Additive Selection question

[Anonymous]

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Hi community, I want you to forgive me if it's already asked but I couldnt find it.

See, in AutoCAD the selection tools works in an additive way. It keeps adding elements even if previously selected items are re-selected again. In ArchiCAD this works by intersecting, deselecting previously selected items if reselecting them.

I wonder if there's the choice to change this behavior to additive instead of intersective. It's a bit frustrating to see that I left some elements out and I have to make my selection all over again or go click on them one by one and checking overlappings to know that I'm selecting the right one.

Additionally, maybe a wishlist, if it's possible for ArchiCAD to check overlapped elements. The duplicate checker tool see if there are repetitive elements but it would be nice if it could also check for smaller lines being overlapped by bigger ones. Just a suggestion.

Thanks!

[Anonymous]

To accumulate (or de-accumulate) to a selection hold down the shift key. Overall ArchiCAD's selection tools are far and away the best of any program I've used. They sure beat AutoCAD and Revit all hollow.

[Anonymous]

Hi Darius,

I've used both programs a lot over the years, and am comfortable with either method. But it would be interesting to try out ArchiCAD using an additive selection method; it might work even better!

I suppose it comes down to how often you need to select multiple individual elements at the same time. Having to hold down Shift in addition to selecting them with the mouse is an 'extra' task to be doing with your other hand, as opposed to just selecting them with the mouse. You still have to Shift-Click to deselect any elements mistakenly selected with both methods.

I would say that reducing the need to hold down the Shift key so often is a good argument to at least offer the additive selection method as an option in the work environment settings. It certainly wouldn't hurt or slow down the workflow, so I'd support the wish if one was posted. It might even help those migrating from AutoCAD to ArchiCAD perhaps!

Regarding the overlapping lines, have you checked out the 'Linework Consolidation' tool found in the Edit>Reshape menu? There are a number of options that specify how it will deal with lines above each other.

[Anonymous]

Peter wrote:
...But it would be interesting to try out ArchiCAD using an additive selection method; it might work even better!

The problem is you would have to lose the click to deselect which I use constantly. This is actually one of my main irritations with AutoCAD, the chore of deselecting stuff. Perhaps there is a better way (besides the context menu) that I don't know of.

I find there is a simplicity and elegance to ArchiCAD's use of shift to both accumulate and de-accumulate a selection. In Revit it is control to accumulate and shift to deselect which I find a bit clumsy.

[Anonymous]

Matthew wrote:

Peter wrote:
...But it would be interesting to try out ArchiCAD using an additive selection method; it might work even better!

The problem is you would have to lose the click to deselect which I use constantly. This is actually one of my main irritations with AutoCAD, the chore of deselecting stuff. Perhaps there is a better way (besides the context menu) that I don't know of....

That's true; there is a lot of ESC button pressing to deselect stuff in AutoCAD. The best way I have found to reduce the inconvenience is by setting the thumb button on the mouse to act as ESC. It then becomes a very fast and natural way of deselecting anything with no extra hand movement.

Regardless, I still would be interested in trying ArchiCAD out with this method.

(I thought I'd also mention that my views on AutoCAD are based on quite an old version we have in the office. I don't know if there have been any better methods introduced in newer versions.)

[Anonymous]

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Ahm, perhaps I wasnt clear enough. Excuse my english 😉

But in fact I like holding Shift for adding objects to the selection. I think it's just natural to work with one hand in the mouse and the other in the keyboard, maybe a bit like a pilot's hands, one in the stick, the other in the throttle's control.

I was rather asking about the de-selecting nature of Archicad. I think I prefer more Adobe's way of selecting. Hold Shift, and everything you select is added. Hold Alt, and everything you select is subtracted. Easy and intuitive, imo.

But in Archicad having objects already selected, if holding shift you select them again, they are subtracted from the selection. Is like an intersection-kind of selection. I know I can just draw an irregular selection shape to have further control, but it would be nice if I can just use Shift/Alt for Adding/Subtracting.

Maybe I'd need to post this in the wishes section?

At any rate, thanks for the comments and for the Linework Consolidation tip, I'll check it out now 😉


PS: Shhhhhh*t!!!!!! I should have read the manual with more care, Linework Consolidation would have saved me lots of hours out of just editing 2D elements ;___;

[Barry Kelly]

Personally I can't see the difference between using the SHIFT key to deselect elements or the ALT key to do the same.
Either way you have to press a key and click on an element.

It is pretty straight forward to just use the SHIFT key for both - but then I am not used to any other methods (softwares).

Don't forget that when holding the SHIFT key and hovering the mouse above an element/s the one that will select or de-select will highlight in a different colour (so long as you haven't played around with the work environment settings).

If that is not the element you want and there are others at the same location you can use the TAB button to cycle throughall available choices.

Barry.

[Anonymous]

Barry wrote:
Personally I can't see the difference between using the SHIFT key to deselect elements or the ALT key to do the same.

Right now shift is a toggle between selected and unselected states. What Darius is suggesting is to use the alt/option key for deselection. The problem I see with this is that alt/option by itself or in combination with other keys already has other (valuable) functions.

I find that ArchiCAD has the most elegant, subtle and complex modifier key to cursor/click relationship of any program I have used and suspect at this point that any change is likely to do more harm than good.

[Anonymous]

Matthew wrote:
I find that ArchiCAD has the most elegant, subtle and complex modifier key to cursor/click relationship of any program I have used and I doubt at this point that any change is likely to do more harm than good.

Choices, gentlemen! The idea is to make it an option, not a default state. I guess lot of you felt uncomfortable at first with the change from 8.1 to 9 (at least it was for me) yet with time one understands the power of added choices.

Also, Im not saying it has to be with Alt. Maybe Shift+Alt. The point is that intersection-selection is not the best way of selection.

Just yesterday I draw a square to select some elements in an axis I needed to move but I left 3 lines of a square unselected. If I had additive selection, I would just needed to draw a "Entire Elements" square selection over the square with shift and done. With intersection-selection, I do that, and I end up with those 3 lines selected but the first line unselected. Yes, it could be as easy as go clicking every line while pressing Tab to keep the right one selected, but compare that many clicks and concentration to just drawing another square.

And that's just 3 lines of a square, sometimes I need more complex selections that just makes me deselect everything and start again.

Imo, there should be an option (as I guess by now this behaviour cant be changed in archicad) for the kind of selection that happens when one presses shift (additive or intersective) and to define another combo, when additive is selected, to deselect.

[Anonymous]

Darius_bd wrote:
Choices, gentlemen! The idea is to make it an option, not a default state. I guess lot of you felt uncomfortable at first with the change from 8.1 to 9 (at least it was for me) yet with time one understands the power of added choices.

I have seen good programs crushed by the addition of too many choices. Adding features is not always a good thing

Also, Im not saying it has to be with Alt. Maybe Shift+Alt. The point is that intersection-selection is not the best way of selection.

Alt/option+click and shift+alt/option are already dedicated to important functions, as are command/control+click and command/control+option/alt+click. There really isn't much room for other functions here.

Just yesterday I draw a square to select some elements in an axis I needed to move but I left 3 lines of a square unselected. If I had additive selection, I would just needed to draw a "Entire Elements" square selection over the square with shift and done. With intersection-selection, I do that, and I end up with those 3 lines selected but the first line unselected. Yes, it could be as easy as go clicking every line while pressing Tab to keep the right one selected, but compare that many clicks and concentration to just drawing another square.

And that's just 3 lines of a square, sometimes I need more complex selections that just makes me deselect everything and start again.

The condition you describe is a rare one in my experience and easily avoided most of the time. When I do run into this it doesn't seem to hard to click to deselect and then click, click again for the correct selection.

Imo, there should be an option (as I guess by now this behaviour cant be changed in archicad) for the kind of selection that happens when one presses shift (additive or intersective) and to define another combo, when additive is selected, to deselect.

Revit has this feature (control to select, shift to deselect) and I find it more annoying than helpful, and that's just by itself and not counting that Revit largely lacks ArchiCAD's smooth and sophisticated selection tools.

Sorry if I'm going on a bit much about this, but the selection tools are an aspect of ArchiCAD that not only is not broken but is far ahead of anything else out there.