding this step correctly please give me more information about how you get the masking fill to cover curved and free-form shaped walls so the wall appears to have a uniform dashed line.
5) Model or hand draw the framing or foundation members and notations needed for the structural plans.
6) Create a layout for each structural plan. Foundation, First Floor Framing, Second Floor Framing, Lower Roof Framing, Upper Roof Framing and the Roof Plan.
This step is a step that I normally do to create a set of working drawings so it is not an extra step.
7) Place the wall view created in steps 1-4 on the layout.
8a) Place and register the structural view on the layout.
8b, c, d, e, f...) Repeat as needed to create live layouts of the Foundation, First Floor Framing, Second Floor Framing, Lower Roof Framing, Upper Roof Framing and Roof Plans.
9) Readjust the masking fills in step 4a, b, c, d, e... every time the wall layouts changes. I often need to adjust the wall and building layout when I am creating the structural drawings.
Good architects do this to make sure that the building makes sense structurally so I consider it a very important part of designing a building that makes sense to build.

I may be misunderstanding how the masking fill that you are describing works. Please let me know if I am misunderstanding your process and how the masking fill works.

Of course I could use the masking fill method. In the end it probably would be better to use this method than the method that I currently us which involves exploding the walls and placing them on the structural views as lines. With the masking fill method the wall lines remain live even if the masking fills are not.

It will take some time to train my drafts-people how to use the masking fill method do this. I hope that they are all reading this.

THANK YOU for taking the time to share this technique with me.

I hope that the developers are reading this and thinking of ways to improve the functionality of ArchiCAD so this workaround is not necessary.

BTW I started out as a pencil draftsman. For the most part I can hand draw one of the houses that I design just about as fast as it takes me in ArchiCAD. I have only had a pencil crash once and there has only been two upgrades in the 35 years that I have been drafting.

I enjoy hand drafting but these days I am busy with doing design and managing my design business.

If I am going to use CAD software in my firm the software needs EASILY produce working drawings from live modeled objects. I don't think that is too much to ask of ArchiCAD. That is what I was told it could do many years ago.

Re: showing walls as dashed lines on other stories

Eduardo Rolon — Sat, 06 Nov 2010 22:28:47 GMT

4a) Cover the walls in this view with a masking fill that has white blocking hashing to give the walls of the appearance of being dashed lines.
4b, c, d, e, f...) Draw this fill over every wall that has a unique orientation or curved line.
Maybe this is the step that I am misunderstanding. Please explain your process if is different.

This is the missing step all the others are ok. I am using a Composite to fake the dashed line (see image) and using "Partial Structure Display" to control the MVO between structure only and architecture. AFAIK "Partial Structure Display" is not available in AC11.