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Design forum

"Surface" tool or ability to rotate slab from horizontal?

boatingcow
Beginner
Hi there, every now and again I would like to place an object which is basically a slab, but in a plane other than horizontal (for example, a damp-proof membrane which follows both slab, wall and roof contours). I'd like to be able to list these objects and be able to group them together (as in the membrane example above) and derive surface areas or volumes as necessary.

I know I could use a morph, terrain or other object, but ideally I'd create the object just like a slab, so I would create the surface perimeter outline, then define its thickness. But it would be rotatable so it could exist in any plane - not just horizontal. I'd prefer not to use combinations of slabs, walls and roofs as they aren't listed together in schedules. Also wall and roof geometry creation methods are different - for example a wall at close to 0° has almost infinite width on the plan and always has the base and top of the wall parallel to horizontal. Similarly a roof at almost 90° has almost infinite height. So, a 'surface' tool (like a slab, but in any plane) would be very useful.

In addition, I wonder if there is a similar way to accomplish 'lines' (such as beads of intumescent mastic) so that the linear metre/volume can appear on the schedule?

The advantage of the 'surface' and 'linear' tool would be that schedules report the quantities in the amounts you'd expect for a particular building material (SMM7, NRM2). For example, we can already schedule brick walls in m2, and concrete slabs in m3. It would be great if I could get that damp-proof membrane which isn't necessarily part of a composite wall or slab, and get its quantities as thickness and m2.

Am I missing an existing tool/object? Does anyone have any work-arounds?

Thanks!
ArchiCAD 17 | InterPro | Intel i7-4790K | 32GB RAM | Nvidia Quadro K2200 4GB | Windows 10 Pro
11 REPLIES 11

Anonymous
Not applicable
The roof tool is the one you are looking for. Obviously you would like to 'rotate your slab' to a certain angle right? Well you can define that accurately using the roof tool. Just create a single geometry roof.

As for schedules, you can edit the fields and criteria as to make this roof appear with other elements (it should perhaps be on the same layer as the others).

boatingcow
Beginner
Sorry Alex, as I mentioned in the post, a roof wouldn't be the tool for the job as the construction geometry of a roof isn't on the same plane as any of its surfaces. Also it's only possible to rotate a roof about one axis.
ArchiCAD 17 | InterPro | Intel i7-4790K | 32GB RAM | Nvidia Quadro K2200 4GB | Windows 10 Pro

boatingcow:

You can look at the Morph Tool, copies can be rotated in the 3D or Section/Elevation windows, and the Volume and Surface Area can be scheduled. But its thickness cannot be as easily changed as a Slab or Wall.

David
David Maudlin / Architect

www.davidmaudlin.com

Digital Architecture

AC26 USA • iMac 27" 4.0GHz Quad-core i7 | 24 gb ram • MacBook Pro 2.8GHz | 16 gb ram • OSX10.15.7

boatingcow
Beginner
Hi David, thanks. Morphs are what I currently use, and as long as I don't mess with the corner nodes and keep the faces planar, I can push/pull the faces around to edit the 'perimeter' geometry and push/pull the thickness to suit. However, although I can query morphs and have them report areas and volumes, they aren't (as far as I'm aware) able to report thickness in the schedules as slabs do.
ArchiCAD 17 | InterPro | Intel i7-4790K | 32GB RAM | Nvidia Quadro K2200 4GB | Windows 10 Pro

Barry Kelly
Moderator
Why not create a complex profile wall or even a complex profile beam which can be inclined if you want.
Then it can be placed as one objects and your corners will mitre correctly and automatically.
The profile can be stretchy in height and/or width.
You can also schedule this as one item.
Barry.

One of the forum moderators.
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boatingcow
Beginner
Thanks for your suggestion Barry, however the wall and beam tools with complex profiles are limited in this context as noted above.

Just as the Morph tool is a great generic 'volume' tool, perhaps generic 'surface with thickness' and 'linear with cross section' tools would be useful additions? Should I create a wishlist poll?
ArchiCAD 17 | InterPro | Intel i7-4790K | 32GB RAM | Nvidia Quadro K2200 4GB | Windows 10 Pro

Barry Kelly
Moderator
Can you show an image of what you are creating?
Maybe people can come up with some more solutions.
Barry.

One of the forum moderators.
Versions 6.5 to 25
Dell XPS- i7-6700 @ 3.4Ghz, 16GB ram, GeForce GTX 960 (2GB), Windows 10
Dell Precision 3510 - i7 6820HQ @ 2.70GHz, 16GB RAM, AMD FirePro W5130M, Windows 10

Laszlo Nagy
Community Admin
Community Admin
The Morph Tool can be used just as well for creating a planar surface or a 3D polyline as it is for creating a general 3D volume.
Just use either of the first two Geometry Methods of the Morph, which create polygons and planar surfaces, respectively.
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boatingcow
Beginner
Thanks Laszlo, however ideally the surface should also have a thickness, so either the surface area & thickness, or just volume can be reported in the schedule. Similarly, the polyline should have a cross-section, so either length & section name or just volume can be reported in the schedule. I know the surface & thickness can be represented by slabs, walls and roofs, but the reasons above limit their use in my opinion.

As a simple example, the attached image shows the damp-proof membrane under a raft foundation for a garage (the pink bit). Ideally I want the quanity take-off to report thickness and m2 total for this membrane - so at the moment I'd have to use a combination of slabs, walls and roofs. It gets more difficult at corners, risers and unconventional constructions. How would the ArchiCAD community model the DPM to get that surface area in the schedule?

Thanks!
ArchiCAD 17 | InterPro | Intel i7-4790K | 32GB RAM | Nvidia Quadro K2200 4GB | Windows 10 Pro

Laszlo Nagy
Community Admin
Community Admin
I would consider creating a Profile for the portion of the membrane that is close to the edges, from its vertical part to its part where it turns from 45 angle to horizontal. I would use this profile with a Wall and run it along the edges. I would fill the remaining polygon in the middle with a Slab.
I would probably place these "Walls" into a separate layer with its own unique Layer Intersection Group Number so it does not accidentally joins other Walls.
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Anonymous
Not applicable
Could you use an extruded Shell perhaps? A shell has a uniform thickness over its surface and can have as many nodes in its cross section as necessary.

You will need to use several shells combined to form all the edges, but you should be able to extract accurate surface areas & volumes from them in the schedules.

Hope that helps.

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