topic Re: Keynotes in ArchiCAD...cmon!! Multiple drawings, one lay in Documentation

Keynotes in ArchiCAD...cmon!! Multiple drawings, one layout.

dcerezo — Tue, 30 May 2023 08:01:08 GMT

Ok, the keynotes in ArchiCAD are killing me. Having just come over from the Revit world, this is very frustrating so I'm reaching out to see how you guys handle this. This is what I did:

1. Created Section 1. Used Label tool to create Keynotes (just a number with a frame). Keynote 1, Keynote 2, etc. I created like 10 Keynotes.
2. Created Section 2. Created Keynotes 1, 2, 3, 4, and so on. Like 8 Keynotes.
3. Created Section 3. Created Keynotes, 1, 2, 3, and 4

Now, I put all three sections on one layout. Now it was time to type out all the keynotes in a keynote box for the sheet (excuse me, layout).

That's when it hit me. Each Section has a keynote 1, and a Keynote 2.

What am I supposed to do, go back to Section 2 and start with 11, 12, and 13 (where Section 1 left off?)

That can't be right?

How do you guys and gals deal with this?

Since migrating to Archicad several months ago, I really, really like it, but it has some insanely weak aspects to it that should be no brainers.

Anyway, sorry for the rant, just pulling my hair out.

Re: Keynotes in ArchiCAD...cmon!! Multiple drawings, one lay

Steve Jepson — Mon, 20 Feb 2017 06:00:12 GMT

https://www.screencast.com/t/xRyuuDKTF
Something like this.

Text or Numbers. https://www.screencast.com/t/H4RhAu3c5F

Also notice that the number or text of the keynote will reflect the order in which you selected them. https://www.screencast.com/t/NlbaBL12alK

There are other ways to control the sequence of the keynote numbers as well.
This is just one of the ways you may not have used yet.

You can use the syringe to pick up the properties of a keynote and start placing them more of them from that number or letter. https://www.screencast.com/t/0MRim64Qh

Also, there are several ways to manage keynotes. Have you tried using Labels, Schedules, AutoText...

I don't need have it now, but some people like to use Cadimage Keynotes.

https://vimeo.com/144794500

.

Re: Keynotes in ArchiCAD...cmon!! Multiple drawings, one lay

Laszlo Nagy — Mon, 20 Feb 2017 13:01:10 GMT

Well, the truth is that by default ARCHICAD does not have a Keynote feature that would provide the same functionality as the Revit Keynote feature. So these will just be workarounds.
Currently the CadImage Keynote Add-On (not free) provides keynoting functionality.
We hope that soon ARCHICAD will incorporate this needed functionality natively.

(By the way, as you continue to work in ARCHICAD, you will find Revit is also lacking in various aspects, but I guess that's just how it is: no single application is the perfect solution for everything.)

Re: Keynotes in ArchiCAD...cmon!! Multiple drawings, one lay

Eduardo Rolon — Mon, 20 Feb 2017 13:58:03 GMT

These are my 2 workarounds:

1.For simple projects use "JS Shape Tag" Object or the "Multileader Label" placed in an unused Floor Plan with Property Text added. You can define the KN Number and Text and then create a schedule for the legend. This is a "non-intellignet" procedure were you keep adding objects as keynotes are needed. The KN would be placed in the ID field for the object and the description in a text field that is added in the schedule or in a Custom Property for the object.

2. Option 2 is to create AC Properties for the project for Keynote Number and Description and use Labels to pull the number from the object. This is more intelligent (and ideal) because the property is attached to the object, the surface or the Building Material. With this option you could export to Excel and link the properties to those fields which can make life easier for adding the keynote text.

-----
As an experiment you could try to use Change Manager as a Keynote Manager. I have done this for simple projects were I know that I will not use CM to manage changes (Life Safety Documentation). This has the benefit that the "Keynote Legend" can be configured to only list the changes in that particular sheet

Re: Keynotes in ArchiCAD...cmon!! Multiple drawings, one lay

Richard Morrison — Mon, 20 Feb 2017 16:11:09 GMT

There is also the MasterScript keynote object: http://www.masterscript.nl/Total-Keynote

Haven't used this since I have the Cadimage one, but there are some nice features to it.

Re: Keynotes in ArchiCAD...cmon!! Multiple drawings, one lay

dcerezo — Mon, 20 Feb 2017 18:23:41 GMT

Thank you all so much for your responses. I have to go through them and go from there.

And I definitely hear you, there is no dream package, and I definitely am SO HAPPY I switched from Revit to AC for many reasons.

It's just small things that drive me nuts that I had assumed GS would have addressed. There are lots of things I miss from Revit in terms of functionality (shortcuts for any single command I want, Align tool (the way it works in Revit is nicer), and others), but these are small things.

The one thing that I will say about AC that I just don't get, but am learning to live with is Layers. I think it's such an antiquated way of handling the I in BIM, but that's ok, I can live with it. Just gotta get used to it.

Thanks everyone!!

Re: Keynotes in ArchiCAD...cmon!! Multiple drawings, one lay

Richard Morrison — Mon, 20 Feb 2017 19:13:18 GMT

dcerezo wrote:
There are lots of things I miss from Revit in terms of functionality (shortcuts for any single command I want, Align tool (the way it works in Revit is nicer), and others), but these are small things.

The one thing that I will say about AC that I just don't get, but am learning to live with is Layers. I think it's such an antiquated way of handling the I in BIM, but that's ok, I can live with it. Just gotta get used to it.

You can customize shortcuts for any command you want in the Work Environment. I don't know anything about Revit's Align tool, but AC's tool is not that bad, and don't forget that you have the "Adjust" tool. Also, you can add the Align tools to a toolbar.

I've never really understood what the big deal is about the absence of layers in Revit. Clearly, they are conceptually there, you just can't access them or see them. What's really the difference in selecting "walls" for a view vs. the "walls" layer? And since in AC you can use any object type (roofs, slabs, beams, morphs, meshes, etc.) and just call it a wall, seems like layers give you far more flexibility in the end.

Re: Keynotes in ArchiCAD...cmon!! Multiple drawings, one lay

dcerezo — Mon, 20 Feb 2017 19:45:58 GMT

Hi Richard,

In terms of shortcuts, you are correct! My bad. What I didn't see is that pesky "List" option was set to Current Menu. Many of the commands I was looking for were not listed. I changed it to alphabetical, and voila, there they were! So thanks for nudging me on that.

Now, if I could just use letter combos (again, like in Revit...sorry) that'd be great. For example, AL for Align, ZI for Increase Zoom, etc. I have to get creative now with Alt, Shift, and Command combos.

As for layers, and I know this could open up a can of worms, I just don't get it. Again, that's my handicap because I've been in Revit for so many years and new to ArchiCAD so consider it a knee jerk reaction. If I want to hide something in revit, I don't hide the layer, I just hide whatever it is I want to hide. It's a just a different way of thinking. Plus, you can hide just one thing, which as far as I can tell, you cannot do in AC at all. That helps as you're modeling if you want to hide some, but not all objects of a certain category.

I'm sure I'll be a layer fan after more time using AC, but right now, I just feel it's weird.

As for the Align tool, this is the best way I can sum it up.

Revit is better when you want to align 1 thing to another object.
AC is better when you want to align several things at once to another object.

I do the former 95% of the time. Rarely do I need to align multiple things at once. So I would prefer that ability over the latter.

Anyway, I don't want to start an AC vs Revit thing, as fun as it is, so I'll just reiterate, we're very happy with AC...we're just teething like a growing baby, and it hurts sometimes.

Thanks again!!

Re: Keynotes in ArchiCAD...cmon!! Multiple drawings, one lay

Eduardo Rolon — Mon, 20 Feb 2017 19:51:46 GMT

Just a thought but I never use Align for only one object that is what the Guidelines guide snaps and using Shift to constrain are for. This might also be "previous software muscle memory syndrome" 😉

Re: Keynotes in ArchiCAD...cmon!! Multiple drawings, one lay

Richard Morrison — Mon, 20 Feb 2017 20:14:47 GMT

dcerezo wrote:
Now, if I could just use letter combos (again, like in Revit...sorry) that'd be great. For example, AL for Align, ZI for Increase Zoom, etc. I have to get creative now with Alt, Shift, and Command combos.

I absolutely agree with this one! I don't know if it helps, but I have mapped the Command and Alt keys to my mouse, so that I can just use a single keyboard letter/number with my left hand. It's not the best, but tolerable.

dcerezo wrote:
As for layers, and I know this could open up a can of worms, I just don't get it. Again, that's my handicap because I've been in Revit for so many years and new to ArchiCAD so consider it a knee jerk reaction. If I want to hide something in revit, I don't hide the layer, I just hide whatever it is I want to hide. It's a just a different way of thinking. Plus, you can hide just one thing, which as far as I can tell, you cannot do in AC at all. That helps as you're modeling if you want to hide some, but not all objects of a certain category.

It's not a complete answer since it only works with entire layers, but the Quick Layers palette does help quite a bit. There is also a very inexpensive Add-on (http://simpleaddon.com/) that gives you very fast control over layers, to the point that switching an object to a hidden layer temporarily might feel almost the same.

dcerezo wrote:
As for the Align tool, this is the best way I can sum it up.

Revit is better when you want to align 1 thing to another object.
AC is better when you want to align several things at once to another object.

I do the former 95% of the time. Rarely do I need to align multiple things at once. So I would prefer that ability over the latter.

If it's aligning just one thing, then taking full advantage of Snap Guides and Guidelines is something that takes quite a bit of getting used to, but ultimately is VERY fast. (You can also adjust the speed at which they appear.) A good older tutorial (that I review from time to time) is here, although it's pre-snap guides/points, and may give you some ideas: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ausvYoKeMTk

Hopefully not telling you anything you already know, but we do want to create happy Revit to AC switchers.

Re: Keynotes in ArchiCAD...cmon!! Multiple drawings, one lay

dcerezo — Mon, 20 Feb 2017 20:41:36 GMT

I love Eduardo's term: previous software muscle memory. I definitely have that.

I'll check that simpleaddon.com site, thanks Richard!

And honestly, if all I'm bitching about is shortcuts and the Align tool that's pretty damn good.

I am a very happy ex-Revit dude overall.

Re: Keynotes in ArchiCAD...cmon!! Multiple drawings, one lay

vfrontiers — Tue, 08 Aug 2017 17:22:28 GMT

For Pete's sake...

Can Graphisoft just allow us to SCHEDULE LABELS????

Wouldn't that solve the keynoting issue?

a. Create a LABEL that displays a KEYNOTE
b. Part of the label is a Database query of MY OFFICE KEYNOTES
c. LABEL has two CALCULATED BOXES
- 1. Short Notes
- 2. Long Note
d. Schedule can then
- FIND ALL LABELS on a particular layer
- Show LABEL ID (keynote #) and Long or Short Note

This allows me to CHOOSE which items get notes (so I don't have to choose all OBJECTS for example, just the ones I want to note)

And allows me to notate different element types (walls, objects, meshes or even 2d elements)

Been asking for 20years for this functionality... How can this be a difficult thing???

C'mon!

BTW, yes I could essentially do this with an OBJECT, but I can't have that object associate with the element it's pointing to.

Re: Keynotes in ArchiCAD...cmon!! Multiple drawings, one layout.

Anonymous — Mon, 14 May 2018 03:17:49 GMT

I gotta say....

I'm evaluating a three seat license transfer from Chief Architect to Archicad because commercial tools are nonexistent over there. Maybe we'll do split platforms for commercial and residential. But one of my biggest gripes was no keynote manager in Chief. Now I've had some time to look at Archicad and I find out there is no integrated keynote tool? Holy crap. This $6000 program doesn't have that? I used Vectorworks back from it's Minicad 7 days up to Vectorworks 2013 and it had a pretty good keynote tool as long as I can remember.

And to tell me I have to pay Cadimage $30 a month, per license, for that extra tool???? After plunking down $6000? This is really discouraging.

I guess I have to give a possible switch back to Vectorworks a more serious look.

Re: Keynotes in ArchiCAD...cmon!! Multiple drawings, one layout.

Eduardo Rolon — Mon, 14 May 2018 11:33:09 GMT

Between Properties and Expressions you will have a pretty good Keynote Manager in AC22

Re: Keynotes in ArchiCAD...cmon!! Multiple drawings, one layout.

Richard Morrison — Mon, 14 May 2018 16:12:55 GMT

CARMELHILL wrote:

And to tell me I have to pay Cadimage $30 a month, per license, for that extra tool???? After plunking down $6000? This is really discouraging.

Ed,
If you read the whole thread, Eduardo has given you a realistic way to achieve keynotes with no additional expense using native AC tools, although might be little daunting for a beginner. I have also mentioned MasterScript's keynote tool: $100 EUR for a site-license. (http://www.masterscript.nl/Total-Keynote), which would be a one-time cost and would cover all three licenses (i.e. $33 EUR per license). The Cadimage tool is probably the most robust, though. With the subscription model, you can start and stop the licenses only as you need them. Once the keynotes are placed, they don't need a subscription to be read by anyone else. Another benefit is that you will also be getting another Cadimage tool with the Keynotes subscription. These can be very powerful once you learn them.

Re: Keynotes in ArchiCAD...cmon!! Multiple drawings, one lay

alemanda — Sat, 19 May 2018 06:27:23 GMT

vfrontiers wrote:
For Pete's sake...

Can Graphisoft just allow us to SCHEDULE LABELS????

Wouldn't that solve the keynoting issue?

a. Create a LABEL that displays a KEYNOTE
b. Part of the label is a Database query of MY OFFICE KEYNOTES
c. LABEL has two CALCULATED BOXES
- 1. Short Notes
- 2. Long Note
d. Schedule can then
- FIND ALL LABELS on a particular layer
- Show LABEL ID (keynote #) and Long or Short Note

This allows me to CHOOSE which items get notes (so I don't have to choose all OBJECTS for example, just the ones I want to note)

And allows me to notate different element types (walls, objects, meshes or even 2d elements)

Been asking for 20years for this functionality... How can this be a difficult thing???

C'mon!

BTW, yes I could essentially do this with an OBJECT, but I can't have that object associate with the element it's pointing to.

Vsfrontiers,
If you put your notes as property of the model element your requested feature is already out of the box, as Edoardo said previously.
You can define, as per your requested method, two properties. One is the short text, one is the longer one. You can scahedule and label whatever you want.

Re: Keynotes in ArchiCAD...cmon!! Multiple drawings, one layout.

Professor Pickle — Fri, 16 Aug 2019 23:33:33 GMT

CARMELHILL wrote:
Now I've had some time to look at Archicad and I find out there is no integrated keynote tool? Holy crap. This $6000 program doesn't have that?

I’m with you on that. It’s such an integral part of BIM it’s crazy that Archicad doesn’t have a built in solution. It’s not good enough to say “someone else does it”.

Now that 23 is out-ish with its focus on performance I think that 24 should focus on much needed functionality like key noting.

Re: Keynotes in ArchiCAD...cmon!! Multiple drawings, one layout.

Eduardo Rolon — Sat, 17 Aug 2019 13:51:16 GMT

Just for the record AC has that functionality.

AC22 (and 21, and we could make a case for 20, 19, down to possibly 10) has a Keynote tool they are called Labels.

In order to learn it you need to know also how to use Properties and Schedules. Which has the same difficulty as learning to "draw" Walls for which you need to learn how to use BMats, Layers and Pen Sets.

You might wish to change the name from Labels to Keynotes and for GS to hardwire a specific set of Properties into a predefined Schedule but OOTB we have an extremely flexible system that you can tailor to your workflow. It can be simpler and easier but those are the default wishes for every tool and program.
-----
Quick tip.
In AC you never schedule "graphics" or "labels or any 2D "dumb" object. You always schedule Properties. If the data is not applied to an object it does not exist. This is the correct way to do things.

Re: Keynotes in ArchiCAD...cmon!! Multiple drawings, one layout.

Anonymous — Sat, 17 Aug 2019 18:11:25 GMT

As an ex Revit user I was also frustrated and surprised at the lack of a dedicated keynote function. I have been using the Cadimage tool which works well (at a cost). One of the typical options of any keynote manager is to provide a keynote list filtered by the keynotes which actually occur in the views placed on a layout sheet. How can you achieve this filtering when placing a keynote schedule on a layout sheet when using properties to generate the schedule?

Re: Keynotes in ArchiCAD...cmon!! Multiple drawings, one layout.

Eduardo Rolon — Sat, 17 Aug 2019 18:23:29 GMT

Multiple options come to mind, but it will not work automatically on a Layout.
Either the schedule filters by floor plan or it filters by zone or both. Though I normally organize my Keynotes by Type and not by view which is easier when you have multiple types of drawings in one sheet. For example the Schedule placed in the Layout for restrooms would have as criteria "Related Zone Category = Restrooms". If the project is more complicated then I might add either "number" or "story" or whatever property that groups the items I need.

PS.
We are hitting "previous software muscle memory" items again.