Poorly written GDL Part Libraries

[rm]

WARNING: THIS IS A RANT ABOUT GS AND OTHER VENDORS OF POORLY WRITTEN AND INCONSISTENT LIBRARY PARTS. So you may not want to waste your time reading this if you don't experience problems with library parts, in particular doors and windows.

Doors and windows are without question the most commonly used library parts in most ArchiCAD architectural projects. Being continually frustrated by the limitations of so many of the libraries available to us ( not that there are many ). So, recently I decided to try the new GS AC limited edition library for the US on a model with quite a few doors and windows. Initially I was excited to see what on the surface looked like a good set of doors and windows, with good adjustablility, especially for those who need fairly realistic looking windows and doors for their models.

That said, I have asked GS before, but they seem not understand the importance of being able to assign a different material selection for all exterior surfaces ( read, sash, frames, jambs, sills, aprons, trim, and the like) versus interior surfaces on doors and windows. This may not be important if you don't use your models for renderings, but for those of us who do, it is a problem. It takes countless hours and attention to detail when sellecting parameters for materials so that your renderings will appear correctly both from the inside and out.

However, because of GS inflexible decision to continue to make window and door parts the way that they do, models can not be made to look correctly, concurrently, both on the inside and outside where windows and doors have different material selections. For buildings using, say aluminum storefront, not a problem, but for too many other building, it is. This is absolutely maddening.

Oh, and while your at it GS it makes much more sense, even for those who don't assign materials to their objects, to gang all material selections under one heading called, oh I don't know, say MATERIALS!!!!!!!!!!!!

To help make matters worse, I just noticed that there is still an inconsistantcy in the GS windows in setting materials for different surfaces depending what wood windows you select. On awing windows for instance the exterior trim color controls the interior trim color. Yet on "W Single Hung2" window the interior and exterior trim colors are set independtly as they should be. To make matters worse yet, the exterior sash color can not be set independent of the interior sash material, again rarely on a wood or aluminum clad window would this happen in the real world.

It is really getting quite old to find window and door part developers not checking their parts thoroughly. I don't want to single out GS on this either, as there is another major vendor here in the US of a large library that has doors and windows included in it that alledgely works well with AC 9. This well known unamed library developer has SO MANY errors and inconsistantcies in its door and window library, its a joke. I wrote that developer several times starting in February this year, and most of the errors I pointed out to him have not been fixed yet. Yet that library is still available for sale at Objects Online as well as numerous locations on the web. That particular developer has in the past always fixed found problems, but for what ever reason now just keeps selling "broken" library parts.....unbelievable!!!!!!

Unfortunately, people keep buying these libraries, and until a lot of time is invested in them, they might not find what inconsistantcies exist until it is crucial to them, usually the day before a presentation is due, and there is no time to fix the problem.

But Graphisoft really has no excuse for inconsistencies in their windows and doors. Each of there parts should be fully tested, in straight and curved walls, and masonry veneer walls ( READ, EACH WINDOW AND DOOR FULLY TESTED ). If GS doesnot feel qualified to test their own parts, then they should hire some of their customer to independently to do so. Im tired of haveing my office be a perpetual beta test site for library part developers!!!!!!! I could NEVER get away with this sloppiness in my Architecture practice. I'd be in court constantly. I spend way too much time taking screen shots, sending them to GS and other developers, only to find the problems ignored.

If we go through the trouble of documenting the problems for you GS, you should take the responsibility to fix these problems, even its for just one user, if infact it is a real problem with the library part.

I am currently submitting over a dozen screen shots of inconsistencies to GS tech support us, for bad library parts. Hopefully they will quickly resolve these issues and reissue the parts before v10 comes out. But I'm guessing that GS is putting almost all of its efforts into v10 and problems found in AC 9.0 at this point, are being tabled indefinitely.

Come on GS, we are on version 9.0!!!!!!! Considering the current catch phrase is BIM, you would think you guys would get rid of all your dated, and unrealistic library parts, and finally commision top dog GDL developers to build really solid libraries, and contract them to keep them up to date. Split 1 million dollars amongst ten GDL Gurus.....trust me they will come out of the wood work to jump on this opportunity.

Your modeling capabilities are constantly limiting design, especially without the use of dozens of add-ons, and your library parts are dismal at best. Look how few available parts there are available compared to the AutoCAD world. Manufacturers throw themsleves at Autodesk customers with free parts. And as BIM moves more from a marketing term to a real necessity, you guys keep churning out the same old tired parts....more and more Architects currently using AC will have no choice but to switch to Revit.

Radically improve your modeling and documentation tools. Those who write to this forum are a minority of users, and while too many here seem willing to evangilize AC to their death at any cost to the rest of us., most just want to get their job done faster and with more effeciency and industry standardization.

AutoCAD is going to hand you your lunch with a serving of REVIT if you guys don't stop repeating the same errors. Listen and fix problems that users keep bringing to your attention, without being called out on the table, like......... ( disclaimer to readers, this is one of my wishlist items, this is really for GS benefit, just in case someones actually listening )

http://archicad-talk.graphisoft.com/viewtopic.php?t=6583

....hope this was more than entertaining to those who made it this far
!

[David Collins]

TomWaltz wrote:
.....I long ago created a section marker that just looks the way it should, and has maybe 5 parameters...

A lot of valid points in there. I'm sure most of us could come up with lists just as long.

Part of the problem, I believe, is that Graphisoft has tried to create objects that can be used by every user in every part of the world, which is why objects like the section marker have a buzillion parametric settings. And they still fall short for most of us. A drop down list of more than thirty door leaf styles and guess what...? the door you want still isn't there. Take a deep breath and decide to add it yourself? Welcome to GDL macro hell. Kiss all your tweaks goodbye the next time Graphisoft updates its library.

I believe the only real answer is to create your own GDL objects from scratch. Okay, loud wails of anguish from all the "Dammit Jim I'm an architect, not a programmer" users, but you wind up with exactly what you want, in simple GDL script with only the parameters you personally need, like Tom's section marker.

As one who has been utterly defeated by the Calculate interface, I completely sympathize with those of us who can't make heads or tails of GDL, but seriously what are the options? Some sort of user-friendly graphic interface for parametric object creation is bound to to limit the endless potential of GDL scripting. The GDL manual definitely needs a serious rewrite in a language less reminiscent of ancient Aramaic, but maybe GDL itself needs to somehow become more user friendly.

[Anonymous]

The major item that i need to highlight here is the squatting toilet or mop sink. Is not inside the library. This type of the toilet was really commonly use in asia.

Please do not hesitate to info or send me one if who ever has developed one.

Reagrds

rm wrote:
WARNING: THIS IS A RANT ABOUT GS AND OTHER VENDORS OF POORLY WRITTEN AND INCONSISTENT LIBRARY PARTS. So you may not want to waste your time reading this if you don't experience problems with library parts, in particular doors and windows.

Doors and windows are without question the most commonly used library parts in most ArchiCAD architectural projects. Being continually frustrated by the limitations of so many of the libraries available to us ( not that there are many ). So, recently I decided to try the new GS AC limited edition library for the US on a model with quite a few doors and windows. Initially I was excited to see what on the surface looked like a good set of doors and windows, with good adjustablility, especially for those who need fairly realistic looking windows and doors for their models.

That said, I have asked GS before, but they seem not understand the importance of being able to assign a different material selection for all exterior surfaces ( read, sash, frames, jambs, sills, aprons, trim, and the like) versus interior surfaces on doors and windows. This may not be important if you don't use your models for renderings, but for those of us who do, it is a problem. It takes countless hours and attention to detail when sellecting parameters for materials so that your renderings will appear correctly both from the inside and out.

However, because of GS inflexible decision to continue to make window and door parts the way that they do, models can not be made to look correctly, concurrently, both on the inside and outside where windows and doors have different material selections. For buildings using, say aluminum storefront, not a problem, but for too many other building, it is. This is absolutely maddening.

Oh, and while your at it GS it makes much more sense, even for those who don't assign materials to their objects, to gang all material selections under one heading called, oh I don't know, say MATERIALS!!!!!!!!!!!!

To help make matters worse, I just noticed that there is still an inconsistantcy in the GS windows in setting materials for different surfaces depending what wood windows you select. On awing windows for instance the exterior trim color controls the interior trim color. Yet on "W Single Hung2" window the interior and exterior trim colors are set independtly as they should be. To make matters worse yet, the exterior sash color can not be set independent of the interior sash material, again rarely on a wood or aluminum clad window would this happen in the real world.

It is really getting quite old to find window and door part developers not checking their parts thoroughly. I don't want to single out GS on this either, as there is another major vendor here in the US of a large library that has doors and windows included in it that alledgely works well with AC 9. This well known unamed library developer has SO MANY errors and inconsistantcies in its door and window library, its a joke. I wrote that developer several times starting in February this year, and most of the errors I pointed out to him have not been fixed yet. Yet that library is still available for sale at Objects Online as well as numerous locations on the web. That particular developer has in the past always fixed found problems, but for what ever reason now just keeps selling "broken" library parts.....unbelievable!!!!!!

Unfortunately, people keep buying these libraries, and until a lot of time is invested in them, they might not find what inconsistantcies exist until it is crucial to them, usually the day before a presentation is due, and there is no time to fix the problem.

But Graphisoft really has no excuse for inconsistencies in their windows and doors. Each of there parts should be fully tested, in straight and curved walls, and masonry veneer walls ( READ, EACH WINDOW AND DOOR FULLY TESTED ). If GS doesnot feel qualified to test their own parts, then they should hire some of their customer to independently to do so. Im tired of haveing my office be a perpetual beta test site for library part developers!!!!!!! I could NEVER get away with this sloppiness in my Architecture practice. I'd be in court constantly. I spend way too much time taking screen shots, sending them to GS and other developers, only to find the problems ignored.

If we go through the trouble of documenting the problems for you GS, you should take the responsibility to fix these problems, even its for just one user, if infact it is a real problem with the library part.

I am currently submitting over a dozen screen shots of inconsistencies to GS tech support us, for bad library parts. Hopefully they will quickly resolve these issues and reissue the parts before v10 comes out. But I'm guessing that GS is putting almost all of its efforts into v10 and problems found in AC 9.0 at this point, are being tabled indefinitely.

Come on GS, we are on version 9.0!!!!!!! Considering the current catch phrase is BIM, you would think you guys would get rid of all your dated, and unrealistic library parts, and finally commision top dog GDL developers to build really solid libraries, and contract them to keep them up to date. Split 1 million dollars amongst ten GDL Gurus.....trust me they will come out of the wood work to jump on this opportunity.

Your modeling capabilities are constantly limiting design, especially without the use of dozens of add-ons, and your library parts are dismal at best. Look how few available parts there are available compared to the AutoCAD world. Manufacturers throw themsleves at Autodesk customers with free parts. And as BIM moves more from a marketing term to a real necessity, you guys keep churning out the same old tired parts....more and more Architects currently using AC will have no choice but to switch to Revit.

Radically improve your modeling and documentation tools. Those who write to this forum are a minority of users, and while too many here seem willing to evangilize AC to their death at any cost to the rest of us., most just want to get their job done faster and with more effeciency and industry standardization.

AutoCAD is going to hand you your lunch with a serving of REVIT if you guys don't stop repeating the same errors. Listen and fix problems that users keep bringing to your attention, without being called out on the table, like......... ( disclaimer to readers, this is one of my wishlist items, this is really for GS benefit, just in case someones actually listening )

http://archicad-talk.graphisoft.com/viewtopic.php?t=6583

....hope this was more than entertaining to those who made it this far
!

[Petros Ioannou]

jasontayguanyaw wrote:
The major item that i need to highlight here is the squatting toilet or mop sink. Is not inside the library. This type of the toilet was really commonly use in asia.

If I remember correctly there is a squatting toilet from Villeroy & Boch at GDL central

www.gdlcentral.com



Petros

[Petros Ioannou]

I just found 'them (2 objects). They are on the Pro category with name "Hock-Klosett-OMN-pro" and "Hock-Klosett-OMN-orienta".

Back to the topic now...maybe someone could comment the naming of these objects. Maybe there is a neeed for more than 27 characters in order to describe something? Same for files or dwg datails. There is an 'l' missing from oriental...

Petros

[Anonymous]

I need the squatting toilet object. Can anybody send me a copy? Appreciate

Thank you

Jason

jasontayguanyaw wrote:
Wa.. I really impressed with this talk forum. All these days i been asking myself where to ask when i am blocked.

Thank you really.

I went to the website but i cant see the object which i think is because of errors of the broken link?? What activeX??

Please advise

Thank you

jasontayguanyaw wrote:
The major item that i need to highlight here is the squatting toilet or mop sink. Is not inside the library. This type of the toilet was really commonly use in asia.

Please do not hesitate to info or send me one if who ever has developed one.

Reagrds

rm wrote:
WARNING: THIS IS A RANT ABOUT GS AND OTHER VENDORS OF POORLY WRITTEN AND INCONSISTENT LIBRARY PARTS. So you may not want to waste your time reading this if you don't experience problems with library parts, in particular doors and windows.

Doors and windows are without question the most commonly used library parts in most ArchiCAD architectural projects. Being continually frustrated by the limitations of so many of the libraries available to us ( not that there are many ). So, recently I decided to try the new GS AC limited edition library for the US on a model with quite a few doors and windows. Initially I was excited to see what on the surface looked like a good set of doors and windows, with good adjustablility, especially for those who need fairly realistic looking windows and doors for their models.

That said, I have asked GS before, but they seem not understand the importance of being able to assign a different material selection for all exterior surfaces ( read, sash, frames, jambs, sills, aprons, trim, and the like) versus interior surfaces on doors and windows. This may not be important if you don't use your models for renderings, but for those of us who do, it is a problem. It takes countless hours and attention to detail when sellecting parameters for materials so that your renderings will appear correctly both from the inside and out.

However, because of GS inflexible decision to continue to make window and door parts the way that they do, models can not be made to look correctly, concurrently, both on the inside and outside where windows and doors have different material selections. For buildings using, say aluminum storefront, not a problem, but for too many other building, it is. This is absolutely maddening.

Oh, and while your at it GS it makes much more sense, even for those who don't assign materials to their objects, to gang all material selections under one heading called, oh I don't know, say MATERIALS!!!!!!!!!!!!

To help make matters worse, I just noticed that there is still an inconsistantcy in the GS windows in setting materials for different surfaces depending what wood windows you select. On awing windows for instance the exterior trim color controls the interior trim color. Yet on "W Single Hung2" window the interior and exterior trim colors are set independtly as they should be. To make matters worse yet, the exterior sash color can not be set independent of the interior sash material, again rarely on a wood or aluminum clad window would this happen in the real world.

It is really getting quite old to find window and door part developers not checking their parts thoroughly. I don't want to single out GS on this either, as there is another major vendor here in the US of a large library that has doors and windows included in it that alledgely works well with AC 9. This well known unamed library developer has SO MANY errors and inconsistantcies in its door and window library, its a joke. I wrote that developer several times starting in February this year, and most of the errors I pointed out to him have not been fixed yet. Yet that library is still available for sale at Objects Online as well as numerous locations on the web. That particular developer has in the past always fixed found problems, but for what ever reason now just keeps selling "broken" library parts.....unbelievable!!!!!!

Unfortunately, people keep buying these libraries, and until a lot of time is invested in them, they might not find what inconsistantcies exist until it is crucial to them, usually the day before a presentation is due, and there is no time to fix the problem.

But Graphisoft really has no excuse for inconsistencies in their windows and doors. Each of there parts should be fully tested, in straight and curved walls, and masonry veneer walls ( READ, EACH WINDOW AND DOOR FULLY TESTED ). If GS doesnot feel qualified to test their own parts, then they should hire some of their customer to independently to do so. Im tired of haveing my office be a perpetual beta test site for library part developers!!!!!!! I could NEVER get away with this sloppiness in my Architecture practice. I'd be in court constantly. I spend way too much time taking screen shots, sending them to GS and other developers, only to find the problems ignored.

If we go through the trouble of documenting the problems for you GS, you should take the responsibility to fix these problems, even its for just one user, if infact it is a real problem with the library part.

I am currently submitting over a dozen screen shots of inconsistencies to GS tech support us, for bad library parts. Hopefully they will quickly resolve these issues and reissue the parts before v10 comes out. But I'm guessing that GS is putting almost all of its efforts into v10 and problems found in AC 9.0 at this point, are being tabled indefinitely.

Come on GS, we are on version 9.0!!!!!!! Considering the current catch phrase is BIM, you would think you guys would get rid of all your dated, and unrealistic library parts, and finally commision top dog GDL developers to build really solid libraries, and contract them to keep them up to date. Split 1 million dollars amongst ten GDL Gurus.....trust me they will come out of the wood work to jump on this opportunity.

Your modeling capabilities are constantly limiting design, especially without the use of dozens of add-ons, and your library parts are dismal at best. Look how few available parts there are available compared to the AutoCAD world. Manufacturers throw themsleves at Autodesk customers with free parts. And as BIM moves more from a marketing term to a real necessity, you guys keep churning out the same old tired parts....more and more Architects currently using AC will have no choice but to switch to Revit.

Radically improve your modeling and documentation tools. Those who write to this forum are a minority of users, and while too many here seem willing to evangilize AC to their death at any cost to the rest of us., most just want to get their job done faster and with more effeciency and industry standardization.

AutoCAD is going to hand you your lunch with a serving of REVIT if you guys don't stop repeating the same errors. Listen and fix problems that users keep bringing to your attention, without being called out on the table, like......... ( disclaimer to readers, this is one of my wishlist items, this is really for GS benefit, just in case someones actually listening )

http://archicad-talk.graphisoft.com/viewtopic.php?t=6583

....hope this was more than entertaining to those who made it this far
!

[Djordje]

Jason,

jasontayguanyaw wrote:
I need the squatting toilet object. Can anybody send me a copy? Appreciate

Browse to www.gdlcentral.com

Find Villeroy&Boch section.

You have two of them there.

You will probably have to install the GDL Plugin that will be automatically downloaded. You also have to register when you get there for the first time.

I can send you the objects, no problem, but then you would not know about GDL Central and would wait for someone's help again.

Also, check the References forum and the links to umptillions of mostly free GDL objects.

HTH,

[Anonymous]

Thank for your assistant. I already registered GDL central.
Enter to the relevant site for the toilet object. But then half way through error occured. Really required the object urgently.

thank

Djordje wrote:
Jason,

jasontayguanyaw wrote:
I need the squatting toilet object. Can anybody send me a copy? Appreciate

Browse to www.gdlcentral.com

Find Villeroy&Boch section.

You have two of them there.

You will probably have to install the GDL Plugin that will be automatically downloaded. You also have to register when you get there for the first time.

I can send you the objects, no problem, but then you would not know about GDL Central and would wait for someone's help again.

Also, check the References forum and the links to umptillions of mostly free GDL objects.

HTH,

[Anonymous]

Hello , Jason

Let me give you my GDL toilet. It's American Standard toilet. I make it by Zoom GDL.

[Anonymous]

Costom setting

[Anonymous]