topic Re: Demolish only top layer of slab in Documentation

Demolish only top layer of slab

Zendrix — Mon, 13 Jan 2025 19:49:12 GMT

Hi!

My question is, in a renovation and to use properly the renovation filter, is it possible to demolish just the flooring of a slab (composite)?

Cheers,

Re: Demolish only top layer of slab

Guillermo1 — Fri, 10 Jan 2025 11:14:13 GMT

i think you need to create an independent skin for the demolish part of the slab

Re: Demolish only top layer of slab

CosminF — Fri, 10 Jan 2025 11:53:24 GMT

Or you can define the finish as finish (in composite) and then do a Partial structure display and make it show only the ”core”. I know it is not directly linked to the renovation filter but its a faster way to generate your desired view.

Re: Demolish only top layer of slab

Botonis — Fri, 10 Jan 2025 12:06:51 GMT

Or create a second composite slab without the demolished skin, in case this retains some modelling or BIM balance.

Re: Demolish only top layer of slab

Zendrix — Fri, 10 Jan 2025 13:01:49 GMT

I want to demolish the ceramic finish and place new wood floor. Assuming we only need to demolish the ceramic and not the concrete base above the slab, your advice is to create a slab without the finish and then create :

1. Tile floor layer (and check it as "demolition")

2. Wood floor layer (and check it as new construction)?

Would i have to use the "slab" tool to create those finishes?

Cheers,

Re: Demolish only top layer of slab

Botonis — Fri, 10 Jan 2025 13:27:01 GMT

Νο. Create the first slab with the the tiled floor. Check the slab as to be demolished.

Then a second slab with the wood floor. This slab will be the new construction.

Keep the concrete or any other layer in both slabs.

Just create two composites.

Re: Demolish only top layer of slab

vistasp — Fri, 10 Jan 2025 15:48:24 GMT

Yes, @Zendrix, keeping one structural slab with two finishes (one demo and one new) would be the best thing, IMHO. Creating two completely separate slabs (with their respective finishes) will mess with your scheduled quantities.

Re: Demolish only top layer of slab

Zendrix — Sun, 12 Jan 2025 11:36:40 GMT

exactly my thought regarding scheduled quantities!

Thanks for the input!

Re: Demolish only top layer of slab

Zendrix — Sun, 12 Jan 2025 11:38:45 GMT

the problem with that is that:

1. Ill have a yellow hatch representing demolishing original slab (which is misleading for scheduled quantities)

2. I'll have a red hatch representing a new built entire slab (which is also misleading for scheduled quantites)

Re: Demolish only top layer of slab

Botonis — Sun, 12 Jan 2025 14:04:50 GMT

This is the problem with components and complex profiles.

You cannot set a status per skin.......so you have to decide what is optimum in your case.

Re: Demolish only top layer of slab

Barry Kelly — Mon, 13 Jan 2025 00:44:17 GMT

That is why you model the finish slabs separately.

Then you can have control of just the part you want.

There is an old saying with Archicad - "Model it as it is built".

Works for most situations.

The structural slab is built separate to the floor finishes, so model them separately.

Barry.

Re: Demolish only top layer of slab

Zendrix — Mon, 13 Jan 2025 12:19:10 GMT

If the best approach is to model it as it is built, then composite walls or slabs are conceptually useless or against the workflow and should not exist, right?

Cheers,

Re: Demolish only top layer of slab

Barry Kelly — Mon, 13 Jan 2025 13:05:43 GMT

There is always the exception to the rule. 😉

Even with walls, if you want to renovate and change the external cladding, you need to model the skins separately.

Not so easy with walls because you need the doors and windows to cut each skin.

So you would replace the whole composite.

Which you can of course do with the slabs as well, but then you might have scheduling difficulties as mentioned.

If we could have doors and windows associate to multiple walls like openings can, that would be perfect.

Barry.

Re: Demolish only top layer of slab

vistasp — Mon, 13 Jan 2025 13:50:59 GMT

Not necessarily. For walls, composites that are complete in all respects, can be extremely useful. I have wall composites of different core thicknesses, with combinations of external and internal plaster finishes. Having these as discrete elements is a nightmare because, well, doors and windows.

For floors/slabs, on the other hand, I have always found it better to separate the structural part from the floor finish (with subfloor), because, for example, different rooms are likely to have different finishes, even if they have identical slabs. You will have to work what you are most comfortable with, and go with that system.

The "model it as you would build it" adage is an old one, but I still drill it into students because, as Barry said, it works for most situations.

Edit: Barry already answered this, but it bears repeating, I suppose. 😄

Re: Demolish only top layer of slab

Zendrix — Mon, 13 Jan 2025 14:06:19 GMT

Got it.

Makes sense to work slabs as the structural part separately cause of the reaosns you mentioned. Thanks guys.

Cheers,

Re: Demolish only top layer of slab

Botonis — Mon, 13 Jan 2025 16:45:10 GMT

When you seperate the skins that means that you have to create a composite for each skin

so you will be able to set if this is a core skin or finish or else. This is when you also want to activate the partial structure display

In my opinion the less the elements are the more control you have on the model.

It is always a choice of workflow.It is not a question of right or wrong.