BIMx Docs announced

[Laszlo Nagy]

You guys might want to check this out, I think it is a pretty cool development of BIMx.
It is called BIMx Docs and integrates 2D and 3D Viewing with hyperlinks:

http://www.graphisoft.com/info/news/press_releases/bimx_docs_ios.html

Also:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AiQmIQuJyMI

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_XnAkShOq7o

[Bricklyne Clarence]

Barry wrote:
I agree the fees should ideally be on the Archicad users side rather than the clients.
$5 is not a lot for the client compared to the cost of construction and of course the client only needs to pay if he wants to see the 2D docs in detail together with the 3D model.
But the one job may have more than one client, then there are the supervisors who would like this on site, and maybe even some tech savvy contractors, also consultants involved in the job and office staff who could find this beneficial.
And I am sure there are many more who would find the combining of 3D model and 2D docs useful.

I think it would be much better if we could license it at time of production.

Also Ben mentioned that "new versions of a project are 'upgraded' when they are imported into BIMx" but does this simply mean creating the file with exactly the same name when altering?
Does it have to be re-created on the same machine?
Does it only work for files down-loaded through the BIMx cloud server (is that the correct terminology)?
What if I want to copy directly through the iTunes software to an iPad?

Because we are now dealing with documents there are always going to be changes occurring and this is what concerns me most.
The multi-license purchase will obviously solve this but I would hate to be on the receiving end of a client who has purchased a single license only to have to purchase another due to a re-issue of the BIMx model.

Barry.

Bingo!!

And not just project revisions (of which typical projects have multiple - so that's extra charges each time you revise a project and re-issue); what happens when you have more than one design option for the site?
Does the client have to pay the additional $5 to download every option and scheme supposing you want them to compare each option against the others?

And then there's the fact that you more than likely have more than one consultant in each project, each for whom you would ideally issue a separate BIMx model with their specific 2D documents overlain for comparison and coordination purposes.
Or maybe you issue one model with all the documents all attached and then have to tell them each to pay to get this model and weed through to get to see their specific documents attached to the model.

I reiterate, I don't have a problem with the technology (which, obviously is fantastic) or the pipeline (although I have to see how it works on the Android/PC end to see how it makes sense ....or not, from this side of things) which is innovative.

I just don't see how you explain this process to a typical client and not come off as seemingly trying to nickel and dime them, as someone else put it, (even if the money is not going to you but rather to Graphisoft/Apple) and still hope to keep their business in good faith.

[Bricklyne Clarence]

Kristian wrote:
Bricklyne

I feel completely the opposite way on this!
We are going to roll it out to each of our site supervisors.
This is going to be an incredible tool and at $50 Aus it's well worth it.
If contractors want the bonus of docs, well we'll look at gifting them an itunes card.
We may even look at giving individual clients the same gift card deal.
I'd never ask a client to buy the full version it but as a tool for any consultant,
trade or anyone else involved in our building process $50 for a tool is an absolute minor expense.

We'll just have to agree to disagree.

And for the record, my gripe is not with the $50 that has to be paid on the Architect's side (of which i would even be willing to pay more of on the main ArchiCAD license if this technology filtered back into the program vis-a-vis navigating the model and consolidating how one works between ArchiCAD and BIMx).
The problem I (and others) highlighted is with making a client pay an extra cost (on top of the fees they're already paying you, or will pay you) to access this viewer/technology and even just having to explain the logic of why it's structured so, to them, in any way that makes sense.

Someone else claimed that if you do this and they decline to pay and are unable to see the sense in doing it this way (which, to be frank, most people wouldn't) and decide not see or use the BIMx Docs model, then "it's their loss".
Um.....don't you have that backwards?

It's ultimately your loss, since you are the party trying to make money out of this process (aside from GS and Apple).
They're simply getting a product (the design and construction) from you along with your services in delivering that product which could imply a unique experience that can ostensibly lead to more (or even better) business from them in the future. Not to mention more business from other clients or connections of theirs to whom they could extol your services.
They're still going to get drawings and design documents from you one way or the other.
What will be missed out on is the experience and unique process that you'll be in a position to provide, further highlighting your technological prowess, and in essence, that "value-added" to your service.

So how does one view it as "their loss" when ultimately you're the one losing an opportunity to sell yourself better to them in a way that you non-ArchiCAD using competitors are doing?

It's different with consultants who ultimately will still want to work with you in the future and want your business (since they gain just as much from you if not more) but even with them, the decision to take that extra cost will not be as compelling since a lot of consultants still work in 2D land and will not see the extra benefit or need for this extra function.
But losing them is not as critical as losing a client or the opportunity to convince a client of the advantage of accessing this technology this way.

Which is why i said I don't believe most Architects will object (greatly anyway) to the necessity to bear the cost of BIMx Docs (and all adjunct licensing costs) themselves in its totality - especially when you consider it's implications in advertising and selling your services, which, the whole process of making them paying extra for, is kind of counter-productive to.

And at the end of the day you end up advertising for Graphisoft even more (or as much) as you do for yourself with the BIMx DOCS models that your consultants show other Non-ArchicAD using architects, or other paying clients, that they end up working with down the road.

And if we, (or they, the consultants or clients) decline to dive in, for not wanting to deal with the costing issues, then isn't that a loss for everybody involved - Graphisoft included?

[Ben Cohen]

The overwhelming reaction around the office has been WOW!! And BIMx will soon be part of our standard workflow.

But the missing feature is markup. We currently use iPads onsite, and markup the project PDF's on these iPads and then sync them back to head office
To be able to markup the documentation side of the BIMx model and sync that back using the GS Cloud service would complete the package for us.
Hopefully this functionality is on the road map
(but for $50 - me no complain)

Love your work Graphisoft

[Barry Kelly]

Ben wrote:
The overwhelming reaction around the office has been WOW!! And BIMx will soon be part of our standard workflow.

Same reaction here.
Sure the Archicad users will be able to create the hyper docs but even they won't be able to see them unless that pay for the $50 app (that's US $).
It is pointless for in-office staff to pay the $5 per model fee.
So any one in the office that wants to see it has to pay up - unless they are all using the same Apple ID - and isn't that limited to the number of devices (I don't know a lot about that).

Ben wrote:
But the missing feature is markup. We currently use iPads onsite, and markup the project PDF's on these iPads and then sync them back to head office
To be able to markup the documentation side of the BIMx model and sync that back using the GS Cloud service would complete the package for us.
Hopefully this functionality is on the road map

It may well be on the road map but I bet that it will be another in-app purchase!

Barry.

[Anonymous]

I have to agree with Bricklyne Clarence.
I don't see how I could explain my customer that they have to pay extra to see it. It's like asking extra for a set of prints. Or imagine that you say - Hey I have a new renderings for you, but you have to go to Walgreens and pay $5 to pick them up.
And giving them Itunes/google gift cards is not a problem, it's the fact that they have to go through all the trouble. Just create a service where architect can create accounts and pay for them, while the owner just have to log in.
Technology is obviously great that is not the question here. It's the implementation.

[Anonymous]

+1

Love the technology. Hate the pricing model.

[vfrontiers]

Ok... Many issues arise from this... I've only cursorily read the end of this thread... so if my questions have already been answered (ready, fire, aim)... don't worry, I'll find them as I read back thru...

a)... Where's the $5 version? I went to the APP store on my iPad and only found the $49.99 version.

b)... And it is apparent that EACH of 20 or so subs / contractors will be spending the $50, right?

c)... And that the owner will be asked to spend it also... [and I agree, it's not about the $50.... it's about the awkward position (just like when a lawyer is making 10's of thousands on a contract and adds to the bill the .44 cents for a stamp to mail the bill to the client... .sorry, it's just awkward)...

d)... And the most awkward is having this big beautiful 27" iMac and have the entire technology NOT AVAILABLE to me.

BTW, please send a $1 thru paypal to my email for reading this post!

[vfrontiers]

Karl wrote:

Standard BIMx is still free; we're just talking about the new features in BIMx Docs. Certainly Graphisoft deserves some compensation for developing the app?

Sorry, but this whole idea of "joining the club" of ArchPLUS should handle this compensation, IMHO.

If I'm promising to pay $600/yr to help GS only covers a portion of the development?... seems wrong..

At the very least, I should be able to see my OWN BIMx Docs for QC...

[Karl Ottenstein]

vfrontiers wrote:
a)... Where's the $5 version? I went to the APP store on my iPad and only found the $49.99 version.

It's an in-app purchase from the updated-last-week free version.

As I suggested below, the App Store listings are too confusing IMHO because of this free-with-in-App-purchase vs the $50 unlimited version. Should be only one version IMHO, one with in-App purchase.

[Daniel Ferenc]

Hi everyone,

3D is free!
So it is when wrapped into a BIMx Hyper-model.
But the Hyper-model gives you even more:
From now on you can save more than just one model in your BIMx file.
So you can present different options, models with different level of details or special architectural details next to your main model from one single BIMx file.