basic question: load D1 11 in AC12

[stefan]

While I understand (some of) the reasoning behind updating libraries between releases, something as basic as allowing the user to replace the "D1 11" with the "D1 12" door should be possible.

Is there a trick? I don't want to load an older library, but rather migrate a project to a clean r12 library.

Is that possible?

(seems such a newbie question, considering my time spent with ArchiCAD)

[Karl Ottenstein]

Hi Stefan,

This feels like a set-up, since I know that you know. 😉

If the 12 part is upwards compatible with the 11 part, you can select the D1 11 part, then inject (syringe) into the thumbnail image of the D1 12 part in the Object Settings dialog. If compatible, the result will be reasonable. If not, not.

It would be nice if GS produced a table listing library parts vs versions and whether they were upwards compatible, but trial-and-error is the only method I know of at the moment. It seems that some parts have very different internal parameter names and so the injection technique will not work. (It is the internal GDL parameter name that is matched during the parameter transfer process.)

Wouldn't it be great if besides a readable table of compatibility, GS had a conversion utility that offered to convert all prior lib parts to new ones where they are compatible? Has not been a big issue until 12 to use old library parts, but only the 12 windows and doors are programmed to display themselves properly with the new Partial Structure Display feature.

Cheers,
Karl

[Anonymous]

Hi Stefan and Karl,

Karl wrote:
It seems that some parts have very different internal parameter names and so the injection technique will not work.

Thats why I think GS should rethink the library concept...
99.9% of the issues in the library are with doors or windows...
Call me lunatic... But I don't understand why GS insist on a library policy that is not sustainable...
For example... the Cadimage's Door/Window Builder has a much more rational logic...
With D/W builder you save your custom doors and windows as a txt file with your own parameters...
and you can load them with new and update versions...
Its a more rational approach to handle the library...
Instead of creating and updating lots and lots of doors and windows, you just update (improve) one door/Window on "steroids" (Like Miguel Krippahl would say )...
What do you think?...

[Piotr Dobrowolski]

Little OT / slitly OT:

Braza wrote:
Instead of creating and updating lots and lots of doors and windows, you just update (improve) one door/Window on "steroids" (Like Miguel Krippahl would say )...
What do you think?...

If You looked "under the hood" the idea is there already - the all doors in the library just call a "door on steroids" macro. 😉

Best Regards,
Piotr

[stefan]

Karl, maybe it is me, but I did not understand your answer fully.

I made a copy of the missing door into a new wall. Then I extracted the parameters, opened the dialog, navigated to the "D1 12" in the Door Settings dialog and injected the settings onto the icon. Weird! Is that documented? Is that a trick?
However, while the door seemed to get fairly complete, with the same sizes, for a Window I tried, I got less success: especially the reveal got mixed up, probably because this changed in r12...

I truly believe that there should at least be a migration wizard, that allows the transfer of older library parts into their new versions. As they use the same name, they are meant to replace the older ones, don't they?

What I did to have at least my project back as it was, was loading the Migration Library (although the ArchiCAD help did not mention it, at first sight), but this basically means that most elements stay in their r11 disguise and don't fully migrate to r12.

I also tried to open the "D1 11" and load "D1 12" from the Object dialog, but this resets the whole door to the default "D1 12" door, disregarding all (mostly compatible) parameters. Stupid. Not even the door-size is retained. This is solved with the syringe trick, as mentioned above, but it is only a partial recreation of the door.

----

I want to reuse my r11 classroom model, but in a clean, default r12 library for teaching in a few weeks.

[Karl Ottenstein]

stefan wrote:
What I did to have at least my project back as it was, was loading the Migration Library (although the ArchiCAD help did not mention it, at first sight), but this basically means that most elements stay in their r11 disguise and don't fully migrate to r12.

The Migration library is discussed in the "Getting Started with ArchiCAD 12" PDF file in the Help menu (Documentation folder). It's on pages 43-44 of the English language file. As with the New Features Guide, inevitably there are some things that are talked about there that do not appear in the full help file or reference guide - and so do not show up with a simple search. Something for GS to work on perhaps.

Cheers,
Karl

[Karl Ottenstein]

stefan wrote:
...and injected the settings onto the icon. Weird! Is that documented? Is that a trick?

It is mentioned in the Reference Guide PDF - page 318 of the English language copy - but the screenshot and single sentence do not make the potentially powerful process obvious at all.

See this older thread:
http://archicad-talk.graphisoft.com/viewtopic.php?t=11042&highlight=parameter+transfer

I thought one of the Laszlo's wrote up a tip with screenshots on the Wiki, but I could not find it just now.

In principal, when the parameters match as they should - you should be able to select say a double-hung window, open the settings dialog, inject into the thumbnail at the lower left of a casement, and the double hung will be replaced with an identically sized, identically cased casement. Ah, if it could only work 100% of the time.

Cheers,
Karl

[stefan]

Karl wrote:
In principal, when the parameters match as they should - you should be able to select say a double-hung window, open the settings dialog, inject into the thumbnail at the lower left of a casement, and the double hung will be replaced with an identically sized, identically cased casement. Ah, if it could only work 100% of the time.

I actually did not know about this. And have been frustrated a lot by it in the past. Re-creating window parameters when you switch types is a complex process.

Maybe the copy/paste of parameters should have more power:
-- copy/paste sizes (A, B, Z)
-- copy/paste values but keep library part
-- copy/paste full range of settings (incl. switching library part)

I learned something today 😉