topic Re: Dimensions to profiled walls "jump" in Documentation

Dimensions to profiled walls "jump"

Anonymous — Mon, 22 May 2023 21:52:27 GMT

Hi All. I'm looking for help with an issue we're having. We model all our walls using complex profiles, with the stud space being the core and things like gyp. board, sheathing, and siding as finishes or other. On our floor plans, walls show "core only" and are dimensioned as such. However, if we are working in plan and then go to a 3D view and, say, rotate it, then go back to the plan view, the dimensions "jump" and now reference other parts of the profile that aren't cores. The fix is easy. We can select all the dimensions (one story at a time) and go into the selection settings and just hit OK and the dimensions go back to where they belong. However, if we forget to do this, we could pontentially send out drawings with incorrect dimensions. Has anyone encountered this? I have communicated with tech support and they have not had a solution. In my opinion, dimensions should never change without the user telling them to. I also checked projects done in AC22 and this problem doesn't occur. This glitch is huge for us and could lead to big problems in the field if we don't catch it. Converting all out walls to composites is just not an option. Any suggestions would be appreciated!

Re: Dimensions to profiled walls "jump"

Barry Kelly — Thu, 12 Mar 2020 01:51:06 GMT

Is your signature correct - AC15?
Or is it just old?

What version are you experiencing the problem in?

I don't have a solution but I am wondering if the plan is not showing the finishes and the 3D document is?
I know that in plan you have to add dimensions to each partial structure display.
I am wondering if somehow it is switching because the finishes were shown in 3D? (long shot).

Or if you are using 23, there are new settings in the way dimensions are done.
What settings do you have?

Barry.

Re: Dimensions to profiled walls "jump"

Barry Kelly — Thu, 12 Mar 2020 02:53:54 GMT

Chris wrote:
The fix is easy. We can select all the dimensions (one story at a time) and go into the selection settings and just hit OK and the dimensions go back to where they belong.

Just wondering if a Rebuild & Regenerate would work (CTRL+ALT+SHIFT+R).
Probably not but it is worth a try.

Barry.

Re: Dimensions to profiled walls "jump"

Anonymous — Sat, 14 Mar 2020 19:05:03 GMT

Hi Barry. Sorry. I have not posted in this forum in a long time (apparently since I was using AC15!)

The plan is not showing finishes or other. Core only. To be clear, the glitch occurs when I go from the plan to the 3D viewport, not a 3D Doc, alter it slightly (rotate the model, move something, etc.), and then go back to the plan view. I will check to see that my settings are correct and hope that is causing this, although it seems tech support would have caught something this simple before they sent it up to tier two for investigation. Thanks and I'll keep my fingers crossed! This is driving me nuts!

Re: Dimensions to profiled walls "jump"

Minh Nguyen — Mon, 16 Mar 2020 14:41:54 GMT

Hi Chris,

Thank you for sharing the issue and I am very sorry about the experience!

I checked our database and found your case recorded in our system. The screenshots were very similar, but the description from the case was slightly different.

It was mentioned that the dimension "jumped" to the incorrect position (from core reference points to finish reference points) when changing the wall type from Profile to another profile or Composite.

This was tested in ARCHICAD 23 and previous versions as well. What we found out was, this is a limitation of ARCHICAD. The dimensionable spots of a Profiled wall cannot be 1-1 matched with that of Composite wall, so there is no same way to retain logical dimensionable points. We are still working on how to improve this behavior.

I personally tested the issue myself (on both AC22 and AC23), however, even by selecting all the dimensions, open their Settings and click OK, it did not fix the wrong dimension spot.

What you mentioned here was different from what was investigated in our system. Unfortunately, I cannot replicate this issue. I'm wondering if you could make a small video recording how to reproduce this?

Thank you very much for your help, and I look forward to hearing from you!

Best regards,
Minh

Re: Dimensions to profiled walls "jump"

Anonymous — Mon, 16 Mar 2020 18:41:09 GMT

Again, it has nothing to do with changing from complex profile to composite. As you can see in the GIF file (too big to upload, link below) the dimensions start out in the proper location, as I entered them. Then I go to the 3D viewport and rotate the model a little. Then I go back to the floor plan and the dimensions have jumped to where the finishes would be if they were turned on. Then I use Find/Select to select all the dimensions, open the selection settings and do nothing other than hit OK. Then the dimensions jump back to the correct location. This is a huge impediment to our workflow and output in the case that we don't remember to "fix" the dimensions (one story at a time) before printing or saving to PDF. I am unable to replicate this same glitch in AC22 using the same file. Thank you for your help. If you still don't understand the issue, perhaps we can schedule a phone call. I really need to get this resolved!

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1C-Ok6fs_div6TcKFCBp-NF9CWabZGr4d/view?usp=sharing

Re: Dimensions to profiled walls "jump"

Minh Nguyen — Mon, 16 Mar 2020 21:31:14 GMT

Hi Chris,

I believe you’re using AC23 USA on Windows 10? Anyhow, thanks to the GIF, I managed to reproduce this on INT version as well.

After testing the file, I found out that, the floor plan view seems to inherit the Partial Structure Display from 3D view after switching from 3D to floor plan. To be honest, I can't figure out a simple way to fix this issue (however, doing Rebuild & Regenerate twice will move the dimensions back to the correct position, so you won't have to check each story one by one).

I'm wondering how did you create the dimension? By manually draw them one by one, or by using Automatic Dimensions?

I will forward this to the developers to see if it is possible to fix the dimensions in this file. Thank you very much for your help!

Best regards.
Minh

Re: Dimensions to profiled walls "jump"

Anonymous — Tue, 17 Mar 2020 00:46:23 GMT

Thanks, Minh. I typically draw my dimensions manually just because when I use automatic dimensioning I end up having to move a bunch of them around anyway. I use AC23 and Windows 10. I hope you can figure out a fix. The fact that this doesn't occur in AC22 gives me hope!

Re: Dimensions to profiled walls "jump"

Barry Kelly — Tue, 17 Mar 2020 01:52:09 GMT

Chris wrote:
Hi Barry. Sorry. I have not posted in this forum in a long time (apparently since I was using AC15!)

To be clear, the glitch occurs when I go from the plan to the 3D viewport, not a 3D Doc, alter it slightly (rotate the model, move something, etc.), and then go back to the plan view.

Yes sorry, when I said 3D document, I meant 3D view.
As Minh discovered as well, your plan is 'core only' but the 3D is 'entire model'.
When you go back to plan it for some reason the dimensions now show to the extent of the finishes.

They shouldn't of course and this is odd because each Partial Structure Display actually has it's own dimensions, so the finish dimensions shouldn't be showing at all on the core only display.

I am wondering if just switching to 'entire model' and then back to 'core only' in the plan view will be enough to reset the dimensions back to where they should be.

Otherwise switch the plan to 'entire model' before going to 3D and then switch it back to 'core' only when you return to plan view (of course this should not be necessary).

Or open a 3D view that is also 'core only' so the PSD is not changing (again this should not be necessary but may offer a work around).

Barry.

Re: Dimensions to profiled walls "jump"

Anonymous — Tue, 17 Mar 2020 12:31:46 GMT

Hey Barry. To answer your question, yes, I can correct the dimensions by going to entire model and then back to core only. That's probably the quickest solution for fixing them. Still, I feel like when I put a dimension in, it should always reference the points I wanted it to and only change if I move the model element I'm dimensioning. I have a million things to remember when I'm creating a set of construction docs. I don't want to have to remember to check whether the dimensions I entered have moved. We sent out a set of drawing once with incorrect dimensions which caused a bunch of problems in the field and made us look really bad. Anyway, I appreciate your help!

Re: Dimensions to profiled walls "jump"

Anonymous — Fri, 27 Mar 2020 14:18:46 GMT

Just checking in to see if Minh has had any success in finding a solution to this problem.

Re: Dimensions to profiled walls "jump"

Minh Nguyen — Fri, 27 Mar 2020 14:28:44 GMT

Hi Chris,

Sorry for the delay! I just reminded the responsible developer yesterday about it, but it seems like we will need a bit more time to find out what is going on here! The problem is that we cannot reproduce it on a brand new file, that’s why it takes more time than usual!

I’m very sorry for the inconvenience! If this is an urgent situation, please let me know so that I can escalate the issue further!

Thank you very much for your understanding! Have a nice weekend!

Best regards,
Minh

Re: Dimensions to profiled walls "jump"

Anonymous — Mon, 30 Mar 2020 21:36:45 GMT

Thanks, Minh! I wouldn't say it is urgent, but it is definitely something I'd like to see fixed sooner rather than later. I've advised my team to always check dimensions before sending out any drawings, but if anyone forgets even once, we'll have a big problem on our hands, including angry builders and clients if something gets built incorrectly and has to be torn down and rebuilt.

Re: Dimensions to profiled walls "jump"

Minh Nguyen — Mon, 30 Mar 2020 21:54:21 GMT

Hi Chris,

I just got in touch with the responsible developer for this case. We are still waiting for input from a couple of other people, it’s really a tough one! Hopefully we can have a definite answer by the end of this week!

Thank you very much for your response!

Best regards,
Minh

Re: Dimensions to profiled walls "jump"

Anonymous — Tue, 31 Mar 2020 15:11:32 GMT

I really appreciate your attention to this matter, Minh! The fact that your team thinks it's tough makes me feel a little better about not being able to solve it myself!

Re: Dimensions to profiled walls "jump"

Minh Nguyen — Thu, 02 Apr 2020 13:48:38 GMT

Hi Chris,

Thank you very much for your kind words! This is just a small thing I can do in order to make the product better, to help more people with their workflow!

We have finally got a conclusion to the issue. Unfortunately, the bad news is that, we could not find an easy workaround. If the issue keeps persisting, a possible workflow adjustment is to, maybe, keep the structure displays in sync between windows as long as possible when frequently switching away from the floorplan to a generic perspective 3D window.

The issue is related to anomalous dimension recalculation when switching to the 3D view, and the dimensions (wrongly) use the Partial Structure Display settings of the 3D window when recalculating.

The good news is that, we have registered this as a defect in our system! I hope that we will be able to find a solution in time for the next update releases!

I am very sorry that we cannot find an easy way to fix this issue on the current file. I would like to send my sincere apology to your team for the trouble that this is causing! Thank you very much for raising the issue!

I wish you all the best, and stay safe!

Best regards,
Minh

Re: Dimensions to profiled walls "jump"

Anonymous — Tue, 14 Apr 2020 19:01:26 GMT

Hi Minh,

I hadn't checked this forum for a while. Too bad you couldn't find a solution, but I do thank you for trying. I really hope this gets solved in the next update. I'm a huge ArchiCAD fan, but this one glitch is really troublesome. I'm amazed that no one else has ever reported experiencing this!

Re: Dimensions to profiled walls "jump"

Minh Nguyen — Tue, 14 Apr 2020 21:54:48 GMT

Hi Chris,

I hope you and your loved ones are safe and sound during these trying times!

Thank you for your understanding and for your enthusiasm! This glitch is definitely a rare one, as this is the only report we ever received about such behavior!

Once again, thank you for the report! Have a nice day!

Best regards,
Minh

Re: Dimensions to profiled walls "jump"

Andy Melaragno — Thu, 14 May 2020 21:14:50 GMT

I too just encountered this issue with one of my drawings. Please fix it! It is unsettling that these dimensions jump around like this on their own. I feel that I cannot trust my dimensions now.

Re: Dimensions to profiled walls "jump"

Anonymous — Wed, 17 Jun 2020 17:11:54 GMT

I'm relieved to see someone else is having the same issue. This must be fixed! I have to many things to keep track of to always have to be worried about my dimensions being wrong! If Minh is still following this thread, do you have any updates on a solution? It is the one nagging issue I'm having with ArchiCAD. This was an issue at one time in AC22, but at some point it was fixed.