Shift to a subscription model - your questions are welcome

[Akos Pfemeter]

Dear Community,

You may have already read the press release or the Insights post about our strategic shift to a subscription model. 

Here is a quick summary of the news:

BUDAPEST, April 2, 2024—Graphisoft, the leading Building Information Modeling (BIM) software solution developer for architecture and multidisciplinary design, today announced that, as part of its strategic shift to a sustainable subscription software delivery model, perpetual licenses will be gradually phased out by the end of 2025. This change does not affect the delivery of Software Service Agreement (SSA)/Forward subscription services to existing customers. 

Archicad perpetual and SSA/Forward licenses will be available for new customers through December 31, 2024, and to existing customers through December 31, 2025. Starting in 2026, Archicad will be available only through subscription. Active SSA/Forward contracts will continue to be serviced beyond 2025. Alternatively, SSA/Forward customers can convert to Archicad Collaborate subscriptions at the same price as SSA/Forward. This offer is designed to help existing SSA/Forward subscribers take full advantage of the Archicad Collaborate subscription, which combines award-winning Archicad for architectural design with BIMx and BIMcloud SaaS for fast, efficient, secure, real-time access to shared projects.

Please ask your questions and share your thoughts here -- Graphisoft's expert team will try and provide answer to all sorts of questions you may have!
Thank you.
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Edit by Moderator:  here is the link to the evolving information/FAQ page about this announcement:

https://graphisoft.com/convert-ssa-forward-to-archicad-collaborate/

[thesleepofreason]

And yet another question is how the actual software service agreement which is between user and local distributor (not GS) is to be handled with regards to termination? I can't really see this as valid ground for termination for either part (it is no more force majeure than a bad business cycle). I assume GS will take care of it for conversions so that the termination period can be disregarded while any user just wanting out will be stuck paying according to the agreement... But what if the conversion program isn't available (or atleast the conditions known) for a specific market before the agreements period of notice ends - leaving the user unable to properly evaluate the decision situation?

[scottjm]

The point that a lot of people have made that if you were on SSA/Forward you were essentially on a subscription is partially true.
However the cost difference between that and a Collaborate Subscription is HUGE!! (at least in Australia) And a massive cost to swallow and accommodate into everybody’s already stretched business costs. 

We all knew the continuation of perpetual licensing was eventually going to disappear. 

I guess the saving grace is that atleast we are getting floating subscriptions and not named users. Hallelujah!!

My additional questions:

- What will happen to local distributors and support?

- Will BIMCloud Paid On Premise still be available and a cheaper offering than BIMCloud SaaS. I was always hesitant to be constrained by our internet connection for connections to BIMCloud. 
- Will there be other subscription packages: Archicad only (no BIMCloud or BIMx)?
- Will there be volume discounts available for multiple subscriptions?

- Where are the ground breaking new features to set Graphisoft apart from its biggest competitor?

[Karl Ottenstein]

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@scottjm wrote:

The point that a lot of people have made that if you were on SSA/Forward you were essentially on a subscription is partially true.
However the cost difference between that and a Collaborate Subscription is HUGE!! (at least in Australia) And a massive cost to swallow and accommodate into everybody’s already stretched business costs. 

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Hi Scott... cost difference may not be THAT huge...

This page:

https://graphisoft.com/convert-ssa-forward-to-archicad-collaborate

"Convert SSA/Forward to Archicad Collaborate" has an interesting promotional discount buried in a *footnote that covers a 6 year period after conversion (I first skimmed and thought it said months... but it is years!).

Copy/paste of footnote offer:  "*Special discount will be applied for the first 3-year subscription term to match SSA/Forward price if paid upfront. Subscription renews at the same discount percentage for an additional 3-year term. Contact your resellers for information on other subscription conversion options."

So, for the same "price" as current SSA/Forward ... if paying 3 years in advance vs 1... the first 3 years gives the Collaboration Package at the "same price" as renewal.   Have to come up with the cash in advance for 3 years' worth of payments (or pay interest on a loan) ... vs wonder how much SSA/Forward price will increase for each of those years anyway.

Years 4 through 6 get a big discount ... equal to the percentage that today's SSA price is vs today's subscription cost ... on whatever the future subscription cost will be.

So, it seems like a good deal for those firms that would want to convert anyway for various reasons (including needing BIMcloud SaaS).

Hard to get my head around if this would make any sense for a solo or small office...

EDIT/PS:  The "contact your resellers" part seems to suggest that our local distributors stay in the loop as part of our support network.  As you and others have noted - it would be good to clarify that, as (for example) in the US, lots of regional distributors were "cut loose" some years ago and their regions taken over by corporate.

[Martin Jules]

It's not clear at all:

"What are the options for customers after their conversion terms expire in 3 or 6 years?

The conversion discount coupon will expire, and the converted subscriptions will be renewed at the standard subscription list price. Alternatively, customers may fall back onto the perpetual path with their licenses. Their perpetual licenses will be upgraded to the most up-to-date perpetual software in such cases."

[Karl Ottenstein]

Agree about not clear.  Is it saying that if you decide to not continue to subscribe, that your subscripton behaves like an SSA/Forward subscription with respect to the perpetual license, and so the perpetual license will be upgraded to the then-most-current release of Archicad?  Or to the last version of Archicad that supported perpetual licenses - which after year 6 might be a version that is 4 years old?   Agree, we need clarity and an enforceable guarantee/contract...

[MinhNguyen]

EDIT: per the latest FAQ, I could explain that: the previous AC licensing technology is Codemeter. With cloud-based licensing introduced in AC27, a completely-new system is added that is not compatible with older AC version beyond AC25. With the subscription conversion, you would lose your ability to run older AC version to edit your current projects, therefore GS would provide some Codemeter keys to open those projects.

At some point in the future, GS would deprecate Codemeter, leaving newer Archicad to work only with the new cloud-based technology. Your perpetual Codemeter keys would get stuck at whatever version when this happens - and I'm not even sure what will happen with software-Codemeter key, whether that will still be running - or probably the infrastructure could be shut down too, so your best bet is a hardware dongle. And I think we have a date - somewhere around 2025/2026

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Starting in 2026, Archicad will be available only through subscription​

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[Karl Ottenstein]

😳

(We need social media reaction buttons vs just "like" for posts like yours, Minh!)

I suppose it is possible as part of SSA that they 'exchange' CM keys for cloud licenses though for perpetual licenses.  Graphisoft has a history of key exchanges in the past... from the original parallel port / Apple printer port dongle to the initial plastic WIBU USB key ... and later from that key to the metal USB Codemeter key... 

[MinhNguyen]

yes, I really hope that they figure out a way to at least somehow retain the usefulness of the current license technology - not everyone needs the latest and greatest features

[__archiben]

This is how I read it too, Karl, but for a solo license holder like me, having to stump up the first three years worth of SSA equivalent in advance is a big ask. It all sounds like a bit of a cash grab to me.

And the fine print: in taking up the offer you surrender your PLs. So if I can find the cash to pay three years in advance, then take the next three years at a discounted rate, if I can't afford the massive cost-uplift in year seven and have to walk away I am left with nothing. But if I stay on SSA I can use my PLs in perpetuity but will be stuck on the last version available (28?) at the end of 2025 . . .

~/BF

[Barry Kelly]

@__archiben 

I really wish that someone from Graphisoft will clarify all of this - as I am sure we all do.

Where is Graphisoft's expert team that are supposed to "try and provide answer to all sorts of questions you may have!"

FAQ answers are all well and good, but a quick answer to our questions will be so much better.

My take on this is, you do not have to take up the subscription if you have a perpetual license.

You can carry on with SSA/Forward support as you are doing now.

I do not believe there is a time limit on the SSA/Forward support - according to FAQ answer 3.

You will be able to upgrade to 29, 30, 31, etc as long as you are paying the support.

If you do take up the subscription offer, you will get a discount for the first 3 (6?) years but as you mentioned you must pay up front.

You will still have your perpetual licenses.

Should you decide to leave the subscription, then you will revert to the latest perpetual license at the time you stop the subscription.

They can't send you back to 28 if you have been working with 30, that would be completely wrong.

You will not have the option to go back to SSA/Forward support.

I assume you will not have the option to subscribe with those perpetual licenses again either.

They will now be locked at the version when you leave the subscription.

You will of course be able to take out a new subscription - but you won't ever own those licenses.

I am waiting for the offer to become available in Australia, just as you will be in New Zealand.

As soon as it is, I will be contacting Central Innovation to find out exactly what is happening.

But at the moment, I am happy with maintaining my SSA support.

Barry.

[thesleepofreason]

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@Barry Kelly wrote:

You will be able to upgrade to 29, 30, 31, etc as long as you are paying the support.

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And as long as the local distributor doesn't cease to be a local distributor.

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@Barry Kelly wrote:

If you do take up the subscription offer, you will get a discount for the first 3 (6?) years but as you mentioned you must pay up front.

You will still have your perpetual licenses.

Should you decide to leave the subscription, then you will revert to the latest perpetual license at the time you stop the subscription.

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No - you give up your current perpetual license upon entering the program as per - "When a customer enters the Conversion Program, they must surrender their perpetual Archicad licenses." So any "fallback option" is not so much an upgrade of your current perpetual licence but the provision of a new licence at the latest available Archicad  version. And besides from perhaps being 6 years in the future we also haven't seen any details about these terms and conditions - not sure if would count on GS upholding that part. Is there any other company that has had a similar "fallback option"? Allplan for example is a straight and easy to understand deal.

[Barry Kelly]

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@thesleepofreason wrote:

No - you give up your current perpetual license upon entering the program as per - "When a customer enters the Conversion Program, they must surrender their perpetual Archicad licenses." 

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I see, that is FAQ 10.

However FAQ 8 says that when the 3-6 year offer expires, and the subscription is not renewed ...

...customers may fall back onto the perpetual path with their licenses. In such cases, their perpetual licenses will be upgraded to the most up-to-date perpetual software – that is, to the version accessible at the time to SSA/Forward customers – albeit without the SSA/Forward coverage going forward.

So, once you go to subscription there is no turning back.

You will still have your perpetual license if you leave, which is one good thing, but it will be locked and no more upgrading.

I guess the options are ..

To stay with SSA support and hope fees don't go up too much.

Or lock in for 3-6 years with a large 3 year up front fee at current SSA pricing, with option to renew for a further 3 years, get all of the subscription collaborate features (even if you don't need them), and then be prepared to pay the larger subscription fee at the end of the 3-6 year term.

Barry.

[thesleepofreason]

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@Barry Kelly wrote:
You will still have your perpetual license if you leave, which is one good thing, but it will be locked and no more upgrading.

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Or more correctly - you will under some yet to be known terms and conditions get a perpetual licence for the current most-up-to date AC version. So not really a question of "still have". Or why not join the program and leave at the last day haven gotten both the price fix and a perpetual licence. And why wouldn't GS then just design the program differently so that we gave up the SSA, kept the perpetual license and for upfront payments got upgraded over 3+3 years?

[__archiben]

Yes, it's currently clear as mud.

I see this as a short term cash grab and longer term roadmap to reach price parity with Revit - and why shouldn't they be able to charge a similar cost as Autodesk for what is a pretty comparable product? They've just gone about it all Hungarian as usual 😀. I would imagine that SSA costs will be similar to Collaborate subscription costs in 7 years time. Horses for course. This deal will let us get there cheaper if we can afford an initial three year up front cost, or there will be a big price hike at the end of 2025.

~/BF

[Barry Kelly]

I am pretty sure that if the SSA cost increase, the subscription cost will also be increasing as well.

Perpetual license holders just have the opportunity to lock it in at a fixed price for 3-6 years.

How much they will each increase though is anyone's guess.

Barry.

[__archiben]

Yep, but the SSA has the scope to increase far more than a Collaborate subscription: that has to stay close to Revit and will never inflate unless Revit does. SSA, on the other hand, has a lot of float to get much bigger and still stay below Collaborate...

If you think SSA is going to be anywhere near the price it is now in 3-4 years you're dreamin'!

[Barry Kelly]

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@__archiben wrote:

Yep, but the SSA has the scope to increase far more than a Collaborate subscription: that has to stay close to Revit and will never inflate unless Revit does. SSA, on the other hand, has a lot of float to get much bigger and still stay below Collaborate...

If you think SSA is going to be anywhere near the price it is now in 3-4 years you're dreamin'!

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Sure the SSA fees are cheaper than Collaboration, but I don't see them increasing to match just because they can.

At least I hope not.

If that ever happens, I will simply stop paying the SSA support and lock my licenses as they are.

Then should I ever need to upgrade, I will take out a new subscription.

The 3-6 year fixed price deal is a very good one, even if just to fix at today's cost for that term.

But problem is, you are then stuck with subscription, whether you want it or not.

I am pretty sure Collaboration fees will increase every year as well.

Barry.

[DGSketcher]

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@Barry Kelly wrote:
Sure the SSA fees are cheaper than Collaboration, but I don't see them increasing to match just because they can.

At least I hope not.

If that ever happens, I will simply stop paying the SSA support and lock my licenses as they are.

Welcome to my world. As an overhead cost, this year they crossed a threshold. The prospect of paying double in the near future is not happening here. As I have said elsewhere, it's not just cost, it is also the diminishing productivity, complexity & instability of AC. If AC was twice as quick I might still be interested at the subscription rate, but that isn't likely to happen any time soon.

[mthd]

Did you get an official email from CI on the 5th April and 9th April 2024 ? I did and it confirms what you have derived from the FAQ’s. SSA/Forward is being serviced beyond 2025.

I quote Central Innovations in our region, in part: “Active SSA/Forward contracts will continue to be serviced beyond 2025. Alternatively, SSA/Forward customers can convert to Archicad Collaborate subscriptions at the same price as SSA/Forward.”

I am not taking up that offer in my circumstances to convert to a subscription but others may decide to do so.

I hope there a no more inflated price rises in the future.

[Barry Kelly]

I got an email on the 9th, but not the 5th.

When CI get there info together, I will be having a chat with them to clarify exactly what will be happening.

Barry.

[MinhNguyen]

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@Barry Kelly wrote:

...

Should you decide to leave the subscription, then you will revert to the latest perpetual license at the time you stop the subscription.

They can't send you back to 28 if you have been working with 30, that would be completely wrong.

...

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Hmm, I'm not quite sure about this Barry. Per FAQ:

...customers may fall back onto the perpetual path with their licenses. In such cases, their perpetual licenses will be upgraded to the most up-to-date perpetual software – that is, to the version accessible at the time to SSA/Forward customers – albeit without the SSA/Forward coverage going forward.

This could imply that, at some point, the "perpetual software" that is "accessible at the time to SSA/Forward customers" can be different from subscription. We don't know for sure. They chose their words very carefully here. To be honest, perpetual software doesn't make sense, much like these FAQs...