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Revit 2012 Another horrible release

Anonymous
Not applicable
Man, it seems that Revit really doesn't want to compete with Archicad. I think many Revit users will switch now to AC.

http://autodesk-revit.blogspot.com/2011/03/autodesk-revit-architecture-2012.html
44 REPLIES 44

Anonymous
Not applicable
blobmeister wrote:
Man, it seems that Revit really doesn't want to compete with Archicad. I think many Revit users will switch now to AC.

http://autodesk-revit.blogspot.com/2011/03/autodesk-revit-architecture-2012.html
haha. You are joking right

Anonymous
Not applicable
3d tagging? Come on now, is that a feature we would be happy with? I hope Graphisoft doesn't spend time on this nonsense.

Anonymous
Not applicable
I like the new 'create assembly' tool. I could see it implemented in ArchiCAD a bit like the internal elevation tool but looking inwards with extra automatic top and underside views.

I've also noticed a rather childish and condescending blog post by a reseller on the bimboom blog saying how sad he is for ArchiCAD users and that we should 'give up the fight' now that R*vit 2012 has been released! Is it just me or is there still very little comment or reaction by R*vit users online yet, and the few that have commented so far (and aren't resellers) are mainly negative? So where are all these tweets and blog posts he mentions that we should be crying over?

I'm not sure many of the features announced would actually help the average residential architect who doesn't build bendy swoopy buildings i.e. 95% of all architects, so perhaps it's the majority of R*vit users who should be 'giving up the fight' and moving to ArchiCAD instead!

(Awaits the deluge of posts from R*vit users!! )

Anonymous
Not applicable
We're only a small practice and are going back to Archicad after being with Revit for a couple of years...really can't stand the interface, can't work in axo views, hate filling in endless spreadsheets they call dialogue boxes, all in all no emotional attachment...2012 version is so...well, so, so.The best comment I've read to date:

"If this is a real list of the most significant improvements... it looks like the description of some useful features of some witty plug-in.... why they do not work on the main part of the software....??!! I pay two subscriptions for this? Hopefully the real release will reserve us something more....

Now Graphisoft has a whole year jump on them...

Chadwick
Newcomer
Former ArchiCAD user and current Revit user here - I still lurk these forums from time to time. Just wanted to throw in an opinion here:

All of these features that any program tauts for a new release are the minor concern. What's more important, like it or not, is market share. This is what is going to drive widespread use of software. Why do you think AutoCAD was more widely used than ArchiCAD? Same for why Revit is more widely used now. I think it has less to do with the feature set of the software than we'd like to think...

Apple has been a master of this. My phone can do anything an iPhone can do and probably more, but most people don't care because most people SEE everyone else with an iPhone. You flood a market with your product or even images of your product and most people are likely going to gravitate towards it.

Another example is how Microsoft is winding down hardware production of the Zune MP3 player. I had a 120GB Zune for the longest time and liked it better than any iPod I had ever owned. I had an "enlightened" view in that I knew that the Zune was superior in some ways than the iPod and if the majority didn't know that then that was their loss. I 'knew better'. But now the Zune will be gone. So what good does that outlook do for you in the long run?
RA 2012 x64, Piranesi 6 Pro, Sketchup 8, Windows 7 Pro x64, Intel Core i7, 10GB RAM, ATI Radeon Mobile 5870

Dennis Lee
Contributor
MP3 players and CAD software platforms are two very different things to compare here.

For me, I chose AC 5 years ago, and have been enjoying the ride so far, and will be growing my practice for years to come with AC. What's really funny is that the MP3 player analogy kind of brings to mind Microsoft vs Apple competition, but not in the MP3 player market. All the main stream business people thought that PC was the way to go, Apple may be better but it just doesn't have the "market share". Look where we are now, even Autodesk is making their software for the Macs now.

I think people should stop looking over the fence and concentrate on learning their program of choice more in depth. They are both very competent programs, it comes down to how you like the interface, the work flow, and maybe preference of the corporate philosophy.
ArchiCAD 25 & 24 USA
Windows 10 x64
Since ArchiCAD 9

Chadwick
Newcomer
The main reason Autodesk cares to make software for Apple products now is because of their increase in market share.

And I do believe you need to keep tabs on other software in your industry. If you don't you could be left in the dark when your software of choice disappears. Look at what is happening to Piranesi and MicroGDS. I'm not saying they are going to be gone but their future looks very shaky.

That being said, keeping tabs on other software doesn't mean you have to unabashedly blast the competitor every chance you get.
RA 2012 x64, Piranesi 6 Pro, Sketchup 8, Windows 7 Pro x64, Intel Core i7, 10GB RAM, ATI Radeon Mobile 5870

Is it just me or does Revit Server and Revit WorkSharing look disturbingly similar (yet, oddly still archaic) to ArchiCAD's BIM server technology and Teamwork 2.0 - a 2 year old technology, by the way.

And I notice a lot of their other new features are also things that already exist in ArchiCAD or have been staples in ArchiCAD for years like better DWG production and control, 3D views and details (also known as 3D Documentation in ArchiCAD and also 2 years old.), the create parts feature also looks like another way of saying ArchiCAD's core/skin representation capability.

It would all seem to validate the assertion that Autodesk developers craft their development strategy by way of a copy of the latest version of ArchiCAD sitting on their desk and also by taking a look at GS wishlist forums.

I'll admit that there are some new features that would be nice to have in ArchiCAD (mostly the massing and modeling tools - but that's a whole other argument that GS have to resolve on their own), but from the looks of it and from the negativity of their users so far, it would seem like Autodesk have spent this release playing catch-up to Graphisoft and opened a wide door for GS to get through.

The question is, will they (GS) take the hint and the opportunity to go right through and take the initiative with AC15?

Anonymous
Not applicable
Dennis wrote:
MP3 players and CAD software platforms are two very different things to compare here.

I think people should stop looking over the fence and concentrate on learning their program of choice more in depth. They are both very competent programs, it comes down to how you like the interface, the work flow, and maybe preference of the corporate philosophy.
I totally agree, we started using Revit 'cause we thought that was the way to go, Autodesk marketing doing their thing!
In the end it wasn't for us. As architects, we think we are "visual" people and the Revit interface and the clunkiness of it was so distracting, and believe me we tried every combination of graphic cards imaginable!!
To my mind software to a designer needs to be "transparent". We think and design in perspective, and so use the program as the first schematic design tool, having dumped our drawing boards a decade ago!!

I to have an iphone but I've owned every other brand as well over the years! It is the only phone I never had to read the instruction book...its all to do with the interface.

Anonymous
Not applicable
For every software you will find a group of people switching to other software. Heck, I even switch from Apple to PC. So it's not only Revit users switching to AC.

As for Revit copying AC features: I think that is a wise move to do. If Archicad is strong in certain areas, why try to invent the wheel. It makes perfect sense.

At the same token, AC seems to go it's own way which is good. However, you do risk losing out on key features, for the sake of not wanting to have anything to do with Autodesk. There is the danger.

At the end of the day, while this release is horrible for the die-hard revit users, Revit now has features similar to teamwork, BIM server and many other archicad goodies , in combination with their own flagship features.

Laszlo Nagy
Community Admin
Community Admin
Revit Server is not like the Graphisoft BIM Server. They use very different methods of sharing model data in a team.
GS has created a white paper that compares these solutions

http://download.graphisoft.com/ftp/marketing/white_papers/GRAPHISOFT_White_Paper_Design_Sharing_in_B...
....................................................................................................
Laszlo Nagy, Lead Moderator, Community Admin
Get Archicad Tips at https://twitter.com/laszlonagy
AMD Ryzen 1700X CPU, 48 GB RAM, NVidia GTX 1060 6GB, 500 GB NVMe SSD
2x28" (2560x1440), WIN10 PRO ENG, AC20-AC25
Loving Archicad since 1995

laszlonagy wrote:
Revit Server is not like the Graphisoft BIM Server. They use very different methods of sharing model data in a team.
GS has created a white paper that compares these solutions

http://download.graphisoft.com/ftp/marketing/white_papers/GRAPHISOFT_White_Paper_Design_Sharing_in_B...

And I really do hope that Graphisoft actually puts better effort into publicizing that information as well as all the ways in which the BIM Server and Teamwork 2.0 is superior to the Revit methodology beyond just putting out a white paper and burying it deep in the bowels of their website.

While Revit users are busy erroneously celebrating their apparent assumption that Revit has caught up with ArchiCAD in this area that they've always lagged it, new prospective customers are also likely to believe the hype and actually believe that Revit Worksharing and Server technology is actually superior when in reality it's not even close..

Anonymous
Not applicable
Bricklyne wrote:
laszlonagy wrote:
Revit Server is not like the Graphisoft BIM Server. They use very different methods of sharing model data in a team.
GS has created a white paper that compares these solutions

http://download.graphisoft.com/ftp/marketing/white_papers/GRAPHISOFT_White_Paper_Design_Sharing_in_B...

And I really do hope that Graphisoft actually puts better effort into publicizing that information as well as all the ways in which the BIM Server and Teamwork 2.0 is superior to the Revit methodology beyond just putting out a white paper and burying it deep in the bowels of their website.

While Revit users are busy erroneously celebrating their apparent assumption that Revit has caught up with ArchiCAD in this area that they've always lagged it, new prospective customers are also likely to believe the hype and actually believe that Revit Worksharing and Server technology is actually superior when in reality it's not even close..
I don't think Revit users are celebrating anything at this moment. They don't care if AC I better in this area as long as they can collaborate. That is what counts.

Anonymous
Not applicable
Peter wrote:

I've also noticed a rather childish and condescending blog post by a reseller on the bimboom blog saying how sad he is for ArchiCAD users and that we should 'give up the fight' now that R*vit 2012 has been released!
AWWWW he responded in his blog... poor fellow... so upset at your comments.
Might have to send him a hanky

Anonymous
Not applicable
I am very excited about the imminent release of RAC2012. Horrible release is a bit, well, exactly what I would expect from an ArchiCAD forum.

There are some great new tools, some I have been waiting for.

Why is it that there is so much abuse about how far behind Revit is, when it is about half the age of ArchiCAD?

I think that there is a real fear that the new kid on the block may actually have some real tricks up its sleeve.

As for talk about Autodesk and their marketing monster... I have heard outright lies from the mouths of Graphisoft Officials when peddling their wears (yes it does).

Revit server is not a BIM server ripoff, it is an extension on its worksharing capacity that has been available to subscription customers for many months now. Anyone who suggests that Revits worksharing doesn't work well, hasn't looked at how it works and formulated a system accordingly.

As with all Software products there are likes and dislikes, bugs and miracles.....

Revit is great. ArchiCAD is great. Neither is 'Better' at everything. Both are 'Better' at some things. The main problem facing the dream of BIM (anyone who claims that a life-cycle BIM actually exists is a liar) is communication. As the Architect blames the constructor, and the site team blame the Architect. Software wars ensue because it is easier than making open collaboration work. Misinformation making one side look better is favoured over actually learning how both sides work, thus perpetuating ignorance in a field where people claim to be both intelligent and creative.

As a constructor, we use both ArchiCAD and Revit, because we have to deal with "Ours is better than yours" on a daily basis. Luckily there are some consultants who have managed to rise above the pettiness. This is the point of difference that will ensure that they have a seat in the next round. Time to wake up and start spending the energy wisely instead of encouraging generational biases based on our own shortcomings.

Phew, I think it may be time for a snooze...

Peace.

Rlcosta wrote:
Peter wrote:

I've also noticed a rather childish and condescending blog post by a reseller on the bimboom blog saying how sad he is for ArchiCAD users and that we should 'give up the fight' now that R*vit 2012 has been released!
AWWWW he responded in his blog... poor fellow... so upset at your comments.
Might have to send him a hanky

Who runs that blog?
A five year old?


I mean, who talks like that to other grown-up human beings?


It's hilarious watching him trying to back-pedal on his comments somewhat.

His first comment which as on a blog apparently comparing ArchiCAD to Revit 2012's new features and basically taunting AC users "to give up", and then when I guess he was subsequently challenged on the ludicrosity of that comparison given that there are a ton of areas where Revit lags behind ArchiCAD as a BIM solution (not to mention the not-too-enthusiastic responses of the Revit users underwhelmd by Revit 2012's new features and offerings), he then backtracks and claims that his comparison was actually not of ArchiCAD to Revit (which would actually make more sense since they are both singular programs doing the same thing in different ways) but rather that his comparison was between ArchiCAD and Autodesk's entire Building Design Suite - as if that makes any sense whatsoever.

So I guess his point is that Revit is just simply not remotely capable of competing with ArchiCAD on a one-on-one basis, so much so that in order for the comparison to be fair, he has to pit ArchiCAD against Autodesk's entire Building Design Suite which includes other programs like 3DS Max and the like which are not strictly AEC products.

That must make ArchiCAD one hell of a program (which it is) if that is what it takes to make a fair comparison with Autodesk products.
(Although, don't tell him that, because I don't think he realizes yet that this is exactly what he was saying.)

Anonymous
Not applicable
laszlonagy wrote:
Revit Server is not like the Graphisoft BIM Server. They use very different methods of sharing model data in a team.
GS has created a white paper that compares these solutions

http://download.graphisoft.com/ftp/marketing/white_papers/GRAPHISOFT_White_Paper_Design_Sharing_in_B...
I am glad that the term 'marketing' is in the link posted.

Eduardo Rolon
Moderator
BIMTIM wrote:
laszlonagy wrote:
Revit Server is not like the Graphisoft BIM Server. They use very different methods of sharing model data in a team.
GS has created a white paper that compares these solutions

http://download.graphisoft.com/ftp/marketing/white_papers/GRAPHISOFT_White_Paper_Design_Sharing_in_B...
I am glad that the term 'marketing' is in the link posted.
The point being?
eduardo rolón AIA NCARB
Another of the forum moderators.
Macbook Pro 2.4 i9 32GB ram
OS X 10.XX latest
AC25 US/INT -> AC08

Anonymous
Not applicable
That it is a marketing document, and therefore not particularly objective 😉

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