Will ArchiCAD have a future?

[Anonymous]

the topic is a partly answer to Mac Pro or Vista for AC and driven by a pain i feel for years and yes, the topic is discussed over and over in this forum.

i don't understand what's the buzz here: "which from the top workstations would be better?"

NONE

i'm not with archicad from the very beginning, it think it was 6 or 6.5.
sure, every next version up to that point has been an improvement. like 7 to 8.1 or 8.1 to 10. anyway- every version was developed in name of TOOLS we use in managing the project- and here we see a small change in actual way how the architects think and create architecture (except for using software for creatting bubble-architecture, and even here the solution within ac is external- maxonform:). things have become better, but..
but i just don't see (am i blind?) that the ac has been developed in the means of hardware specs, thus giving room for these software tools to work smoothly and delivering top experience. macs & pcs has grown, emmm... SIGNIFICANTLY over last 8 years.
the marginal upgrade in tools isn't reflected in upgrade how ac works with your hardware. archaic code.
i just can't stand the attitude from GS here. i mean the lines "we have to revrite code. it's huge task". no doubt it is.
archicadwiki techsupport

• no multithreading
ok, they say it's "partly". why?

(..) ArchiCAD will not be a fully multi-threaded application at any time soon. This is partly because re-writing the ArchiCAD code to support multi-threading is a huge task, and there are areas where it would not cause a dramatic performance increase. Graphisoft will focus on the areas where multi-threading brings the most benefit.

thus you don't need octocore (or even quadro) mac pro "at any time soon", because it's a big job for them. (if i think that ac on 8 cores would use 1/8 of the resources available- ).
• max 4bg ram
well, and if more is in your system, it craches. you have to use the terminal to switch off the "unneeded" ram. ^£%^$£%$
• 32 bit
nuts

Transferring a 32-bit application to 64-bit requires reprogramming even the most basic functions in the software, therefore the change to 64-bit in business softwares will happen at a much slower pace than the rapid change from 32-bit processors to 64-bit processors in the Personal Computer (PC) industry.

so mainly they are basing the answer once again on excuse, that it requres recoding ac + on a bad market practise "aww, the other business software developers are also slow on this". sorry, but that doesn't apply to other apps i use, ie, c4d, maxwell. yes, they are a different profile, but- whatever harware resources i give them- it's been effectivelly used. and that's the reason they REALLY are top software solutions. and the argument that archicad has 100x more lines of code can't be an argument.

and with the upcoming ac11... they've spent another year on writing code which sooner or later must been rewritten. with the intoduction of windoze vista more and more consumers will upgrade to 64bit systems. mac users are there already (+leopard will also be a push to abandon old g4 boxes (multicore g5 pros are still more than great)).
graphisofts advertising and managment has been pretty good, but they now have to consider answers to "i got top vista pc/i got the new mac pro octocore, but my ac isn't getting faster".
they can choose to lie about ac beeing top level software.
they can choose to get more unsatisfied customers by telling true "yes, we have worked only on tools, forgetting about cpus, bits and rams".
they can choose to sit down and rewrite ac12 as multithreaded, 64 bit application, which would give them further enormous room for implementing top cpu&ram intensive tools. those who would still use 32bit computers will have their maximum ac11 version. if he GS says "we don't have that much programmers", then it's simple as it gets- AC DOESN'T HAVE FUTURE. it's a fact. like the latvian saying "ko nevar celt, to nevar nest"- you can't carry what you can't lift.

i hope someday new ac version wouldn't be a hotfix for the previous one.

i'm sorry if i touched some of GS staff personally. i understand that you work hard, but, in my opinion, only such critism would maybe produce not only thoughts about brighter future for all of us, but you will finaly sit down, say "ok, this is the point we stop. and open new page for starting to code the real future AC version. yes, we trash the 20 year old and so beloved code, but that's the only way we can do it". ACT, please, ACT NOW! and take your time, i can live with 32bit AC11 if you state that there will be ac12 after 1.5years costing more, because you had to pay more programmers. i will buy it and bring flowers.

[Anonymous]

Bricklyne wrote:

Jacob wrote:
This is how I see it. Less firms with Archicad=Less users of Archicad=More pay for proficient users of archicad. Simple. I'm looking at the numbers and it's high time we realize that this will not be the big program in the future. Wishing away facts never works.

You're right in that wishing away facts never works, but sadly, nor do logic and rationale on these boards where GS is concerned most of the times.

Agreed. To the victor go the spoils. Even the best laid plans of mice and men go awry... although the R&D cannot be overlooked, market share trumps superior product development every time... especially true with Autodesk.

[TomWaltz]

Bricklyne wrote:
Less firms with Archicad=Less users of Archicad=Less licenses sold=Less resources/funds for R & D for future versions= Less competitive and powerful program.

You forgot:
Less companies using Archicad = fewer jobs for Archicad experts 😉

....especially once Autodesk realize that Macs may be becoming popular enough to warrant investing in a Mac-native Revit version.

I wouldn't hold my breath over that one. I'd bet on a Linux version of Archicad first (and play the lottery above both).

[Bricklyne Clarence]

TomWaltz wrote:
.......

....especially once Autodesk realize that Macs may be becoming popular enough to warrant investing in a Mac-native Revit version.

I wouldn't hold my breath over that one. I'd bet on a Linux version of Archicad first (and play the lottery above both).

....even if that eventually turns out to the the case (i.e., that Autodesk never develop a Mac-Native version of Revit), then it's still no reason for complacency on GS's part.

Otherwise they just might find themselves end up as the developers of a niche product for a niche market-base consigned to fighting with Vectorworks for a niche marketshare. Which is exactly where Autodesk woudn't mind them ending up.

[TomWaltz]

Bricklyne wrote:
Otherwise they just might find themselves end up as the developers of a niche product for a niche market-base consigned to fighting with Vectorworks for a niche marketshare.

Is this not already the case? 😉

[Anonymous]

TomWaltz wrote:

Bricklyne wrote:
Otherwise they just might find themselves end up as the developers of a niche product for a niche market-base consigned to fighting with Vectorworks for a niche marketshare.

Is this not already the case? 😉

It is already the case, and for all we know, maybe that IS the market strategy for GS.

[Dennis Lee]

I think AC is doing not too bad in some countries, right? It's hard to overcome decades of habit in using a certain company's software, after it has become the standard in that country.

Maybe a better strategy would be to target AC for the new emerging markets, or places where Autodesk does not have a strong presence yet.

Also, at the same time, AC should target students. The only way (and the most surest way) is to give them the tools to design whatever it is that they design in schools these days...

[Anonymous]

Dennis wrote:
I think AC is doing not too bad in some countries, right? It's hard to overcome decades of habit in using a certain company's software, after it has become the standard in that country.

Maybe a better strategy would be to target AC for the new emerging markets, or places where Autodesk does not have a strong presence yet.

Also, at the same time, AC should target students. The only way (and the most surest way) is to give them the tools to design whatever it is that they design in schools these days...

BIM as a whole is still in its infancy, and can reasonably be described as an emerging market. The student version is already free, so they have that market in their sights. In western Canada, I think GS would do well to increase their marketing presence. It is extremely rare to find ANYONE in architecture here who has even heard of Archicad, let alone tried, or actually uses it. I can only assume that their lack of presence in the western Canadian market is indicative of North America as a whole.

[Dennis Lee]

That is pretty much the case in the Western U.S. as well. The people who know about ArchiCAD are people who are getting into BIM though. Maybe when there are more people coming into BIM, more people will find out about AC.

I do know that the student version is free, but AC is really more geared to the professional user as of now. I wouldn't be using AC if I was back in school even though it's free (actually pretty much all the software were "free" in school), just because I wouldn't be able to model the things I would design in school. If AC had the necessary modeling tools AND was free, then it will really get picked up quickly by students.

Students these days don't even need training. They can learn themselves, teach each other in those all nighters at the studios, and guess what - we'll have expert AC users straight out of school for us to hire!

[Anonymous]

That is a good point. In university, Apple supplied our entire CAD facility with hardware, and MiniCAD (now Vectorworks) was the default software. Although a small percentage of firms use Vectorworks here, I'm sure their give away across North America had an influence. Form Z was also part of the software used.

[Dwight]

The major impediment in 2008 is not software awareness but lack of aptitude in mature users - ie: decision makers.

When i was in architectural graduate school, we read Thomas Kuhn's "Structure of Scientific Revolutions" addressibg technological change and how the old guys need to die in order for us to understand that the world is round.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Structure_of_Scientific_Revolutions

I anticipated that this study was relevant to prepare us for resistance to the advancement of building technology but i never thought it would be paramount to understanding why BIM has been adopted so slowly.