Archicad 10 is announced

[Greg Kmethy]

Dear Talkers,

You can read Graphisoft's announcement on Archicad 10 here:
http://www.graphisoft.com/products/archicad/ac10/

[Bricklyne Clarence]

TomWaltz wrote:
Since GS seems to have allowed us to speak:


The new Profile tools cannot curve. No curved profiled walls, no curved profiled beams.

This is disappointing, to say the least. The long-standing rationale for a reluctance to update this particular aspect of modelling ( which has far reaching implications beyond fancy geometry) has been that not everybody designs Frank Gehry-like architecture and this would be a redundant feature. That rationale, becomes baseless when you consider the fact that Curved profiles,walls, and even sloped profiles (roof-application) occur more often that we are aware of in day-to-day "regular" architecture. Consider Stadium design or buildings adjacent to stadiums, auditoriums, Pool-houses, in essence, buildings which have naturally occurring curved construction elements that may require unique profiles; this isn't a completely unreasonable request of them to update this feature in the program, is it? And to expect the users to have to keep relying on plug-ins and add-ons which clearly never keep pace with the actual program release, and eventhen never offer completely integrated solutions is a little bit ridiculous IMHO. And this has been on the wishlist since ArchiCAD 7 or 8.0. It's just sad, really......

<rant over>

TomWaltz wrote:
You would still need ArchiForma or MaxonForm, but you will need updated Archicad 10 versions (see below).

This despite the fact that one of the developers is on record as saying that plug-ins and features such as Maxonfom and Archiforma will not affect the development of ArchiCAD's core modelling tools. Clearly they still want to milk that plug-in cow a little bit longer....

TomWaltz wrote:
All add-ons/plug-ins (true add-ons, not objects) have to be compiled for the new version. Each vendor will have their own policies about whether they charge for the new versions or not.

And the beat goes on and on and on and on........
learn a completely new interface (Maxonform), Work with non-intergrated, non-parametric, static, objects and solutions, or maybe just learn GDL. Is there at least an improved 3ds import function? Give me that at least.

I understand the fact that Graphisoft is a company with limited resources and has to prioritize their development objectives, but given the fact that this has been a wish or user request now traversing 3 released versions, and given the fact that architects are nowadays less and less limited in what they can design by construction limitations with the advances in the engineering and construction fields, what exactly are Graphisoft waiting for?

It pains to see other BIM applications integrating 'loft', 'sweep', 'revolve/rail', functions which generate dual curvilinear geometry that play nice (i.e., are parametric) with the rest of the design, while GS expect you to do it through Maxonform. Just pains.......

It has been proposed before that they should skip a version ( version 11.0 provides an excellent opportunity, but I understand they are committed to a November 2007 release) to allow them to re-write the obviously aging program code to enable it to better utilize faster computers ( so that it doesn't take forever to load up on start up for example, what's up with that?), better graphics cards and engines ( for true instantaneous update across all windows and even mutliple 3D-Windows) and things like NURBS algorithms which would solve a large number of their modelling holes right now. Would anyone really be against not getting a new version in 18 months and instead getting a brand new version in about 3 years which allows users to not have to rely so heavily on plug-ins that don't even integrate or work fluidly with the main program itself? Anyone?

[Aaron Bourgoin]

Will the real Frank Gehry please come out from behind the potted palm and speak up.

[Bricklyne Clarence]

~/archiben wrote:
frank gehry uses a version of 'catia' his technology arm have developed for his particular uses.

Actually, they mostly just use the CATIA modules for the Building Information of BIM; as in, for a information database capable of handling curvilinear geometry with updates and changes and later on generating CDs. Most of the modelling is done through Rhino3d, either directly or mostly through it's 3D-scanning feature, which allows them to scan the physical scale models that are produced in Gehry's workshop. Gehry, despite all the bells and whistles is still very much an old-school kind of architect with working wood models and good-old sketching paper to come up with his designs. It's in the Information Management, and Documentation, that the ingenuity really comes through.

The point is, it doesn't have to take a behemoth of a design program like CATIA to do what Gehry does; Rhino is in many ways a more simple program than ArchiCAD is (it started out as an AutoCAD pugin for pete's sake), yet considerably more robust, and not just because of it's NURBS-handling capability, but because of a lot of the updates and modifications they have been able to integrate into its engine to allow it to handle increasingly more and more complicated geometry.

And we're not even asking for ArchiCAD to have a Rhino-like capcacity or feel to it, but rather just a small aspect of that modelling freedom which still works within ArchiCAD's already familiar and logical interface.

Unfortunately, as I've already alluded to in another post, it would seem that the only way this might be possible, might be with a source code re-write; - something that GS might not be able to afford right now.


Which means they continue to fall behind while other programs catch up and really add some true value to the Modelling facet of Building Information Modelling.

[__archiben]

Taltuu wrote:
One thing we've had a real problem with is our framed walls with half log siding. Really no good way to do them.

have you tried cadimage's 'wall builder' add-on? that seems to do pretty good log/half-log/whatever-log cladding . . .

~/archiben

[Dwight]

And in addition to Rhino, there's Modo, Silo and Luxology, all of which create impressive curvilinear skins that can be imported smoothly into ArchiCAD via the 3DS import.

[Anonymous]

About add-on for free form. Personally, I have nothing against add-on; I would even pay 3 times the price for an Archiforma able to do more "solid" forms. I guess limitations are inside GDL's geometric possibilities rather than anything else.
My problem with external modeller is that they are ok for viewed objects in rendering but AFAIK not for technical drawings. You cannot have an accurate cut representation nor in plan neither in section. Am I wrong (I remember the Zoom GDL nightmare )?

[Dwight]

And right you are!

I still wake up at night SCREAMING about Zoom GDL.
Especially the part about it being GDL. Hahahaha!

The harsh reality of free-form design, unless it is that bogus ferro-concrete stuff, is that those beautiful, flowing curves we all dream of creating have harsh underpinnings that turn out to be A BUNCH OF NASTY, IRRATIONAL OBJECTS!!!

Back to ArchiCAD, then, to make a building of it.....

[Anonymous]

In June 2005, Fabrizio wrote "We are working on a new tool that provide the user with... let me call it a "Nurbs simulation".
The good news is that it use a technology (I mean a GDL description) which result will be a solid shape, that means more flexibility ad a lot of possibilities... "
Everybody with me:
Fabrizio
Fabrizio
Fabrizio
Fabrizio

[Anonymous]

James wrote:

oreopoulos wrote:
Or an enchanment of the current. Perhaps i miss smthg.

IS is substantially improved in 10.

All of those enchancements are usability ones. No functional enchanchments. I mean tools for calculating-estimating.Its still a pain to maintain the database, even more complicated to create cost estimates... and so on.

Excuse me but i dont see any improvement on the calculation side.

And as i said before, with the introduction of constructor-estimator suite i am sure we wont see ANY developments on that side.

[Anonymous]

Id like to say one thing:
If every difficult geometry with AC is possible, than it is good just for GS.
GS can say, every 3D modelling is now possible!

But for us it brings nothing:
Because I dont want to invest for this one, if for this funktion AC must be very expensive.

Every architect knows, if we can create good architectur with simple line (or logical straight or reasonable construction), than it is good for the client and constructor etc..... because of low building cost and good BOQ!

The aim of GS must have also this direction, how architect can create more easier and more better organise.
For this aim AC10 is nice update.