Open Type Fonts Shift

[Anonymous]

Our open type fonts are shifting up in the text box.

We use .otf or Open Type Fonts from Adobe such as Graphite Standard. We work in ArchiCad 9 & 10. In both applications, when we upgraded from OSX 10.4 to 10.5 the fonts shift in their text blocks (in files made in OSX 10.4 and then opened in 10.5) and do not relate to the leader lines etc. It only happens with .otf fonts and all other fonts are stable. The problem is more pronounced if the "Leading" is set to less than 100% in the text selection settings.

Is anyone else experiencing this problem and does it occur in AC versions 11 or 12?

[Eduardo Rolon]

Thanks Karl.

[Karl Ottenstein]

You're welcome! If you or anyone else run into any other OTF symptoms, please post screenshots and reproduction steps here.

Thanks,
Karl

[Anonymous]

Eduardo,
All my otf fonts are made by Adobe. They all shift.

Do you find that non-Adobe otf fonts (like Proxima Nova, I think) shift or is there no pattern by manufacturer?

Thanks,
Robin

[Eduardo Rolon]

Robin,

Avenir Next shifts and it is a Linotype font.
Proxima Nova doesn't but it might be the exception.

I don't think that we can assume a specific pattern by manufacturer.

[Anonymous]

I upgraded a PPC machine from OSX 10.4.11 to 10.5.6 and opened a file created by a 10.4 PPC machine and the otf shifted. I then created a new file in AC 9.0 on this machine and the fonts shifted.

Therefore, I believe this is a problem associated with OSX 10.5, (most) Open Type Fonts and AC versions 9.0, 10, 11 and 12. (I didn't test any AC versions before 9.0).

This is my delemma: I have many library parts made with .otfs. I am willing to shift the fonts and remake them, however, I'd like to know what Graphisoft plans to do if anything regarding this issue. If I remake them, I don't want to find out that Graphisoft "fixed" the issue and then all my remade library parts are shifted down.

Thanks for your help Karl and Eduardo!

[Karl Ottenstein]

I've heard back from GS on this issue, and it appears to be a bug in OS 10.4 (Tiger) that Apple does not intend to correct. It is not an Intel vs PPC issue.

OS X, just like Windows, has functions that retrieve a font's "metrics" - the sizes, etc that describe the font. Barbara at GS support provides this one example of where OS 10.4 returns different (incorrect) font metric information compared to OS 10.5:

10.4: HelveticaNeueLT Std Bold  size=48 capisize=34 ascent=42 descent=12 leading=0

10.5: HelveticaNeueLT Std Bold  size=48 capisize=34 ascent=34 descent=14 leading=10

(I am speculating (!) that the bug is in the Carbon libraries and not in the Cocoa libraries, and so you may see some applications get the correct results and others not, which may just add to the confusion.)

Unfortunately, as an Apple bug, GS's only suggestion for a workaround is to either not use the fonts causing the problem, or to drag the text to the proper position.

Sorry,
Karl

PS Looking back at Eduardo's screenshots, particularly where the text is shown within a frame, I note that he says he is on OS 10.5. I was going to say that upgrading to 10.5 was a solution, but apparently not.

[Eduardo Rolon]

Yes Karl I am using 10.5 and it shifts even in a "New and Reset" file.
Wished I knew about this before buying the fonts

Anyway this does not answer why it happens with some of the library parts and not others, Grids yes, Door and Window labels no. Unless it is a carbon vs cocoa issue.

[Anonymous]

Karl,

Thanks for your help on this. I'm still a bit perplexed as to whether or not to upgrade all my library parts by shifting the font. It seems like the bug is still in 10.5 even if it is a Carbon vs. Coca issue. If we only knew if Apple planned to correct the bug in 10.6 it would help.

Robin

[Jere]

I use the Helvetica Neue fonts (OTF) and have the exact same problem.

You'll notice that I'm on Windows XP, so I'm not convinced it's an OS problem.

[Anonymous]

Karl,

I am wondering if you reported the last post regarding the same problem on the Windows OS to Graphisoft and if they had any comments?

Robin