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Modeling
About Archicad's design tools, element connections, modeling concepts, etc.

GS clearly does not take the residential architect seriously

rm
Expert
This is going to be a RANT. So if you are a full time GS apologist, you might want to move on.

This week I upgraded one of my dongles to AC 12, only one! For the majority of my last 15 years of using AC, I have used it on upper bracket residential projects. During that time I have purchased numerous 3rd party libraries for windows, doors, and furniture....because the AC library has had the same pieces of _ _ _ _ for the last 2000 years!!!

This while applications for significantly less money, mostly on the PC side - darn-it, have had features like cabinets that heal themselves when arranged in the plan, windows that actually don't have trim problems and are based on real US manufacturers, doors that don't have trim problems and are based on real US manufacturers, furniture that doesn't look like a kid with a crayon drew them, extrusions, lathes, and sweeps that can be rotated and adjust in 3D, like Objective can do. Obviously the objects should be location friendly, I don't mean to suggest every country should adopt the US objects as standard.....OK, done being politically correct.

I have personally been told by the GS CEO when v9 was out, that by issuance of v11 there would be a "new" and well sorted out library that would be "thoroughly" tested. BS.....I have v12, and I found problems with the windows after working with them less than 5 minutes.....see the attached image, so you know I'm not blowing smoke.

What the heck does it take for GS to build a decent library? Let me tell you, I will have to go kicking and screaming to Revit, but if thats what it takes to access a decent library, I will consider it. Currently you can't access anything on the Google 3D warehouse directly into AC12, and there is NO indication from GS when we will see the plug-in again, if at all. And if your on the Mac side, forget it, you don't have a prayer as the plug-in only worked on the Windows side of AC.

Obviously, if I have stuck with this program since v4.1 I think it is reasonably good. What I find inexcusable is GS willingness to keep putting out lousy standard library sets. In the world of BIM and Photorealistic renderings, GS should be providing a solid realistic library set.....they are not even close!!!!!

I have forwarded the bug to GS through tech support. I am shocked I found the bugs with the windows in less than 5 minutes of using the AC12. God knows what I will find when I dig in further with the doors.

For what I just spent on an upgrade, I am absolutely torqued at how lacking this library still is. The truth is, even 3rd party libraries are very limited - they hardly exist. Clearly GS has not been successful in getting buy-in from US manufacturers to create libraries the way AutoDesk has with Revit. While there are some very generous users out there that give away some very good objects ( THANK YOU TO ALL OF YOU ) the majority of GDL objects available just are not realistic looking or don't stay current with AC.

I have suggested this before, and I will say it again. GS there are some really smart, good GDL gurus out there. Get off your wallet and hire these people to ONLY design objects or work with manufacturers of real Plumbing Fixtures, Light Fixtures, Doors, Windows, Furniture, etc....and pay them to test the objects thoroughly. I'm guessing a 1 million dollar investment in the libraries would yield something far superior to what you provide now....I guess 50 dollars might do that as well

.....hey Mr. Gallello - you getting any of this?
Robert Mariani
MARIANI design studio, PLLC
Architecture / Architectural Photography
www.robertmariani.com

Mac OSX 13.1
AC 24 / 25 / 26
123 REPLIES 123
Chris Phillips
Contributor
Matthew wrote:
I think what is being missed here is that the GDL as it presently exists cannot provide the door, window, stair or other assemblies that we need. GDL is great for some things and it can be stretched to some pretty amazing lengths, but it is not sufficiently robust, flexible and maintainable for complex assemblies.

Door and window libraries could theoretically be improved, but as someone who has seen the deep, dark insides of GDL for twenty years I can say with a fair degree of certainty that such efforts are ultimately doomed. The upside is that the solutions don't seem that difficult to me. The downside is that I don't see anyone (including Revit) addressing the issues properly.

Perhaps the curtainwall tool is the herald of a new era in this regard, and it is impressive in many ways. But its lack of integration with the rest of the program leaves me less than encouraged.

Graphisoft has pulled off some very impressive feats by repurposing and integrating basic functions of ArchiCAD. Teamwork and hotlinked modules are essentially extensions of the group and lock functions (yes I know, modules existed before the group function - consider it advanced causation or Darwinian preadaptation). A similar approach to integrating the tools could produce extraordinary results, but instead we are getting a proliferation of unrelated features and functions. Imagine if you could draw complex profiles to be used as mullions/muntins in the curtainwall system, or be called from within a GDL script.

Oh well back to work. I still prefer ArchiCAD to anything else out there.
There is an object out there called modular joinery and is distributed as part of the UK UAS. It does a lot of the stuff talked about above, and does it very slickly too.
Anonymous
Not applicable
Here is my latest reply from a manufacturer:

"
Hi
Thanks we have seen a few systems like this but at this time we are not interested.
Thanks for the details.
Regards John
"

They produce flooring systems, perfect for integration into GDL.
They happily had a full page ad in this month's trade magazine. (@ $4,000)

I did only email them though, so maybe they didn't understand what i was talking about?
I explained how powerful this was, number of users etc etc.

Any ideas how to solve this problem?
Anonymous
Not applicable
Chris wrote:
There is an object out there called modular joinery and is distributed as part of the UK UAS. It does a lot of the stuff talked about above, and does it very slickly too.
Ooh, that sounds interesting! You must be with Bite, as we haven't got anything like that from Applecore. Shame.

sdb wrote:
Any ideas how to solve this problem?
Take a risk.

Build a demo version, and either go over to the company and demo it in person, or use a webcast type of presentation where they can see your desktop live to show the sort of things it can do. Show some other cool things you have done. Say you will plaster links to their website all over the user interface for easy ordering. Give them a reasonable price for doing a fully featured version.

If they still don't bite, sell it on your site anyway!
Thomas Holm
Booster
Peter wrote:
Chris wrote:
There is an object out there called modular joinery and is distributed as part of the UK UAS. It does a lot of the stuff talked about above, and does it very slickly too.
Ooh, that sounds interesting! You must be with Bite, as we haven't got anything like that from Applecore. Shame.
Peter, the Modular Joinery object is Ralph Wessel's "Velfac" window as reported at the Archicad Summer School in Nottingham this year.
Google for Wessel Velfac and you'll find the report. I hear it's paid for by Graphisoft UK and distributed to subscribers.

Alas, I haven't been able to obtain it myself. It may be in bug testing yet, though.
AC4.1-AC26SWE; MacOS13.5.1; MP5,1+MBP16,1
Djordje
Ace
sdb wrote:
Here is my latest reply from a manufacturer:

"
Hi
Thanks we have seen a few systems like this but at this time we are not interested.
Thanks for the details.
Regards John
"

They produce flooring systems, perfect for integration into GDL.
They happily had a full page ad in this month's trade magazine. (@ $4,000)

I did only email them though, so maybe they didn't understand what i was talking about?
I explained how powerful this was, number of users etc etc.

Any ideas how to solve this problem?
Never assume that the person you are talking to knows what are you talking about.

Just email does not work. A lot of legwork is needed to educate the public.
Djordje



ArchiCAD since 4.55 ... 1995
HP Omen
Anonymous
Not applicable
Hi Djordje,

With all due respect... I don't think legwork will solve the problem...
It's not our job to promote GDL...
As I said before it's all about trust... Sdb's initiative is a very good and hard effort for an individual... But I have to say it's not enough...
I think it's a process that have to begin with a GS move...
Only GS have the global dimension and credibility to be the foundation of a solid market oriented GDL library free of charge for end users...
Ralph Wessel
Mentor
Thomas wrote:
Peter, the Modular Joinery object is Ralph Wessel's "Velfac" window as reported at the Archicad Summer School in Nottingham this year.
Google for Wessel Velfac and you'll find the report. I hear it's paid for by Graphisoft UK and distributed to subscribers.
Alas, I haven't been able to obtain it myself. It may be in bug testing yet, though.
Testing was completed in October and it has been approved for release to UK subscribers. Graphisoft UK has been quite proactive in identifying frequently requested objects and trying to meet that demand. Anyone interested in getting hold of it should ask their reseller to contact GS UK.

The object itself is able to produce almost any arrangement of doors, windows, panels, louvres, etc, including varying frames, mullions, and sashes within a single object. Panes, panels, and louvres can be freely configured in each window/door leaf too. Some images are attached, one showing the 3D view of my test project. Each example is a single instance of the Modular Joinery object, including the curtain wall to the rear.

The name 'Velfac' isn't used because it provides an interface to select products from any number of manufacturers. Some Velfac products are included, and others may follow in future as need/demand arises.
ModularJoinery.jpg
Ralph Wessel BArch
Anonymous
Not applicable
Hi Ralph,

I didn't see the object itself, but from what I see in the picture it seems to be a very impressive object...
And the fact that it can work with several market products is a very good feature... Very innovative and promising.
I'll contact the local reseller immediately to get in touch with GS UK.
I'm happy to know that this initiative was trigged by GS UK...
Great job Ralph... as always...
Anonymous
Not applicable
Me wanna!
Karl Ottenstein
Moderator
Krippahl wrote:
Me wanna!
Ditto. Well done, Ralph ... and GS UK for supporting such a project!

Cheers,
Karl
One of the forum moderators
AC 27 USA and earlier   •   macOS Ventura 13.6.6, MacBook Pro M2 Max 12CPU/30GPU cores, 32GB
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