topic Re: Section / Elevation Markers & Renovation Filters in Documentation

Section / Elevation Markers & Renovation Filters

Gerald D Lock — Fri, 19 May 2023 13:34:09 GMT

I've run into an interesting problem:

I want to be able to show section/elevation markers on just the proposed floor plan, and separate markers on the existing conditions/demolition plan.

Before v.15 I used 3 layer suffix codes to denote renovation status (eg. Walls.demo / Walls.exist / Walls.new) for all model elements and had a similar system for markers (but just used .demo and .new) so it was an easy matter to switch on one or the other using layer combinations.

v.15 has seen a welcome reduction (almost 50%!) in the size of my layer set and the number of layer combinations required to control them, and I don't fancy going back to that old system just for the sake of a few markers.

Therefore:
Is there any way to control markers in v.15 using the Renovation Palette?

I'm guessing the answer is a flat "NO" as I've investigated the Info Box properties list (Options>Work Environment>Info Box) for every tool and discovered that ALL Markers, as well as the Drawing-, Figure-, Hotspot tools are all lacking the necessary "Tags and Categories" panel

Re: Section / Elevation Markers & Renovation Filters

Anonymous — Thu, 04 Oct 2012 02:43:13 GMT

Hi, I have the same problem. Did you find a solution?

Re: Section / Elevation Markers & Renovation Filters

Gerald D Lock — Sat, 06 Oct 2012 10:17:01 GMT

No solution - not even a reply!
I'm guessing that the veritable wall of silence from our beloved programmers/developers at Graphisoft is an indication that they have overlooked a critical hole in their treatment of markers, and are hoping to avoid it as they work hard on the 'next big thing' that the marketing team want to push for v.17 and beyond, instead of refining what Archicad already does & making it an awesome, competitor-kicking CAD application!

The silence from other users (except you) makes me wonder "are we the only ones who have this problem"?? I think not

...Or (more likely?) our issue has been lost in the sea of comments/problems/wishes that constitute this forum.
It's in dire need of a re-vamp. The format leaves a lot to be desired, but I can't say I've ever found a better set-up as far as support/user forum system & user interface design goes.

For a start, being able to include tags (from a standard list for a start, with ability to add custom tags if you can't find the one you need) would help in searches. Typing search words can be very (painfully) shotgun-like...

Re: Section / Elevation Markers & Renovation Filters

Laszlo Nagy — Mon, 08 Oct 2012 08:54:18 GMT

Yes, this is not possible, unfortunately. Markers do not have this Renovation Status parameter so they are displayed in all of them.
I agree that this would be a needed addition since you may want to show different Sections/Elevations etc. in a demolition plan than in a new construction plan.
So I think for now the old layer method remains ((eg. Markers.demo / Markers.exist / Markers.new). But probably these 3 layers will be enough for all your Section/Elevation/IE/Details/Worksheet Markers.

Re: Section / Elevation Markers & Renovation Filters

Anonymous — Wed, 10 Oct 2012 19:11:27 GMT

Unfortunately the different layers method does not work either, unless you forget about using the Renovation Filter and go back to the old different layer combinations for existing and new plans, and sometimes elevations. Surely the whole point of having the Renovation Filter is so you do not have to use the old different layer combinations. Not a problem with the sections and details etc, as they are usually New anyway.

Working on a project at the moment where we have this happening. We have existing and new plans, and existing and new elevations.

Because the existing plan and new plan are using the same layer combination, the markers show up on both. Sometimes this is okay but we only want the section and detail markers on the new plan for the current project. As all the sections and details relate only to the new plan, it is a pain having to remember to turn the marker layer off when publishing the existing plans and then turning it back on again to publish the new plans.

The markers need to have the Renovation Filter parameters added to them. Would make everything a lot easier.

This was reported on locally when we started using 15 and we thought might have been updated for 16, but no such luck.

Ian C

Re: Section / Elevation Markers & Renovation Filters

Laszlo Nagy — Wed, 10 Oct 2012 19:45:48 GMT

I don't understand why the layer method is not good for this.
You create two layers: "Marker. exist" and "Marker.new".
You create Section and Detail Markers on the "Marker.exist" layer and you use that in the "Existing" layer combination.
You create another set of Section and Detail Markers on the "Marker.new" layer and you use that in the "New" layer combination.
You create View Sets for the Existing state and the New state.
The "Existing" View set uses the "Existing" layer combination and the "Existing" Reno filter.
The "New" View set uses the "New" layer combination and the "New" Reno filter.
Then you can place these two View Sets on a different set of Layouts and you can publish them separetely.

Re: Section / Elevation Markers & Renovation Filters

Gerald D Lock — Wed, 10 Oct 2012 22:37:39 GMT

laszlonagy wrote:
I don't understand why...

I don't understand why Graphisoft continually ignores simple requests from it's users to fix problems with existing funtionality, and instead focuses overly on new 'wow' features.

Perhaps you're trying to win new users who might otherwise go to Revit, but you're risking loss of existing users anyway!

Tell us why this is so hard to fix, or just fix it. We're tired of hacking 'work-arounds' for things that should work better (& consistently) across all aspects of the software...

Re: Section / Elevation Markers & Renovation Filters

Anonymous — Wed, 10 Oct 2012 22:55:16 GMT

If you are going to create Layer Combinations for the "New" view and the "Existing" view then what is the point of using the Renovation filter.

Ian C

Re: Section / Elevation Markers & Renovation Filters

Laszlo Nagy — Thu, 11 Oct 2012 05:34:05 GMT

Gerald wrote:
laszlonagy wrote:
I don't understand why...
I don't understand why Graphisoft continually ignores simple requests from it's users to fix problems with existing funtionality, and instead focuses overly on new 'wow' features.

Perhaps you're trying to win new users who might otherwise go to Revit, but you're risking loss of existing users anyway!

Tell us why this is so hard to fix, or just fix it. We're tired of hacking 'work-arounds' for things that should work better (& consistently) across all aspects of the software...

We have a different viewpoint on this.
My viewpoint is that the situation at the moment is that the Renovation Filter does not work with Markers. That is a fact and it will not change overnight.
So let us find a solution.
I outlined a solution but Ian said that it does not work.
So I am asking why it does not work. Maybe I misunderstood or failed to consider something.
I fully get that this is not how it should be and I have forwarded this topic to Graphisoft, but at the moment we want to work and get things done.
I am trying to help Ian find a way to still get his job done.

I don't know maybe the way I worded my post came across as if I think you should not want Markers to have Reno Filters and be happy with how it is, whereas I actually think this would be a very useful feature.
I am not a native English speaker so always consider that that I might not know the subtleties of the English language.

So given the situation, is this solution not working for you, Ian?

Re: Section / Elevation Markers & Renovation Filters

Anonymous — Thu, 11 Oct 2012 06:17:11 GMT

Thanks for your replies. I am using a combination of renovation filters and layer combinations to get the job done. Not ideal, but at least the renovation filters means that there are less layers, and it's great that visibility of windows and doors can be controlled via the renovation filters.

Re: Section / Elevation Markers & Renovation Filters

Gerald D Lock — Wed, 17 Oct 2012 04:37:53 GMT

laszlonagy wrote:
I am not a native English speaker so always consider that that I might not know the subtleties of the English language.

Your command of English is great Laz. I appreciate your responses and thank you for passing this on to Graphisoft developers.
You've been very positive generally & the work-around definitely 'works'.

There has been no subtlety in my posts to this thread - quite the opposite. I felt I had to make such a fuss of this issue because it seemed the only way to get this noticed. The issue appeared to have joined the long line of other issues that have still not been dealt with by the developers, seemingly at the expense of developing new features.

I hope that this issue (and others like it) is resolved in v.17 (or perhaps a hotfix? is that possible?)

Thanks

Re: Section / Elevation Markers & Renovation Filters

Gerald D Lock — Mon, 28 Jul 2014 06:13:36 GMT

laszlonagy wrote:
I fully get that this is not how it should be and I have forwarded this topic to Graphisoft ... I actually think this would be a very useful feature.

Hi Laszlo

it's been 18 months since this issue was addressed. I've just looked through the release notes for v.18 and no mention of this being fixed.

Can you comment on what has happened to this?

Re: Section / Elevation Markers & Renovation Filters

Laszlo Nagy — Mon, 28 Jul 2014 10:08:31 GMT

Well, I am not a Graphisoft developer and neither do I have a say in what features get to be fixed or improved.
So all I could do at that point was forward these issues to Graphisoft.
They have a list that has thousands of feature requests and they need to find the priorities about what to address when and how.
Also, software companies rarely discuss future features. One reason is they don't want to let the competition know what they are up to, and also the nature of software development is such that a bug or unexpected circumstance may arise at any point which might make finishing a given feature impossible within a given time frame.

Re: Section / Elevation Markers & Renovation Filters

Anonymous — Wed, 04 Feb 2015 22:10:21 GMT

laszlonagy wrote:
They have a list that has thousands of feature requests and they need to find the priorities about what to address when and how.

They aren't "feature" requests; they are "fix your broken ass software" requests.

Re: Section / Elevation Markers & Renovation Filters

DennisG — Tue, 01 Sep 2015 02:27:27 GMT

For the record, I have also been struggling with this problem since the renovation filter concept was introduced a few years ago.

I'm kind of surprised I don't see more chatter about this issue here; either no one who produces construction drawings uses the renovation filter - using Demo and Proposed View sets - or there are few users of ArchiCAD who use it to produce CDs.

How are folks producing CDs - still using Demo/Proposed view sets, and only using Renovation Filter occasionally?

Thanks,

Dennis

Re: Section / Elevation Markers & Renovation Filters

Anonymous — Thu, 28 Apr 2016 20:03:02 GMT

Is this feature ever going to be fixed? We are a third of the way into 2016 and this 'fix' has been discussed since 2012??!!
It isn't so much that its a difficult work around, but that it diminishes the usability of renovation states if we have to go back and control markers with layer combinations.
Undoing renovation states to revert back to a layer based control is time consuming and cumbersome. This wouldn't be an issue if it were solved or removed or at least came with the caveat that "renovation layers will not be useful in creating construction drawings'. Why fall back on a layer management strategy reminiscent of AutoCad 20+ years ago?
I know there was discussion of a laundry list of software bugs and items to be fixed but this has been disused for 4 years! Come on. And the idea of Graphisoft not wanting to telegraph what it has in store for the next release seems dubious at best.

Re: Section / Elevation Markers & Renovation Filters

Anonymous — Fri, 10 Jun 2016 00:32:17 GMT

Hi Guys,

My colleague has raised this question today and obviously there is no fix yet.

We'll have to use layer combination plus renovation filter to make it work.

Re: Section / Elevation Markers & Renovation Filters

Anonymous — Thu, 15 Dec 2016 01:32:53 GMT

anyone have any news on the progress of this request ?

Re: Section / Elevation Markers & Renovation Filters

gotphish001 — Wed, 13 Nov 2019 19:52:46 GMT

News is it's 8 years later and it still isn't fixed. I'd be happier if they fixed the 1000 things like this that are just broken before they add a single new thing. It's great I can make fancy curtain walls now in 22 that maybe .001% of the industry uses. How about fix issues that 100% of the industry uses?

Re: Section / Elevation Markers & Renovation Filters

Anonymous — Thu, 19 Nov 2020 21:39:05 GMT

Made an account to comment. I've been using Archicad for less than 12 months and have run into numerous occasions where a feature like this doesn't exist, plenty of people on the forums requesting it on posts 3-9 years old; but no updates address the issue/s.