Installation & update
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running Archicad in virtual PC

Anonymous
Not applicable
Has anyone tried to run Archicad under virtual PC on a Mac. An odd question I know, but I do some training and cringe at the thought of buying a PC. It would be ideal if I could have a Mac laptop and run in virtual PC mode for training sessions with PC users. I obviously will take a performance hit, but will it run "good enough".
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Anonymous
Not applicable
I haven't tried running ArchiCAD (and it's been a while since I've used VPC at all) but the performance hit is typically pretty substantial. It will probably not run acceptably, particularly on a G4 PowerBook which is no speed demon to begin with.

I have been hoping that the new Intel Macs would solve this problem, since I too have clients on both platforms. Unfortunately, from what I've been reading, this will not come soon (it looks unlikely that XP will install easily if at all) and possibly not at all (there is no guarantee that Vista will work either - just a much better chance).
__archiben
Booster
Mike wrote:
I obviously will take a performance hit, but will it run "good enough".
the last time i tried was VPC6 with windows 2000 pro and an early release of archiCAD 9 . . . it pretty much ground to a halt. definitely not good enough then.

~/archiben
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Aaron Bourgoin
Virtuoso
Another reason to avoid this is that VPC's virtual video card does not support OpenGL.

This also makes the playing of Zermatt files a no go in VPC.
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Ralph Wessel
Mentor
Mike wrote:
Has anyone tried to run Archicad under virtual PC on a Mac. An odd question I know, but I do some training and cringe at the thought of buying a PC. It would be ideal if I could have a Mac laptop and run in virtual PC mode for training sessions with PC users. I obviously will take a performance hit, but will it run "good enough".
Mike,

I use AC9 under Virtual PC 7 occasionally, and performance is OK depending on what you want to do. The biggest hit is to launch times and trying to navigate in the 3D window (no hardware assistance for OpenGL). Once ArchiCAD is running, many operations aren't too bad because they don't make demands on the machine anyway.

I expect Virtual PC (or something equivalent) to become quite impressive when running natively on the new Intel-based machines. I can't predict how far off that is though.

Ralph.
Ralph Wessel BArch
Active Thread Ltd
Anonymous
Not applicable
Ralph wrote:
I expect Virtual PC (or something equivalent) to become quite impressive when running natively on the new Intel-based machines. I can't predict how far off that is though.
Running natively may not really come to pass. There are serious obstacles to booting XP on the new Macs, and Vista may be difficult as well (see: this article for a depressing view of things).

The main problem is in the EFI which replaces the old BIOS. Windows XP does not support this (except for Itanium systems I think - no help there). Dell Core Duo machines with EFI also have a compatibility module (CSM) to allow XP to boot. Apple did not include this since it is not needed. The problem with booting an Intel Mac directly into Windows (as in a typical dual boot system) is that the CSM has to load at startup before anything else so that XP can access the file system.

More optimistically there are likely to be commercial emulators developed that may approach native speeds since the hardware is directly compatible. It is possible that the only part that would need to be emulated is the CSM which, from what I understand, should not affect performance too much.

The hopeful side of this is that an emulator (if it is fast enough) is probably the better solution anyway, since it would presumably allow both systems to run simultaneously.

Of course it's still all very vague and uncertain at this point. I'm still hopeful that an acceptable solution becomes available. It would sure make my life easier.
Ralph Wessel
Mentor
Matthew wrote:
Running natively may not really come to pass. There are serious obstacles to booting XP on the new Macs, and Vista may be difficult as well
Running 'natively' doesn't necessarily mean booting the computer in Windows. For example, Virtual PC is also available for Windows to allow for multiple versions of Windows to be used simultaneously one computer. In this context, applications run very quickly. The underlying hardware is the key - the closer it is to a 'standard' wintel platform, the faster it can potentially run. Emulating the processor, for example, is a costly process and one of the main reasons Windows currently runs slowly under Virtual PC on a Mac.

Ther are other alternatives, e.g. the WINE project. This provides a Windows API compatibility layer built on top of Linux/UNIX. This means you can run Windows apps without pruchasing or installing Windows.

I expect someone will crack the boot problem in any case - there's immense interest in it. But whether they do or not, Mac users will be able to run Windows apps very quickly on Apple equipment in the near future.
Ralph Wessel BArch
Active Thread Ltd