Revit 2012 Another horrible release

[Anonymous]

Man, it seems that Revit really doesn't want to compete with Archicad. I think many Revit users will switch now to AC.

http://autodesk-revit.blogspot.com/2011/03/autodesk-revit-architecture-2012.html

[Anonymous]

ejrolon wrote:

BIMTIM wrote:
I apologise for any of my statements that may have accidentally suggested that Graphisoft ever have, do or will intentionally mislead potential/current customers with any publication or presentation.

Every word they speak are unbiased, honest and true and I swallow each spoonful with a smile and a belch in satisfaction that I am being well nourished.

Enjoy...

BIMTIM,

You know that this is not the point and it is a very disappointing attitude to take.

1. This is a thread about "horrible release" for "Revit 2012"
2. BIM Server comes into it, suggesting that it is somehow trying to mimic GS functionality.
3. A document from GS marketing gets posted.
4. I read the post and instantly assume (wrongly?) that "Wan optimisation" is talking about Revit, as the pretty pictures shown are very similar to the AD pictures touting their "revit server" product.
5. I post a one liner offering disdain for the obviously (IMHO) Biased document.
6. I get flamed suggesting that I am unsubstantiated (suggesting that everything GS marketing has to offer is the unbiased gospel truth)
7. I lose interest in a pointless argument based on seeing that I lack the language to communicate what I am thinking (Enter one of the many impending childish retortes)
8. I stupidly re-engage based on some futile hope that there is any avenue for rational debate.

Revit Server has some 'realtime' elements that do allow real time collaboration. Because they are not visible, doesn't mean they don't exist. The current worksharing system inside revit (for many years now) has allowed sharing of design files with realtime elements.

I do hope that Graphisoft can start selling their product based on its functionality & merits, not based on how it compares to the (unmentionable, substandard) competition. The way people carry on in here about how useless Revit is makes me realise that there is a heap of denial mixed with a little jealousy and frustration.

[Bricklyne Clarence]

Karl wrote:

Bricklyne wrote:
I'm really confused.

When I asked if this guy was trolling in another thread, I was out of line????

How is any of this helping anybody?

Hi Clarence,

Yeah, I'm confused, too. Wasn't thinking of you in particular in my 'calm the waters' post... For anyone who is reading only this thread, I was asking for a mature discussion in this post in the 'other' current Revit-related thread:
http://archicad-talk.graphisoft.com/viewtopic.php?p=186490

Apparently, I asked more than BIMTIM can manage. Obviously no document from any manufacturer will be 100% objective. Can we move beyond petty throw-off lines and discuss, in this case, Revit work-sharing over the internet vs GS BIM Server, for example? As I said in my post, I'm sure BIMTIM has much to share. With these recent posts, though, he's definitely wearing his welcome thin by not sharing anything meaningful.

Thanks,
Karl

Karl,

The issue wasn't really Graphisoft's objectivity in that paper, at least I don't think.
Anybody who's bothered to read it knows that nowhere in it does GS mention Revit or any other competing products.
They basically discuss approaches to Design Sharing in BIM in a very general sense such that objectivity, frankly speaking, becomes a non-issue.

Furthermore the paper is meant to be an informational aid for their own product to their customers despite the "marketing" tag. So why shouldn't it be slanted towards their own product?

And I suspect that BIMTIM knows this too.

So for him to insinuate some sense of underhandedness on GS' part in that paper or to try an imply like they're trying to spread misinformation about a competitor's product, is just flat out trolling. Not to mention lying.

And then of course there's his behavior in the other thread, but you nipped that in the bud, - or so we thought, and then we come here and still with the snarky one-liners and snide underhanded wink-wink comments, and I'm like 'what's going on here?'

Anyway, your calm approach to handling it is much appreciated.
You're certainly much calmer and more level-headed than I ever would be.

[Eduardo Rolon]

BIMTIM I am not trying to flame you

1. Agree
2. Somewhat Agree. It makes sense to develop a sharing system in whatever platform no matter what approach you prefer.
3. Ok.
4. Ok. That would have answered my question.
5. Ok.
6. Since I was the one that asked then I assume you are referring to me, therefore I apologize. I really wanted to know what is wrong with the white paper besides the obvious that it is from GS therefore they will spin it in their favor.
7. Ok.
8. Ok though it sounds somewhat insulting.

…The way people carry on in here about how useless Revit is makes me realise that there is a heap of denial mixed with a little jealousy and frustration.

Here we get another possible miscommunication and unnecessary comment. What is the point of insulting other members?

[Anonymous]

Yay, We have progress.

The long and the short if it is.....

BIM Server is a great solution!

Revit Server is a great solution!

Guess what... Trying to use Revit Server with AC... FAIL

Trying to use BIM Server with Revit... Limited functionality (BIM server is not totally platform based, therefore useful for 'collaboration')

Comparing BIM Server and Revit server is like comaring Solibri to Navisworks. Or comparing a tower crane to a crawler. These are different tools with different applications and all very useful.

I have no problem with GS peddling their wares. I have no problem with their publications being biased (hey we all gotta make a living).

Point of clarity. I was not trying to insult users here. I was merely pointing out what I consider obvious. There is a lot of fear in this community. This is a thread that attempts to mitigate fears about a rival product.

I would prefer to see these forums used for constructive learning and progress. Not one comment has been made regarding my original post that is actually relevant to the thread!

Maybe we can all keep our posts to being on topic and informative. I will try my best, though sometimes it jumps out!!

[Anonymous]

Eduardo,
Ignore him....he's purposely come here just to pick a fight.
I assume he's a mate of that bimboom whatever site and needs to to vent I guess.
...and here we are nearly apologising to him!

I'll give him 10 out of 10 for being the best fanboy I've seen for a while.

[Anonymous]

OK, OK...

So it seems that "what we have here is a failure to communicate"...(with apologies toi the writers of Cool Hand Luke 😉 )

Really, we are all committed BIMmers here and are probably 99.9% in agreement on most things having to do with BIM. Even the parts about ArchiCAD's and Revit's relative strengths and weaknesses. Aside from the odd argumentative flourish (such as mild ad hominems and perhaps an occasional straw man) most of the posters here have shown a thoughtful and open minded approach overall.

I'm sure that if we all got together in a bar (or café perhaps to include our muslim brethren) we would have a rousing good time and the barbs and snark would be just good natured camaraderie.

I'm a bit tied up to go into much more at the moment but I look forward to hearing more from BIMTIM. I get the impression that he understands the inner workings of some of this better than I do (file formats in particular) and I would love to pick up some more juicy tidbits aong the way.

[Anonymous]

Rlcosta wrote:
Eduardo,
Ignore him....he's purposely come here just to pick a fight.
I assume he's a mate of that bimboom whatever site and needs to to vent I guess.
...and here we are nearly apologising to him!

I'll give him 10 out of 10 for being the best fanboy I've seen for a while.

Nonsense!

BimBoomBoy is an Autodesk dealer, and quite successful I believe, here in the states. It should be no surprise that he goes a bit overboard at times promoting his tribe/team.

BIMTIM is much closer to your end of the world and from what Karl suggests and his posts indicate is on the receiving end of the BIM process like most of us. He also seems to me to be quite reasonable and knowledgeable about both programs. As far as I can tell he is only a fan, like me, of getting the job done.

[Anonymous]

There is a lot of fear in this community

Another one liner where you draw your conclusions and speak for others. Try not doing that and stick to facts about the programs.

[Anonymous]

BIMTIM wrote:
Point of clarity. I was not trying to insult users here. I was merely pointing out what I consider obvious. There is a lot of fear in this community. This is a thread that attempts to mitigate fears about a rival product.

This is probably the sore point. There is a lot of concern with how well GS can stand up to a large and aggressive competitor. Nemetschek's style seems to be one of benign neglect and Graphisoft obviously has very limited means compared to Autodesk.

Those who have committed a great deal of time and resources to ArchiCAD are naturally nervous about the future which can lead to a bit of sensitivity to perceived unfair comparisons.

When you touch on matters of survival tribalism tends to bubble to the surface.

[Anonymous]

Matthew wrote:
I'm sure that if we all got together in a bar (or café perhaps to include our muslim brethren) we would have a rousing good time and the barbs and snark would be just good natured camaraderie.

I'll drink to that!

(no beer for me though, the yeast plays havoc with my gut flora! Top shelf suits best, Islay single malt anyone?)