Modeling
About Archicad's design tools, element connections, modeling concepts, etc.

No More Power PC Support

Anonymous
Not applicable
I suppose this is common knowledge, but according to a GS press release Power PC will no longer be supported beyond 2009 (or I believe version 12).

While this makes sense the way hardware is moving, it does makes life a little harder for us PPC users. As it is, AC 11 runs very slowly on my dual G4 and dual G5. Disabling auto rebuild etc, helps, but for the moment I have gone back to AC 10.

Had I know 11 would be so slow I would have waited to upgrade.

Don Lee
47 REPLIES 47
Anonymous
Not applicable
TomWaltz wrote:
Is there any possibility this is all because of something YOU did? If the problem was that bad, I would think it would be much more widespread.

HI Tom,

None whatsoever. Apple doesn't replace HW for software or user errors-.. unless of course, the HW is being destroyed by an error in the kernel. And it is widespread.

Any machine out of the box will give the same result.

http://www.supload.com/vid/Bug+A/1169269441/mov/

The images move according to the sound level.

The movie is a part of one of my many bug reports made with an app I created which started out as an iMovie plug-in. You can see I have a grasp on the new technologies in Mac OS. The project I am trying to complete is primarily PDF's and the project was created in iMovie 5. I need them to display for a set duration of 3, 5 or 8 frames (according to Mark Bentford this is beyond the scope of Mac's abilities) and the OS keeps converting them to 9 seconds and 29 frames. Huge difference.

The G4 I was using was replaced with a MBP as it was falling apart and along with it went the disks w/iMovie 5 the remaining G4 lacks the required SW or HW, now I can't open old ones or create new from scratch.

Have you ever received an older version of SW when buying new? Why is Apple giving purchasers of iLife 08 iMovie 6.0.4 for free? Why as a licensed user of iLife 06 can't I upgrade to 6.0.4? Why does iMovie 08 time-stamp imports with dates in 1903 and 1904? Why can't I read a DVD on the machine it was created on? Seems to me Information Assurance and Common Criteria cannot be maintained on these machines. Why would Apple rather replace my machine/parts than provide me a copy of iMovie 5? How about that spring 07 release of Leopard? I missed that one too. Will it really come in Oct? Will these issues pertaining to time be resolved?

Every hardware issue including the batteries, processors, grfx cards etc is the same. The "World's most advanced OS" is a bit behind the times. One of the G4's in question was shipped with OS10.1.2 and therefore not supposed to experience the same battery issues as those that shipped with 10.2+ Batteries and chargers fry and fail while "Calculating Until Full". Apple had replaced numerous motherboards, combo drives, displays, along with batteries and chargers (at my expense including 2 iGo chargers) on the G4's until I finally had enough and gut sucked into the over glorified G4 called the MBP1,1.

I find this in crash reports on a regular basis. 2007-08-23 10:13:30.128 SyndicationAgent[531] WARNING: BestCalendarDateFromString - can't interpret: 'Thu 23 Aug 2007 05:35:44 -800'

The remaining "unsupported" G4 boots into all OS's from 9 to 10.4 except X.2 as it will not install on the machine and all hardware works booted into anything but 10.4. If I need to use an external HDD that's what it is connected to. A G5 that I was using is the same. Video cameras do not work and if you can force it to see it the durations are way off and sound is not in sync. Boot into 10.3.8 w/QT 6.5 and all is fine. Aside from a recent WIBU key issue, which was no longer seen after a security update, I keep coming back here as I am completely puzzled as to why this is the only forum that isn't reporting HW and SW issues with the Macs. Another poster had asked if anyone has a machine that screams in 2D. We must be careful of what we ask for as I have such machines. The processor will scream just emptying the trash. I have hours of videos of various machines doing the same. Desktop users are mostly unaware of this while it is happening as the machine is usually not on their lap. Apple's own Discussion forums are full of similar issues.

Jeffrey
Stress Co_
Advisor
Stress wrote:
Thanks Tom ..... I'll see what an extra 4 GB will do.
Apparently... not so much.
Tested elevation rebuilds/generating 3d model/sketch renderer before and after adding ...... with no speed bump what so ever.
A bit disappointing. Maybe it's my 1.8 GHz single G5 processor?
Marc Corney, Architect
Red Canoe Architecture, P. A.

Mac OS 10.15.7 (Catalina) //// Mac OS 14.5 (Sonoma)
Processor: 3.6 GHz 8-Core Intel Core i9 //// Apple M2 Max
Memory: 48 GB 2667 MHz DDR4 //// 32 GB
Graphics: Radeon Pro 580X 8GB //// 12C CPU, 30C GPU
ArchiCAD 25 (5010 USA Full) //// ArchiCAD 27 (4030 USA Full)
Anonymous
Not applicable
Jeffrey:

Thank you for your detailed replies, but much of it is beyond me. Do you think you might summarize a bit? I mean what does it mean from a practical standpoint as an ordinary architect trying to use AC11 on a 2-1.8 G5.

Back to one of my points when I originally posted here. Despite utilizing the speed "tweaks" recommended by GS, I have decided to go back to AC10.

Wish someone had told me so that I could have saved the upgrade cost for 2 licenses. Then again others are using AC11 with similar hardware successfully? I really don't know.......

Don Lee
Anonymous
Not applicable
Don wrote:
Jeffrey:

Thank you for your detailed replies, but much of it is beyond me. Do you think you might summarize a bit? I mean what does it mean from a practical standpoint as an ordinary architect trying to use AC11 on a 2-1.8 G5.

Back to one of my points when I originally posted here. Despite utilizing the speed "tweaks" recommended by GS, I have decided to go back to AC10.

Wish someone had told me so that I could have saved the upgrade cost for 2 licenses. Then again others are using AC11 with similar hardware successfully? I really don't know.......

Don Lee
Hi Don

If you didn't custom order your machine it most likely lacks support for 10.4 and AC 11. Even if you opted for the 128 MB GC upgrade it would be (IME) too small to do what you want/need. As for others using similar machines how similar are they? Those who opted for the 256MB graphics card most likely have a quicker visual response. Success is relative. For some, drafting with AC is successful. You will get many people saying 128 will work and it will, just not as fast or efficient as a larger one and because of the way Apple implemented the use of OpenGL you won't notice mush difference going from 64 to 128 if any at all. A Trabant will get you from point A to B but a BMW will do it quicker and a bit more comfortably at lower rpms.

So check your graphics card and upgrade it if necessary. Make sure the new GC is Quartz Extreme. QE is very important. One symptom of 10.4 I have seen in the G5's are failing graphics cards.

Are you current with updates? 10.4.8 was/is a nightmare 10.4.10 seems to be a bit more stable but "Rock Solid" isn't the way I'd describe it. It's actually more like a sedimentary rock with layers of Talc and Gypsum crumbling under the Quartz. Apple should have done what AC did and develop the OS's independently.

I refrain from using external devices as these cause a problem these days slowing things down and not appearing in the finder and other applications for what they are. i.e. USB HDDs will sometimes show as a camera and therefore the device is not ready or available to anything.

From a practical standpoint I'd get a new hard drive and graphics card, format the HDD; Apple Partition Scheme > use Non journaled partitions create and organize your partitions according to file/project types. i.e put your iTunes Library on a single partition, put All your ArchiCAD Libraries on it's own separate partition (every library, including textures, you have ever used should be here). ArchiCAD projects on their own Partition as well. My ArchiCAD project folders included all files and documents pertaining to the client and were organized by year. All photo's and images on a single partition though your textures should be in your AC library partition. And so on-..

Note that everything must be in a folder somewhere and not on the top level of the HD especially time-stamped files i.e. mov, jpg, mp4, dmg-.., Opening the HD icon in the finder should reveal folders only and no files.

Hide your music and media files from Spotlight. System Preferences > Spotlight > Privacy > at the lower left of the container field select the add "+" button. Select your AC partition (not the AC library) music library etc and unless you are going to be looking for system files the OS partitions should be "hidden" as well. The drawback of this is that when (if ever) you do need to search these partitions with spotlight they need to be indexed again and large partitions will take a while. You can even hide or unmount any of these partitions when not in use so they only show up in Disk Utility and don't clutter the DeskTop or Finder.

Wipe the original HDD and partition it the same way only this time create a 5 GB partition for the OS that was shipped with the machine and any OS's you've used successfully for any length of time (or for example the last OS for a version of AC you've used for a lot of projects) and about 30 GB for 10.4 and 30-35 GB for 10.5. I always put boot-able partitions first and the first partition is always the OS that shipped with the machine. Knowing your computer history is somewhat necessary to be more specific.

If you don't use widgets get rid of them. Refrain from using iTunes, Safari or the QT applications when using AC. On my intel I have two 10.4 OS's installed and one is stripped to the bare minimum stripped of apps and system files that are not used or that interfere with the apps or HW I use. Just the removal of Safari, iTunes, iChat and Widgets increased the reliability and speed of this machine while booted into the stripped OS.

I avoid Universal Binary apps as I find they are too slow and create too many problems with other apps and HW.

Note: When using non journaled partitions I recommend the use of a backup battery as journaling is a safety feature. Keep in mind a backup battery is to allow you to shut things down properly and most are not designed to run the machines. You don't want to try to save when your battery is about dead.

Sorry for the slow replies as I am not always connected. What are our full machine specs? HDD size, VRAM, apps, etc. I am real curious as to your graphics card.
TomWaltz
Participant
To be blunt.... this is such a load of crap it's unbelievable.

I have 50 (five-oh, fifty, funfzig) stock Dual 1.8 or 2.0 GHz G5's running Archicad 11 on OS 10.4 without any problems. I also have 15 Intel machines, also stock, running without any problems. Projects range from 4000 to 300,000 SF. People run Archicad, Thunderbird, Firefox, iTunes, iCal, and sometimes even CS2 (or CS3, depending on whether they are on the G5 or the Intel) all at the same time.

Nothing custom, nothing special, and above all, no fear mongering involved.

I'm grateful for the slow response because it slows the spread of such bull-oney.
Tom Waltz
Ralph Wessel
Mentor
TomWaltz wrote:
To be blunt.... this is such a load of crap it's unbelievable.
I have 50 (five-oh, fifty, funfzig) stock Dual 1.8 or 2.0 GHz G5's running Archicad 11 on OS 10.4 without any problems.
I'm with Tom here - I can't make any sense of these complaints, nor have I experienced anything like this on a wide variety of Macs. My experience of the Mac OS is that it is really dependable and reliable. I have all kinds of things running simultaneously, and took no special precautions or changed standard configurations.

A number of these complaints seem to target iMovie 08. This release has drawn complaints from some quarters because it now firmly targets the naive or inexperienced user who simply wants to produce a video and share it on the internet with a minimum of fuss or learning. To that send, Apple has stripped off things that would confuse a beginner and used conventions that they can relate to. Video pros don't necessarily like this, but I think it is the right approach for the target audience. Apple has other products for experienced users who want video high-end editing, e.g. Final Cut (Express).
Ralph Wessel BArch
Active Thread Ltd
TomWaltz
Participant
Stress wrote:
Stress wrote:
Thanks Tom ..... I'll see what an extra 4 GB will do.
Apparently... not so much.
Tested elevation rebuilds/generating 3d model/sketch renderer before and after adding ...... with no speed bump what so ever.
A bit disappointing. Maybe it's my 1.8 GHz single G5 processor?
that's really surprising (bordering on improbable). You don't see any difference in any application from the extra RAM? Is OS X recognizing it?
Tom Waltz
Dwight
Newcomer
Stress wrote:
Stress wrote:
Thanks Tom ..... I'll see what an extra 4 GB will do.
Apparently... not so much.
Tested elevation rebuilds/generating 3d model/sketch renderer before and after adding ...... with no speed bump what so ever.
A bit disappointing. Maybe it's my 1.8 GHz single G5 processor?
Lads:

Let's clarify some things since parts of this thread are way off track:

The role of RAM is to store data and exchange it quickly with the processor. You will NEVER see a speed increase until Archicad actually uses up all of the available RAM. This means that on a HUGE model [as assembled in the 3D, not the stored file], once the RAM is committed, Archicad starts to SWAP data back and forth between the hard drive and the RAM. Talk about slow! You could get out and walk faster than that!

I have 3.5 Gigamegs of RAM and Archicad NEVER addresses more than 1.9 Gb in the most complex rendering.

As for single or dual processors - Archicad runs on only one processor unless it is rendering. So there's no advantage to having dual processors during model assembly.

Dual processors and an excess of RAM let you keep more tasks running without slowdown.

The screen will redraw faster with a Video card having more RAM.
Dwight Atkinson
Anonymous
Not applicable
Jeffrey:

Thank you for your lengthy and detailed reply. I'm not sure that I would really do all that you suggest to improve the performance of AC11 though. When it comes to computers, I tend to do just the bare minimum to get by.

Tom:

I updated AC11 and tried it again today, based on your post. You say that you have many stock G5s running AC11 with no problems. To restate, AC11 runs without major glitches (so far) but to me is irritatingly slow on the 2d redraw.

If I think of it, I guess it is acceptable, but really any amount of delay is a big pain. I guess it's worth the trade off, but it seems to me things should get faster not slower.

Do you not experience any slowing at all? And have you done any adjustments to compensate?

Thank you,

Don Lee
2-1.8 G5
OSX 10.4.10
AC11 latest
Dwight
Newcomer
I run a 2x2.0 G5 with 3.5 Gb RAM and a 256 Mb video card.

Archicad 11 2D redraw is slow relative to 10.

Really poor.
Dwight Atkinson