topic Re: clean architectural plans using composites in Documentation

clean architectural plans using composites

alemanda — Fri, 26 May 2023 10:18:30 GMT

Hi to all,
I'd like to use the composites to have a more detailed plan.
At the same time, using the live model, I'd like to be able to switch from a very detailed plan to a very simple clean architectural plan.
I tried to to some test playing with model view options but I didn't get the expected result. In fact, even overriding the cut fills and turning off the skin separator lines, the result presents still skin separator lines.
Look at the attached pdf file.
Any (automatic) workaround?
Is it a bug? It seems that the code to write the GDL for 2D plan is incomplete (it does the job partially).
I tried the demo of AC17 but it is the same.
Thanks

Re: clean architectural plans using composites

Laszlo Nagy — Wed, 02 Oct 2013 09:39:50 GMT

I don't think it is a bug.

The situation here is that only Skin Separator Line are not displayed as per the Model View Options settings. That is done correctly by the program.
However, those lines you see are not skin separator lines as they do not separate the skins of the same composite. They are lines between two elements and separate the skin of one element from the skin of another element, which is per the above definition is not a Skin Separator Line so the Model View Option setting does not affect it. Those lines would disappear only if the two skins would have the same Building Material (or Cut Fill in previous versions).
And the reason it worked in case of the Generic Wall is because in that case the Building Materials of the two Walls were the same.
So I am afraid those lines will stay if the joining skins have different Building Materials.

Re: clean architectural plans using composites

alemanda — Wed, 02 Oct 2013 09:55:44 GMT

So the answer is that it is not possible to have a clean architectural plan using the composites?
I think this is first feature an archicad user expects using the composites.
Detailed plans (with composites) are really important but the client needs to see clean plans because he doesn't take care of insulation, bricks, etc. etc (at least at the first stages of the design).

With archicad 17 it is possible to produce clean architectural sections while it is not possible to produce clean architectural plans. VERY STRANGE.

I think that with very slight modifications to the code the generates the 2D floor plan this feature can be "enabled" even in AC16 or AC15.

Re: clean architectural plans using composites

Laszlo Nagy — Wed, 02 Oct 2013 11:03:07 GMT

You should create a wish for this.
Actually, I think this could be implemented as a new option in the Model View Options Dialog. It could be call "Show Structure Outlines Only" or something like that.
It could be a useful feature addition.

Re: clean architectural plans using composites

David Maudlin — Wed, 02 Oct 2013 13:03:16 GMT

alemanda:

You could try using the Renovation Filter Options: set the New Elements to Override, and in the Renovation Override Styles set the New Elements Fill Type, so all new elements are using the same fill.

David

Re: clean architectural plans using composites

alemanda — Thu, 03 Oct 2013 08:26:35 GMT

David,
It doesn't work. Your workaround is based on the same concept of modelview options. The problem is how AC generates the cutlines and skinseparator lines. I hope they fix this annoying issue even in the AC16. Actually with AC you can chose to have a detailed plan or (excluding) to have a simple clean plan. It's not possible to switch between them. very strange for the best architectural bim modeler ...
I suppose it is very simple to fix. It would be sufficient to consider all the wall with a simple structure (just a cut fill for all the elements) and not considering the composites nor skinseparator.
Would it be possible, programmers?

Re: clean architectural plans using composites

alemanda — Thu, 03 Oct 2013 09:26:01 GMT

laszlonagy wrote:
You should create a wish for this.
Actually, I think this could be implemented as a new option in the Model View Options Dialog. It could be call "Show Structure Outlines Only" or something like that.
It could be a useful feature addition.

YES!

Re: clean architectural plans using composites

alemanda — Fri, 04 Oct 2013 07:07:30 GMT

... I thought about the wish. It is really.
But at the same time I wondered what's the sens of the mentioned combination of options "override cut fill" + "hide skin separator". I expect it is exactly the same sense of the wished "show structure outline only", it should be like this ...
Anyway I create a new item in the wish-list. Let's hope in a prompt hotfix.

Re: clean architectural plans using composites

alemanda — Fri, 04 Oct 2013 07:19:57 GMT

alemanda wrote:
David,
.. The problem is how AC generates the cutlines and skinseparator lines...

and the problem is also the concept of "overriding". In fact actually AC overrides at the end of the generation of the plan view ... but it should override before generating the plan view (if I'm not worong AC 17 does it in this way in the sections' generations with override option enabled). In that case all the cut fills would be the same and the junctions would clean automatically (even with the existing code) ... it would be enough pass the "cutfill parameter" equal for all the elements before generation of the plan view ... in words it seems very simple to implement ... Reality is much more complicated for sure ...

Re: clean architectural plans using composites

alemanda — Fri, 11 Oct 2013 07:16:54 GMT

Nobody has my need to produce clean architectural plans using the composites?

Re: clean architectural plans using composites

Mario Sacco — Sun, 29 Dec 2013 09:48:01 GMT

alemanda wrote:
Nobody has my need to produce clean architectural plans using the composites?

Yes, I have the same problem.
I need to create two different documents pln to create an administrative drawing and working drawing. It's a lost of great amount of time.
It could be an option like: "Override composite wall setting for a scale above 50, otherwise override the basic wall setting". I mean contour pen, background pen, fill pen, fill symbol. In fact every wall already have different setting for composite and basic wall. You can switch from the different setting with a simple override in model view option.

It's could be really a very great enhancement.

Re: clean architectural plans using composites

Eduardo Rolon — Sun, 29 Dec 2013 13:44:39 GMT

+1
Meanwhile my work around has been to use three specific pens for the "interior" of the composite and control that thru Pen Sets, making then "White", "Gray" or "Black" as necessary based on scale of drawing or information.

Re: clean architectural plans using composites

alemanda — Sun, 29 Dec 2013 14:12:48 GMT

@ejrolon
This is a good workaround.

I think that the option already implemented should work as we expect overriding everything ... Simply it doesn't work as it should ...

Hope they fix it even for ac16

Re: clean architectural plans using composites

Karl Ottenstein — Sun, 29 Dec 2013 17:02:21 GMT

If you find this thread and wish to vote, Alemanda's wish for this simplified model view option ('Show structure outlines only') is here:

http://archicad-talk.graphisoft.com/viewtopic.php?t=43820