AC 17, Moving in 3D, Auto level assignement

[Anonymous]

Hi,
AC17 is great really, But it's really annoying, In 3D view when I move object (form, wall, slab...) in heigt AC auto change the level assignment. And it is not a good thing !!!

Is there a way to disable this auto-function?

[Rick Thompson]

robert wrote:
No one in beta testing program ever report this?

You can talk about it all you want, and report it as a bug, but it comes with a new "feature". A beta tester is just that, a tester. It doesn't mean you like the new feature. However, it evidently gives some usability people have wanted and some do like it. I am hoping once i get use to it it will be fine, and maybe offer something new that is beneficial. I don't like it now and I didn't like it in testing. I am glad to see this dialogue.

[Eduardo Rolon]

Still don't like it and have decided to not upgrade any current projects from 16 to 17 since the potential for errors is too high even with the other benefits I would get from the other features.

For new projects I'll start them in 17 to see if I get use to it or I am able to figure out the workarounds.

[Anonymous]

What really sucks for me is that I was really looking forward to exploring all the enhancements of what I had been calling the "wish list edition". Now I'm not sure if I can use it at all. It seems OK on the little house I started out with but I don't yet see how I can work around this productively on my big hospital and such projects.

If ArchiCAD is moving toward more automatic functions that may or may not do what I want the advantages to me over using Revit become fewer and fewer.

It's times like this that I find the auto-censor function of the forum rather frustrating.

ETA: I also find it frustrating that such a major change in functionality is made with little or no mention and, as far as I am aware, no explanation as to why it's better, nor how, if possible, to maintain or replicate the old functions.

[Eduardo Rolon]

Matthew wrote:
…ETA: I also find it frustrating that such a major change in functionality is made with little or no mention and, as far as I am aware, no explanation as to why it's better, nor how, if possible, to maintain or replicate the old functions.

At the time everybody was reporting it as bugs, multiple times. I hope that they roll-it back as they did when walls kept moving automatically between floors.

[Anonymous]

ejrolon wrote:

Matthew wrote:
…ETA: I also find it frustrating that such a major change in functionality is made with little or no mention and, as far as I am aware, no explanation as to why it's better, nor how, if possible, to maintain or replicate the old functions.

At the time everybody was reporting it as bugs, multiple times. I hope that they roll-it back as they did when walls kept moving automatically between floors.

I guess it's just as well I'm not beta testing anymore. I don't need such aggravation.

[sinceV6]

I'm prepared to be punished for what I'm about to say.

Putting the issues I mentioned aside (for objects that must remain in the same spot disregarding story height adjustments), I really don't see the big BIG issue.

Yeah, the way it now functions is lacking a bit, but it is just a different way of working. There is some logic to how this works.

Think of the home story as the start point of the element. If you change this in the info box (the home story) you are telling AC that the object starts somewhere else, if you elevate it (in 3D) to another level, AC will change it's home story (and tell you in tracker) unless you explicitly tell it that you are elevating the element to another story but want it linked to the same story.

If you use top and bottom (t: & b: ) in the info box, you will be changing the offset to the home story, not the home story itself. In 3D, section or elevation this works as well (t: & b: )

These options and the way they work are explained in the new features videos regarding element linking to stories.

Some will like it, some will not. The same thing happened with the guidelines and the orange orb, remember?

What I don't like is that if you elevate a wall and AC or you change its home story, any door or window remains linked to the original story; and to change it you need to link it to the other story AND then adjust the level to that story (as relinking does not changes this).

I still think there should be an option to keep elements free (not linked) from story level changes, and maybe I haven't seen the big picture here.

[Anonymous]

The reason it's a killer for me is I frequently need to move elements from one story to another without changing their elevation. I also need things to stay on the story where I put them. Both of these seem to be much more difficult in 17 to the point where it may not be worth the bother.

Perhaps there is some way around this that I haven't found yet but from what the beta testers here are reporting I am not optimistic.

Since the projects in question are typically very large, complex, multistory buildings the potential for problems on top of the added work may make AC17 essentially useless to me. I will take a closer look. Hopefully I can figure something out. Or perhaps GS will fix the problem but they would have to first admit that it is one.

Eduardo, I'm curious to know if you've figured out any tricks for dealing with this. If nothing changes I may have to get that punching bag after all 😉

[sinceV6]

Matthew wrote:
The reason it's a killer for me is I frequently need to move elements from one story to another without changing their elevation. I also need things to stay on the story where I put them. Both of these seem to be much more difficult in 17 to the point where it may not be worth the bother.

Hi, Matthew.
The second one I don't really see a problem. Things will stay in the story you put them, unless you explicitly change it or elevate it to another one (and let AC change it now knowing it does that).

The linking is great, once you get it. I mean... make something simple: 4 walls and a floor. Repeat those to multiple levels. Adjust walls' offset to where they should be (maybe using the adjust elements to slabs command) and when it is all setup, go and change your story heights. For me is just great! Everything should stay how you set it regardless of height changes.

There's an option for hotlinked modules as well to adjust top-linked to the floor heights of the host file or to keep the original height (break the top-linking).

As for the first one... I don't do that very often. Can you share an example?

[Anonymous]

My stories are organized according to what I need to export for coordination. This rarely resolves to "everything between this and that elevation". In part this is because "stories" are often multilevel, particularly when parking structures are involved. It is also in the nature of plumbing and structural systems not to neatly resolve into flat slices of the building.

I have also found it difficult to get story assignments 100% correct when I'm slamming out a huge, complex model. To fix this I view the project in 3D filtered one story at a time and can quickly move the misplaced parts to where they belong. At least I could in 16. No longer.

Perhaps the increased auto-assign function will help with getting things where they belong but I am not optimistic so far. I suspect it will create even more problems as I can't see how it can be tricked into fitting my criteria.

As I said, I will take a closer look to see if this is really the death blow it appears to be but so far it's not looking good.

BTW: If the new functionality helps you and if there are a lot more like you than like me then perhaps this is the right move for GS. Just sucks for me.

PS: I've been using AC since v3.43. I know the program in intricate detail and understand the reasons for and possible advantages of the new story relations. It's just that the way it's been implemented the feature doesn't do much for me and it seems to have wrecked a function that is very important to my practice. It is similar to the way the addition of the guidelines have eroded (unnecessarily as far as I can see) the functionality of the coordinates palette, but much worse in its impact for me.

[Eduardo Rolon]

The main problem I've had has been with remodels. Existing building with new construction and new levels. Before 17 I could work freely and as the design progressed I could adjust the story levels and the relationship between existing and new construction in 3D would stay put. Now I have to be careful on how I edit the story levels since Exiting elements CANNOT move.

For example in a 2 story house remodel what happens to the existing roof if I link the existing story to the second floor and then I had to move the story levels +2'-0" because I need to route a Beam that the structural engineer asked for. Or if the client now wants that the height for the new construction on the first floor to be 15'-0" above the existing level which was 10'-0" high.

Now I have to be extremely careful with how I work and I have to coordinate 3D position and/or Home story all the time. I have a standing order at the office that story levels cannot be edited on remodelation projects on pain of death because I cannot predict how AC will move objects. Also I have to keep open a separate AC file as a reference to check if something moved by mistake.

This was not a problem before.
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I might get used to it but it has brought extra work to something that was simple before. About the orange blob pressing "Q" turns it off and on so it does not bother me.

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Main work around has been to add 'Relink Home Story" to my toolbar.