"Sync" materials between two hotlinked projects?

[Anonymous]

So I have a bit of a problem... I have an AC12 project which has one file hotlinked into a master teamwork file. Both files have gradually gone their different ways, and materials have been added/deleted from each. As you might expect (which none of us did, at the time), this has wreaked havoc on material index numbers.

How do I go about getting the files in sync, so that they share the same materials? Right now if I create a curtain wall with a new material in File A, it shows up in file B with some other material.

[Anonymous]

First off, you may get more answers if this was placed in another thread but I will let the moderates determine that.

Our project team had encountered that issue since we had like 7 different module files clashing into one master file. You may want to do what we ended up doing and that was creating some kind of data log for the project using MS Excel and we documented a new attribute (material, composite, profile) next to the first available index number. For instance, if in your project the first available index number for a wall composite is number 51, you put down 51 - Exterior brick wall. And if you want another, that becomes 52, then 53, and so on.

Options>Element Attributes>Attribute Manager is where you will need to sort out all the index numbers out of order. It may help by starting out with a blank file and in Attribute Manager, open up the other module files and append each attribute in the order you determine. With the order set and matching in both Attribute Manager and project data log, you can use that to overwrite the attributes of the actual project files.

I hope this gives you enough direction to start out with. They key is for all affiliated files with the project to have the same index number and match the project data log. If you were hoping for some kind of automated tool, command, or add-on that would sort these index number automatically among the project files, then let me get in line with you because I do not have the answer to that one.

[Karl Ottenstein]

guitarchitect wrote:
So I have a bit of a problem... I have an AC12 project which has one file hotlinked into a master teamwork file. Both files have gradually gone their different ways, and materials have been added/deleted from each. As you might expect (which none of us did, at the time), this has wreaked havoc on material index numbers.

How do I go about getting the files in sync, so that they share the same materials? Right now if I create a curtain wall with a new material in File A, it shows up in file B with some other material.

(I'm moving this to Working in ArchiCAD, which is the proper forum for this question.)

Unfortunately, keeping things in synch is easier than fixing things when they have gone far astray as in your case. Depending on how many materials, layers, etc you have created in each file, you could be looking at tens of minutes to a full day or more.

Make a backup.

Pick one file to become the superset of all attributes - whichever file has the most additions is what I would recommend. Open Attribute Manager in that file and open the other file, then APPEND all of the new attributes from the other file - yes, they will all get new index numbers. Save.

If you modified any existing attributes, then you have a bit of a mess to deal with. For example, if 'brick' was modified in one file, then it is impossible to have it show up properly in the merged or hotlinked file without creating a new material. You'll have to append each of these modified attributes and give them new names.

Now, open the other file, go to Attribute Manager and OVERWRITE all attributes. The attributes are now in synch - and you'll need to keep them that way from now one - but the model elements in this file will all appear incorrect because the attributes that they used have new index numbers. You'll have to go through every element and change materials or whatever to refer to the original material names ... which now have different index numbers.

This issue of attribute management with hotlinked files is so fundamental, that Graphisoft really needs a bit warning box and step-by-step instructions in the user guide. But, then they need that for a hundred other aspects of using ArchiCAD.

Good luck - hope it is not too painful.

Karl

[Anonymous]

yeah, I wasn't really sure to put this one... the bracket for this forum had "materials" in it so here I am

the worst part about it is that there's a wiki answer from 2006 that says graphisoft was working to establish materials by name than index number... it's almost 2010 and common sense still has yet to prevail?

just one question - since this is a teamwork file is the over-write doable? will it be an exclusive access thing?

[Karl Ottenstein]

guitarchitect wrote:
just one question - since this is a teamwork file is the over-write doable? will it be an exclusive access thing?

Yes, through ArchiCAD 12, you must be Team Leader with exclusive access. Or you could go back to a solo project and then share it again.

In TW2 in AC 13 and above, you just need to have the ability to reserve the attributes for add/delete/modify.

Karl

[Anonymous]

Karl wrote:

guitarchitect wrote:
just one question - since this is a teamwork file is the over-write doable? will it be an exclusive access thing?

Yes, through ArchiCAD 12, you must be Team Leader with exclusive access. Or you could go back to a solo project and then share it again.

In TW2 in AC 13 and above, you just need to have the ability to reserve the attributes for add/delete/modify.

Karl

While I've got your ear - we're doing a major science building in AC12, and I have a teamwork file with about 5 hotlinked files. Would it be worth switching to AC13 with TW2? Some people are finding the whole system painfully slow (5 users in the TW file seem to slow it way down), and I'm inclined to agree!

[Anonymous]

guitarchitect wrote:
Would it be worth switching to AC13 with TW2?

VERRRRY worth it. If the project phase is still early, it will save you bundles of time and...$ I know GS has come up with a detailed step-by-step migration process from teamwork file in AC12 to AC13 but I seem to have lost track of it. I'm sure another user will know what I am speaking of and post a link or something.

If you haven't seen the new TW2 features on GS website, take a look:

http://www.graphisoft.com/products/archicad/tw.html

[Anonymous]

well, it would be early on a normal project, but we're sort of fast-tracked... have to hit 100% DD by the end of november. given that we would need some time for infrastructural changes I'm thinking that maybe after that issuance, we clean up the file and port it over into AC13

ksymons19 wrote:

guitarchitect wrote:
Would it be worth switching to AC13 with TW2?

VERRRRY worth it. If the project phase is still early, it will save you bundles of time and...$ I know GS has come up with a detailed step-by-step migration process from teamwork file in AC12 to AC13 but I seem to have lost track of it. I'm sure another user will know what I am speaking of and post a link or something.

If you haven't seen the new TW2 features on GS website, take a look:

http://www.graphisoft.com/products/archicad/tw.html

[Karl Ottenstein]

guitarchitect wrote:
While I've got your ear - we're doing a major science building in AC12, and I have a teamwork file with about 5 hotlinked files. Would it be worth switching to AC13 with TW2? Some people are finding the whole system painfully slow (5 users in the TW file seem to slow it way down), and I'm inclined to agree!

If the hotlinked files are an essential part of the project workflow, then I would say switching to TW2 on a fast-track project might be iffy.

TW2 itself is a huge improvement and will eliminate the complaints of slowness. But, it does not handle hotlinked files or external drawings/content very intelligently at all as none of those file are stored on the BIM Server, only the project and the libraries.

If all staff is working in the office on the LAN and not at home or remotely, then go for it. Otherwise, the only way to smoothly access the hotlinked files will be if you set up a VPN so that remote users have direct access to your main file server and hotlink/drawing paths will be identical for all workers in all locations. (Without a VPN, a remote user would have to be sent, or pick up, the hotlinked and other external files and would have to re-link on their machine. As soon as they send their changes, they mess up everybody else who will then have to re-link.)

If you keep all work in-house, then go for it.

Karl

[Anonymous]

Karl wrote:
If the hotlinked files are an essential part of the project workflow, then I would say switching to TW2 on a fast-track project might be iffy.

TW2 itself is a huge improvement and will eliminate the complaints of slowness. But, it does not handle hotlinked files or external drawings/content very intelligently at all as none of those file are stored on the BIM Server, only the project and the libraries.

Well, you've just touched on a key part of our project (and source of my headaches). All of our consultants work in AutoCAD, and we are joint-venturing with a firm out of Boston... our drawing set is kind of a hybrid beast, as we're the "core and shell" architects and they are doing all of the interior stuff. Given that our drawing methodology (and graphic standards) differ greatly, I often end up layering our drawings together using layouts, assigning two different pen sets to each view.

It's bad enough that 2 users are on a mac, and 3 users are on PC... the way each platform connects to the network, it often leads to the teamwork file losing track of all the DWGs. It's unfortunate, because the xrefs aren't really live.

How does one go about setting up "placed" dwgs? Placing external drawings has been the only way to keep our file structure/linetypes/layer system from spiraling out of control.

If the teamwork is as speedy as a standalone file, I would have no qualms in eliminating all of the Hotlinks to get it into one master file... but externally placed DWGs will have to stay