ArchiCAD is dying

[Bruce]

I know that's a controversial subject line, but I believe it's true. Not because I want it to be, but because Autodesk is an advancing monster; ArchiCAD firms are switching to Revit, and Revit-based firms are buying ArchiCAD firms...and switching them to Revit.

ArchiCAD is a great program, but if it keeps going the way it is, I fear it will gradually dwindle until it's finally gone. On a level playing field, it comes out more or less even with Revit (I have done a detailed analysis that has been vetted by Revit experts) - but it's not a level playing field.

In my opinion, Graphisoft needs to do a handful of things to even the odds (yes, I will compare to Revit, as that's the main competition):

1. Rebrand & revamp the UI: CAD is an obsolete term. Even though ArchiCAD was BIM way before the term was even coined, I think the "CAD" in the name does it a disservice. Also, the user interface is old and tired. Should it go to the ribbon? No way. Should it be brought into the 21st century? Absolutely - there are plenty of excellent examples out there. Blender, a free 3D program, is undergoing its second UI redesign in about 5 years. If Blender can do it, Graphisoft can.

2. Introduce type-based elements. At the moment, pretty much everything is instance based. If you place 100 doors 900mm wide throughout the project, you have to select and change every single instance (this is an example, so please don't tell me the workarounds - that misses the point). Essentially, this is extending the attributes database to other objects. This makes project-wide changes so much more consistent, with no fear of missing an element.

3. Easier creation of parametric custom content: A beginner user in Revit can create a basic parametric object by using geometry and dimensions. It is intuitive and accessible. This does have its limits, but GDL is completely inaccessible to any but the advanced user with a programming mind...something architects and drafties generally don't have - otherwise they'd be programmers. A mix of the two would be extremely powerful - maybe an interface similar to Visual Basic, or Grasshopper? Not only for 3D elements, but also for 2D labels.

4. Better labelling & keynote tools: At the moment it's one label per element per view. What if I want to tag more than the ID? What about material, thickness, height etc. Revit is excellent in this regard, and also in the ability to create your label format as specific as you please. Key notes are also critical.

These are only four key improvements that I think are critical. There are many others that I could list, but this post is already too long. I say the above not to criticise ArchiCAD, but to try and help (misguided however it may be).

I could be wrong - I would be happy to be wrong...but the Autodesk monster is advancing...

These changes should be done the Graphisoft way: not to match what Revit does, but to equal and better it.

[Laszlo Nagy]

This is not something that should be taken as a promise or fact, but I am hearing news that GS may be working on a Rhino-Grashopper-ARCHICAD bidirectional connection. We already have Rhino-ARCHICAD one-directional connection, that's is a done deal since this spring. If this is true this is something that may be coming in the future.

Which makes me think about the following:
On other fronts, one can read in the news that Rhino for Mac is coming, and sometime in the (hopefully not too distant) future Grasshopper for Rhino will also be released. So if all these things happen, then ARCHICAD will hopefully have a bidirectional Rhino-Grasshopper connection on both the Windows and Mac platforms in the foreseeable future.

To me this sounds like a pretty good thing because the guys developing Rhino and Grasshopper can focus on those applications, while Graphisoft can focus on ARCHICAD. Actually, this is not a bad solution, in my opinion. At this year's AIA one of the big announcements of Autodesk was the making of Dynamo a stand-alone product independent of Revit. Previously it was part of Revit. So Dynamo (a Grasshopper-like visual algorithmic modeling environment) will now be able to connect to any other application as well, and will not be tied to Revit. Which makes it the same order of solution as a Rhino-Grasshopper connection to ARCHICAD.

We will see...

[Laszlo Nagy]

Another thing since this is a thread about ARCHICAD (at least according to some) kicking the bucket at practically any moment now (or not):

Graphisoft just won over a major client in Brazil. They used Revit but decided to switch to ARCHICAD after evaluation:

...Following one month of work by our BIM Manager, and a discussion of the results with the team, we concluded that ARCHICAD, in addition to having a price closer to our reality, was also much closer to everything we had always looked for in a BIM tool. With a very positive technical evaluation and competitive cost, it was relatively easy to make the decision to migrate to ARCHICAD...

...Our main motivation for changing software was Autodesk’s new commercial policy, which is counter-productive to the Brazilian economy,” Fernandes said. After testing and using ARCHICAD, the firm has concluded that it is a superior software. “ARCHICAD integrates with Rhino — and it is more user-friendly and intuitive. ARCHICAD also offers us greater modeling freedom and allows us to model and document in one single platform...

http://www.graphisoft.com/info/news/press_releases/graphisoft-signs-major-brazil-client.html

[arg617]

laszlonagy wrote:
Another thing since this is a thread about ARCHICAD (at least according to some) kicking the bucket at practically any moment now (or not):

That's great and all, but it still doesn't help out the situation in my market. In addition to the previous link, I'll add this one (which doesn't bode well):

http://www.nyc.gov/html/dob/downloads/pdf/bim_manual.pdf

The NYC Department of Buildings is now beginning to accept BIM models......as long as they are Revit files.

When the main regulating authority in a locality (a major one here) prescribes a specific software all others are all but dead.

This just adds to the long list of major agencies (clients) also requiring Revit. A major one is:

NYC School Construction Authority: http://www.nycsca.org/Business/WorkingWithTheSCA/Design/Manuals/SCA_BIM_Standards_Manual.pdf

I'm not bringing this up to bash Graphisoft. I'm bringing it up so that they could hopefully do something about this before it's too late. New features and software improvements are great, but they might need to hire a few lawyers to help put an end to this.....

[Laszlo Nagy]

Arg617,

Thanks for this information,
I will bring this to the attention of the guys at GS HQ.

[Anonymous]

arg617 wrote:

laszlonagy wrote:
Another thing since this is a thread about ARCHICAD (at least according to some) kicking the bucket at practically any moment now (or not):

That's great and all, but it still doesn't help out the situation in my market. In addition to the previous link, I'll add this one (which doesn't bode well):

http://www.nyc.gov/html/dob/downloads/pdf/bim_manual.pdf

The NYC Department of Buildings is now beginning to accept BIM models......as long as they are Revit files.

When the main regulating authority in a locality (a major one here) prescribes a specific software all others are all but dead.

This just adds to the long list of major agencies (clients) also requiring Revit. A major one is:

NYC School Construction Authority: http://www.nycsca.org/Business/WorkingWithTheSCA/Design/Manuals/SCA_BIM_Standards_Manual.pdf

I'm not bringing this up to bash Graphisoft. I'm bringing it up so that they could hopefully do something about this before it's too late. New features and software improvements are great, but they might need to hire a few lawyers to help put an end to this.....

"This manual will be supported by content that is generated in Revit and AutoCAD Architecture to be reviewed in Navisworks Manage. However if you are not using Revit or AutoCAD to create the model for submission, the requirement will be to provide DOB with an nwd, nwc (Navisworks) or dwf (design review) file with the required information for review. This information is detailed in Section 3."

[Anonymous]

Navisworks export from Archicad always lags behind the releases. IFC is an option here though. Still requirement like that will convince some that this is a reason enough.
Then there is the ability to find partners that work in the same platform as you. How many structural/mechanical engineers are using Archicad?

[Anonymous]

Miki wrote:
Then there is the ability to find partners that work in the same platform as you. How many structural/mechanical engineers are using Archicad?

There are not many doing Engineering BIM cost Effectively & Efficiently
That is the main limitation here in Australia as well... no tools for engineers although it's a great program for design and construction.
Unfortunately, all models have to be redone for the extraction of basic engineering data and to run simulations this is costings clients >30% for which the majority refuse to pay for.This now is a problem for the whole Nem Group as my clients have indicated they want a complete package not the IFC rubbish and as for that revit safety template, LOL last time I saw something like that the subbies wanted a 20% pay increase..NYC,Goodluck with that

[Anonymous]

laszlonagy wrote:
At this year's AIA one of the big announcements of Autodesk was the making of Dynamo a stand-alone product independent of Revit. Previously it was part of Revit. So Dynamo (a Grasshopper-like visual algorithmic modeling environment) will now be able to connect to any other application as well, and will not be tied to Revit. Which makes it the same order of solution as a Rhino-Grasshopper connection to ARCHICAD.
We will see...

To an engineer that logic is not quite RIGHT.
Dynamo will be great for simplified engineering details and since a majority of engineers are quite happy to remain on Autocad..why shouldnt they make it available to all Autocad users. Unfortunately your analogy comparing it to AC and Rhino..just further complicates the whole process.
I also appreciate the urgency and hopefully this will be only a temporary measure. my2c

[stefan]

Navisworks is also a proprietary Autodesk application, only running on Windows. The ArchiCAD connection it had was halted to an older ArchiCAD release (r14-15-16) and never updated. It works with IFC.

I totally agree on the problem of requirements that stipulate particular software that is closed, non-cross-platform and from a particular software vendor.

That is not a software issue, but more a lawyers issue. Good luck with that.

[Anonymous]

Why does Graphisoft not acquire this company? So they have a solution in Rhino as well to sketch ideas in the sketch fase.

http://www.visualarq.com/

They already have a BIM Grasshopper plugin up and running.