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Zermatt [and in 2009: Virtual Building Explorer]

Anonymous
Not applicable
Has anybody heard some news about the zermatt engine? We know it sort of stopped beeing developed any further but any idea if there is still a future for this product?

Thanks Carsten
142 REPLIES 142

Thomas Holm
Booster
Dead. Check http://www.zermatt.se/ :

"ANNOUNCEMENT
Zermatt is no longer supported or maintained
Due to our inability to properly maintain the software and provide service to customers, it has been decided that Zermatt will no longer be developed, maintained or supported. Current license owners will still be able to activate and use the current versions of their product via the reqistration dialog."
AC4.1-AC24SWE-25INT; OSX11.5; MP5,1+MBP16,1

Anonymous
Not applicable
Surely this is an opportunity for graphisoft to step in and buy the rights to the software. This would be an amazing feature to have fully integrated into AC.

At the moment the openGL preview, although great for editing, isn't quite good enough for presentation to clients.

Lighting, shadows and collision detection are all features that are fundamental to providing a 'realistic' experience of a virtual space. Look at the most basic of first-person-shooters from 10 years ago. Even they provided a significantly more immersive experience than we have at the moment, on hardware that a modern mobile phone would put to shame.

Personally I think keep the openGL mode as it is. It is more than fast and fluid enough for editing and constructing the model. I would prefer to launch the 'realistic' preview on special occasions only as the lighting and shadows would take several minutes to calculate on a complex model (although considerably faster than rendering an animation).

The inclusion of these features in AC would be be a massive selling point over the competition. Graphisoft need to do something brave and exciting to entice people and get noticed.

We definitely need to lobby graphisoft to do this.

Anonymous
Not applicable
I totally agree, as a zermatt license holder it is sad that it has been discontinued. Such a fantastic product - though the support was never there and bugs in v10 never got fixed (accessoriess bug).
But GS should snap this product up and integrate it with ArchiCAD. Having a walkthrough model that can be emailed, time limited, radiosity enabled etc etc has been terrific.
If zermatt had a more realistic price (like 200eu), every ArchiCAD user would of purchased.
Plus the other (Dark) side has nothing like it

Anonymous
Not applicable
There is alot of things that could have been done better than it was in Zermatt. So it is better to create a new product instead of working with the original code of Zermatt.

Anonymous
Not applicable
Archi-Guy wrote:
Having a walkthrough model that can be emailed, time limited, radiosity enabled etc etc has been terrific.
Talking about good quality interactive web 3D walkthrough that can be emailed etc., anybody tried Vitruvian Studio ?

Anonymous
Not applicable
TurboGlider wrote:
There is alot of things that could have been done better than it was in Zermatt. So it is better to create a new product instead of working with the original code of Zermatt.
Like what? The interface was criptic but on a whole it was a great product

Anonymous
Not applicable
I don't say it wasn't a great product, sure it was, I like it alot.

What I said was that there is too much that could be done better so I think it's better to make a new software instead of work with todays Zermatt.

Anonymous
Not applicable
thanks guys for the feed back, unfourtunatley nothing new for me. I totaly agree that graphisoft should implement this. This would give ArchiCAD another edge to Revit. We tried other software like this and it is hard to find. Most of them are to expensive and to hard to use.

No need for a new code either, we exported a 30MB 3D ArchiCAD file ( only 3D parts no, lines, sections etc.) in 8 min, settings automatic in Zermatt just awesome. The Zermatt.exe file was 24MB and the great thing is no need for any plug ins to download for the client it just works.

Let's hope someone picks up this great software.

Cheers Carsten

Anonymous
Not applicable
Carstene wrote:
The Zermatt.exe file was 24MB and the great thing is no need for any plug ins to download for the client it just works.
It is much better to get an optimized/compressed VRML file of 1 MB from the same ArchiCAD 3D file if the client only needs to download a 1,5 Mb freeware plug-in that works on standard computer with standard video-card.

Anonymous
Not applicable
Clients HATE do download any plug in, also the quality of an vrml file is very poor and way to slow for big models. ( even very large models in Zermatt are fast to walk through, just like a good video game! )

Another thing is after you open the Zermatt.exe file you have a lot of options within the software, turn on shadow, radiosity light, layers on off collision detection,etc. So you can't really compare this at all to vrml.

Anonymous
Not applicable
I would not be so drastic about VRML . Exits poor vrml and exists good quality vrml (for example Archicad VRML optimized with Vitruvian Studio).
In my opinion the advantages of VRML are: very short size, great interactivity (possibility to use editors to modify textures and furniture in front of the customer in realtime ) much more comfortable way of real time navigation (speed control, mouse navigation, terrain following, collision detection, gravity etc... ) , possibilty to put links to other 3D scenes, web pages, documents , images, videos, etc ..., possibility not only to e-mail 3D files , but to let navigate it online, because VRML is the standard (open source ) for WEB 3D.
I tried Zermatt engine , it is not bad , but I hate to use two hands (mouse and keyboard) to navigate the 3D file. Moreover their prices are out of market.

Thomas Holm
Booster
What's the difference between Zermatt and Vitruvian Studio?
http://www.vitruvian-studio.com/
This one is 199 Euro. Did Zermatt do anything VS can't?
AC4.1-AC24SWE-25INT; OSX11.5; MP5,1+MBP16,1

Anonymous
Not applicable
I am sure there are advantages to use vrml with the right project as long as it is a small project. Just saved out an vrml file from ArchiCAD, same project as I was talking about above, 44 MB! Belive me this file is not usable, where as Zermatt thinks it is a pice of cake using large ArchiCAD files.

Yes Zermatt should have been more around 300-400 Dollars.

Anonymous
Not applicable
Carstene wrote:
I....I was talking about above, 44 MB! Belive me this file is not usable....
Yes You are right, the VRML created by ArchiCAD and other CADs is too large and not usable (I think everybody knows it). Vitruvian Studio was born to solve this problem.
If you simply "open and save" your 44 MB file with Vitruvian Studio you get a vrml file of 2BM and you can walk through it without problem (even online).
With VS I usually optimize and edit ArchicAD 3D files up to 150-200 MB without problems.
There are many tools to optimize vrml from CAD, Vitruvian Studio is the only one designed specifically on the basis of the characteristics of ArchiCAD.

Giovanni Dragone
Vitruvian Studio Staff
www.vitruvian-studio.com

Anonymous
Not applicable
sounds good, as soon as I have some time on my hands I will try this out, thanks.

Anonymous
Not applicable
I realy like this product! And I hope they didn't realy stop development.

Is there any alternative beside Vitruvian studio, anything that could create executable file?

Paul King
Advocate
Thomas wrote:
What's the difference between Zermatt and Vitruvian Studio?
http://www.vitruvian-studio.com/
This one is 199 Euro. Did Zermatt do anything VS can't?
Vitruvian Studio seems potentially useful VRML tool especially in terms of file size minimisation, but unfortunately VRML as a format cannot compare at all with the user experience that Zermatt offered:

Zermatt navigation involved great visual atmosphere with sun flare & misty infinite sky, radiosity-like lighting effects, shadows, different rendering modes, simultaneous plan & 3D view etc, as well a a vastly superior walk through mode where collision detection actually WORKS, (unlike VRML) - so your viewpoint rises as you walk up hills or steps etc., and where doors are automatically recognised as openings. Also nice features like motion bob & multi "player" networking - where two users could interact inside same model etc.

The navigation controls for Zermatt were far more intuitive & easy to use as well as it used classic 3D shooter key bindings.

Basically Zermatt focussed on creating a great walk through experience unlike VRML which is a much older technology & non architectural in focus, and uses the lowest common denominator of graphic technology - basically well below most users quality expectations when marketing & presentation of your ideas is so important.

A real shame that it disappeared - but it really was too expensive.

Please Graphisoft, buy the technology & include it with version 12!
PAUL KING
https://www.prime.net.nz
ArchiCAD 8-25
Octane Render Plugin for ArchiCAD
Twinmotion 2021
Windoze 10
Intel Core i9 10900K
Nvidia Gforce RTX 3080
32 Gb DDR3
2x4K monitor extended desktop

Anonymous
Not applicable
...............as well a a vastly superior walk through mode where collision detection actually WORKS, (unlike VRML) - so your viewpoint rises as you walk up hills or steps etc., and where doors are automatically recognised as openings. .......
Sorry, but before talking about VRML, you should try it ... In the field of Realtime 3D the VRML is known for its INTERACTIVITY and for the best and more comfortable navigation mode (collision detection, gravity, speed control, terrain following, mouse navigation...).. of course in a vrml scene you can go up and down stairs and open doors ...
Zermatt is a good product, but you need both hands to walk through the scene and I would not say this is the most comfortable way to walk through.

Giovanni Dragone

Anonymous
Not applicable
With the greatest of respect, Giovanni, using two hands is the best way to control your movement in a three dimensional space (without having to buy further equipment). Why do you think that all first-person-shooter games use the keyboard and mouse controls? It only takes a bit of practice if you're not used to it!

Is there any chance in the future of further enhancing Vitruvian Studio with better lighting and shadows, or is it limited by the VRML format.

Also, regarding the file sizes, please don't specifically limit the program just to keep the file size very low. Any client will more than likely have access to broadband these days so 30mb would only take a few minutes to download. Our 6Mbit connection in the office can download one of your 2mb files in about 10 seconds! Why not make the files a bit larger with more information in! The client is going to be spending 10s if not 100s of thousands of pounds on the building, waiting 10 minutes is not a problem.

Please don't think I am criticising your program. Many people appreciate your hard work and time spent designing this program for our use. Its just that some enhancements could make it even better!

Thanks.

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