We want: LAYER PALETTE that shows the SELECTED things LAYER

aryastark
Enthusiast
to op Discussion click here: https://archicad-talk.graphisoft.com/viewtopic.php?f=20&t=70172#p313012 n ö

I never understood why archicad doesn't have this feature. Very surprising. Even relatively simple programs such as photoshop have the layer display feature of the selected element, while the absence of this in a complex program like archicad is a big handicap.

In a nutshell: through hundreds of layers, for the purposes of -changing layer name; changing it's priority level; duplicate it as a sequel to a close name for a reason; delete it etc.- layer palette should show [must make highlighted] automatically the selected elements layer when it opens.
 just like in the "building materials" palette.
Building material pallet shows inside(makes highlited) when i choose something before opening the palette. )
thanks for reading.
valar morghulis.
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16 REPLIES 16

AlexM
Newcomer
Even having the layers searchable/filterable by name would help.

In a decent sized project you need loads of layers to properly control the various plan views and/or options. It would make life so much easier to have the current layer auto selected in the layer palette. It makes me wonder sometimes if anyone at Graphisoft has used the programme on a real project!
22 / 24 Win10 & OSX

runxel
Mentor
Let's please just abandon layers alltogether....
There are already properties, let us just filter by that, GS!

Too bad you're too shy to actually risk something which would leverage the whole CAD/BIM system.
AC 24 [ger] | Win 10 | Developer of the GDL plugin for Sublime Text |
«Furthermore, I consider that Carth... yearly releases must be destroyed»

Braza
Newcomer
runxel wrote:
Let's please just abandon layers alltogether....
There are already properties, let us just filter by that, GS!
In case you and others haven't notice, you can vote for this here.

Cheers,
Paulo Henrique Santos, Architect
AC24_INT#3008 / I7 / 16Gb / 512Mb SSD / Windows 10

runxel
Mentor
Braza wrote:

In case you and others haven't notice, you can vote for this here.

Already voted "essential" there!
Cheers Braza
AC 24 [ger] | Win 10 | Developer of the GDL plugin for Sublime Text |
«Furthermore, I consider that Carth... yearly releases must be destroyed»

3x3
Newcomer

Nguyen Minh
Graphisoft Moderator
Graphisoft Moderator
Hi All,

Thank you very much for creating this poll, and for those of you who voted or share your opinions!

I am happy to say we took notice of this wish and I have added it to our Wish List database (please refer to it as IDEA-1398). Hopefully, our Product Management team will adopt this one in the future.

Thank you all once more, and I wish you a great day!

Best regards,
Minh

Minh Nguyen
Technical Support Engineer
GRAPHISOFT

jl_lt
Newcomer
Braza wrote:
runxel wrote:
Let's please just abandon layers alltogether....
There are already properties, let us just filter by that, GS!
In case you and others haven't notice, you can vote for this here.

Cheers,
Hi Mr. Braza, im very very used to layers, which is something i carried from the autocad days and made my transition to Archicad easier. Ive been reading this intention of eliminating layers for some time now. I would like to ask, generally speaking, what would be the advantages of using properties or clasifications over layers? I can intuitively see that they could be better, but cannot see how.

Braza
Newcomer
Hi jl_lt,

IMO I can only see advantages. Like:
1. Coooonnnnnssssiiiisssssttttteeeeennnnnncccccccyyyyyyyyyy... Ahummmmmmmm! As it would concentrate Layers, Layer Combo, Renovation Filter, Partial Structure Display. These all could be converted to properties (which in reality is what they are);
2. It eliminates the need for innumerous layers to accommodate a proper project documentation workflow;
3. Gives the user the total power to control visibility of all the elements of a virtual building. As today we can create any Classification and Property, but we can't apply them to 2d elements. i.e.: You can hide any specific element that could also share the same layer and/or Renovation Filter and/or Structural role with others;
4. Allow us to easy create phasing, construction simulation and versioning schemes for any project;
5. If also applied to Complex Profiles would allow for total easy control of complex structures and elements;
6. The process of applying Classifications is much more straight forward than applying Layers. With Classifications you can apply innumerous Properties to a single element with just one click.

These are the main ones that come to my mind.

Now please hit me with plenty.
Paulo Henrique Santos, Architect
AC24_INT#3008 / I7 / 16Gb / 512Mb SSD / Windows 10

runxel
Mentor
And let's not forget that you can put multipe classifications on an element, but can only assign one layer!
This often means that you have the same thing multiple times, just on different layers, because they are such a rigid and outdated concept (which comes from physical layers; tracing paper stacked upon each other), and there is just no other way around, because layers are the main thing that governs visibility (together with reno, but if you are in a reno project, it renders this approch unusable; and let's better not talk about psd).
AC 24 [ger] | Win 10 | Developer of the GDL plugin for Sublime Text |
«Furthermore, I consider that Carth... yearly releases must be destroyed»

Laszlo Nagy
Community Admin
Community Admin
A question:
So, what happens if a Wall is using 2 Classification Systems, and based on one Classification, the Wall should be hidden, but based on the other it should be visible?
Does one Classification system take precedence over the other? Which one?
What happens when in the case of Walls, the first Classification system needs to take precedence, but in the case of Slabs, the second Classification system needs to take precedence?

Also, if you eliminate the system of Layers, you have to replace it with 4 Properties: Locked/Unlocked status, Visibility status, Intersection Priority Group, 3D display mode (Solid/wireframe).
....................................................................................................
Laszlo Nagy, Lead Moderator, Community Admin
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Loving Archicad since 1995

Braza
Newcomer
Hi Laszlo,

LaszloNagy wrote:
So, what happens if a Wall is using 2 Classification Systems, and based on one Classification, the Wall should be hidden, but based on the other it should be visible?
Does one Classification system take precedence over the other? Which one?
If the two Classification Systems share the same Property, then there is no issue. When we filter that Property it will have only one value. But if each Classification System has its own Visibility Property, then when I define the criteria, I will specify which Classification I am referring the the Visibility value that I want. So we will have Visibility_Class01 and Visibility_Class02. But in my opinion there would be no need to duplicate properties with the same name. And if I imported another Classification System that had a "Visibility" property and the project already has a property with the same name, then a popup message would alert and ask if the user want to duplicate it.

LaszloNagy wrote:
What happens when in the case of Walls, the first Classification system needs to take precedence, but in the case of Slabs, the second Classification system needs to take precedence?
Sorry Laszlo but I didn't understand. What do you mean by precedence?

LaszloNagy wrote:
Also, if you eliminate the system of Layers, you have to replace it with 4 Properties: Locked/Unlocked status, Visibility status, Intersection Priority Group, 3D display mode (Solid/wireframe).
This could be addressed by "Filter Combinations" and "Filter Rules"

p.s.: I think these last posts would be better if moved to the Model Filter View Option Wish.
Paulo Henrique Santos, Architect
AC24_INT#3008 / I7 / 16Gb / 512Mb SSD / Windows 10

jl_lt
Newcomer
one question: these properties would have to be assigned individually? i mean, with layers at least once you assign it to an object, and assuming you got your combos right, you assure visibility consistency in all your views. personally i never understood the concept of hiding a specific object like in revit. for me if you have walls you either see then in section or you dont, but never manually hide a specific wall (or anything else for that matter), id rather modify the section line if i dont want something to appear.

from what i understand, eliminating layers would create a very sofisticated system with extreme flexibility, but also it would elevate complexity and potential for chaos for less experienced users; meanwhile layers keep it simple and can create an immediately workable system even for novice users. so, i would advocate for a solution that allows extreme complexity but also extreme simplicity.
or am i missing something?

Braza
Newcomer
jl_lt wrote:
these properties would have to be assigned individually?
You mean assign property values individually, right? If so: No. You can select a bunch of similar elements (Find & Select) then apply the value that you want once and all the others with that property will display the new value. Very similar to a Layer definition.

jl_lt wrote:
personally i never understood the concept of hiding a specific object like in revit.
I am not a Revit user. But from what I saw and understand, Revit has just a dumb Category Filter that you can define any intrinsic value. They are simple "Tags". Like: MEP, Architecture, Structure, Landscape, etc. Then you just filter elements that have that "Tag". The proposed Archicad Model Filter will use any data associated to an element to filter the model. Including Story, Height, Length, BM, Properties, etc. Way more powerful.

jl_lt wrote:
from what i understand, eliminating layers would create a very sofisticated system with extreme flexibility, but also it would elevate complexity and potential for chaos for less experienced users;
I don't think so. It would be more like a biker learning how to drive a bus. It is not rocket science.
I also think that this logical approach to deal with data from a BIM Model would allow for a future digital assistant like Siri or Alexa. Imagine: "Alexa"... "Show me only MEP ventilation duct elements that are scheduled to be applied today by the Contractor X"... Bam!
Now imagine how could poor Alexa do this with Layers.
Paulo Henrique Santos, Architect
AC24_INT#3008 / I7 / 16Gb / 512Mb SSD / Windows 10

jl_lt
Newcomer
Braza wrote:

Imagine: "Alexa"... "Show me only MEP ventilation duct elements that are scheduled to be applied today by the Contractor X"... Bam!
Now imagine how could poor Alexa do this with Layers.
Now this is forward thinking! for a brief moment i imagined a Tony Stark-Jarvis design interaction, but instead of Ironman it would be a low budget school

Joke aside, I think i get it now; basically if someone wants to keep working like now (like yours trullly), they can do it, but this system would allow for much more complex interaction and data management right? a trully scalable system for the simplest project to the most complex tower. My gripe would be what Mr. Nagy points out: basic visibility properties currently handled by layer configuration would have to be handled separately

Braza
Newcomer
jl_lt wrote:
but this system would allow for much more complex interaction and data management right?
Exactly. And also the foundation for AC new features.

jl_lt wrote:
My gripe would be what Mr. Nagy points out: basic visibility properties currently handled by layer configuration would have to be handled separately
I think it would be the same with Layers. They would be right there in "Filter Combinations". The only missing would be "Visibility" (The eye icon), as it would be intrinsically the "Rule" itself (If it is not in the criteria then it is not visible).
Paulo Henrique Santos, Architect
AC24_INT#3008 / I7 / 16Gb / 512Mb SSD / Windows 10

Pawel Spychala
Participant
aryastark wrote:
to op Discussion click here: https://archicad-talk.graphisoft.com/viewtopic.php?f=20&t=70172#p313012 n ö

I never understood why archicad doesn't have this feature. Very surprising. Even relatively simple programs such as photoshop have the layer display feature of the selected element, while the absence of this in a complex program like archicad is a big handicap.

In a nutshell: through hundreds of layers, for the purposes of -changing layer name; changing it's priority level; duplicate it as a sequel to a close name for a reason; delete it etc.- layer palette should show [must make highlighted] automatically the selected elements layer when it opens.
 just like in the "building materials" palette.
Building material pallet shows inside(makes highlited) when i choose something before opening the palette. )
thanks for reading.
valar morghulis.
Alt+click on element do this. It works even on not selected elements.

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