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Apple Lion OSX - New interface guidlines.

archislave
Enthusiast
After five years of complaining about the old style 1980's Archicad Mac interface it seems Graphisoft will finally be required to update the interface to Modern OSX standards. They will have to offer a full screen mode with locking toolbars etc. This is my guess. I hope they will do some innovative stuff.

They should look at the new Autocad Mac GUI. Can't believe I said that ...
Archislave

archicad 16.0 US, iMac El Capitan
15 REPLIES 15
Achille Pavlidis
Enthusiast
Karl wrote:
archislave wrote:
This new Lion is going to be a huge advance of OSX to a more modern way inheriting many cool and clean iOS attributes.
And finally (!) inheriting the Microsoft Windows functionality of being able to stretch the size of a window by any of the corners, not just the lower right. Such a "duh" thing, you wonder if MS had a patent on it or something that Apple was so stubborn to cripple such a simple thing for so many years...
and may I add, that there are some windows, that can't be resized at all!!!

see here: http://archicad-talk.graphisoft.com/viewtopic.php?t=32398
Mac OSX 13.6.6 | AC 27 INT 5003 FULL
Anonymous
Not applicable
Achille wrote:
and may I add, that there are some windows, that can't be resized at all!!!
No shortage of those in Windows either. Revit has loads of fixed size, modal dialogs (this may be improved with 2011 - I don't recall).
Anonymous
Not applicable
Matthew wrote:
Achille wrote:
and may I add, that there are some windows, that can't be resized at all!!!
No shortage of those in Windows either. Revit has loads of fixed size, modal dialogs (this may be improved with 2011 - I don't recall).
It didn't been improved in Revit 2011.
Anonymous
Not applicable
Ralph wrote:
The ribbon concept is an abomination - one that I hope we never see in ArchiCAD. It's like Kid Pix without the fun. I can barely tolerate products like MS Office that have embraced it - the loss in productivity is frightening.
you echo the thousands of AutoCAD and Revit users from 3-4 years ago.
when the ribbon was first introduced as part of the Mac Office interface and then Windows Office (and then Vista/7 certified apps), not many people seemed to like it at first, but soon enough they got used to it. now it's impossible to find any user who would go back to the basic 80s style interface. it follows that most of the design aspects of OSX 10.7 will find their way into Windows8 in some fashion, and will invariably be an integral design element of any multi-platform software.

new users actually find it far easier to pick up than the old-school toolbars, there is no problem there at all. however, initially it is a productivity problem for existing users -- as with any new version of software it takes some time to adjust. the end result is net productivity gain, which has been repeatedly confirmed by multiple independent trials of the Microsoft Suite and Windows. the same was true for users switching from 2D to 3D design, CAD to BIM software. this is no minor tweak -- the visual aspect belies the complexity of the work, but the productivity benefits are equally far more than they appear at first glance.

a key drawback is you have to relearn where the icons are -- one problem is that Archicad's icons are so divorced from the graphic/CAD/BIM design industry standard that they would need a major overhaul of them, and redesigning them for the multiple sizes required by the ribbon is the ideal opportunity to do that.
the ribbon also typically has keyboard shortcuts assignable to all icons, something that is missing in Archicad (although you can assign many command to shortcuts this is not quite the same streamlined approach);
then there is the tear-off toolbars. even in Autodesk's 2012 suites it still lacks some cohesion -- you can save your workspace, but clicking in the wrong place will put all of your palettes back into the main ribbon again, which is not ideal -- similarly with Adobe CS5 (widely regarded as having some of the finest UI workflow of almost any software) your palettes jump back occasionally, but it's not much trouble to pull them out again;
one alternative is the ribbon's top quick-launch bar, where you can save dozens of your most used icons in the old-school small size -- this is a less than perfect arrangement, but most people when first switching to the ribbon-style interface, begin by hiding the ribbon and just using the quick-launch bar; that works some of the time, but given the dynamic design of the ribbon, some commands are contextual and only appear in certain ribbons at certain times, not allowing them to be added to the QLB;

some people criticized the dockable, fullscreen modes, however, they are entirely optional and the palettes and windows can be docked, locked or autohide at your command, so you don't need to use those if you don't wish to.

Graphisoft can continue to keep its' head in the sand, but usability is a key aspect for any new user -- and to convince new users and new corporate customers to migrate to Archicad rather than the competition will require a change of mindset -- these workflow gains are not only for existing users, but for architectural business competitiveness and long-term relevance of Archicad.
vfrontiers
Enthusiast
@ Matt (from way down below)

I just spent a couple of days presenting to a firm on a MAC and an hands down the most frustrating thing was EVERY TIME I opened up a detail or worksheet it landed BEHIND my INFO PALETTE and TOOLBOX at the top of the screen. EVERY TIME I had to pull the palettes out of the way, drag the window (by the top rail) and move the palettes back.

This is where the mac falls behind..

To be fair, the Mac is so far ahead in so many other ways, I'll never give it up. But I do work in both worlds and find it funny that Macs overlook some simple things.

But, GS did fix the TOOLS Palette! It does now stay where I left it the last time...
Duane

Visual Frontiers

AC25 :|: AC26 :|: AC27
:|: Enscape3.4:|:TwinMotion

DellXPS 4.7ghz i7:|: 8gb GPU 1070ti / Alienware M18 Laptop
Rob
Graphisoft
Graphisoft
a key drawback is you have to relearn where the icons are -- one problem is that Archicad's icons are so divorced from the graphic/CAD/BIM design industry standard that they would need a major overhaul of them, and redesigning them for the multiple sizes required by the ribbon is the ideal opportunity to do that
Although there is a lot to improve with AC UI I would say thanks God that AC icons are divorced from CAD/BIM design industry, actually what is the standard? Adesk products or Microstation? Allplan or Vectorworks? The fact is that the ribbon interface was crafted for completely different type of applications and purpose yet Adesk managed to hammer it in... it feels like square peg in a round hole. I should congratulate them for the effort however the result is still square peg in a round hole and it should be shown as a perfect example of mismatched purpose vs functionality.

I would welcome some tabbed docking solution for palettes (aka Photoshop) or Info Box that shows settings for all items you have clicked on (e.g.. Views, Layouts in Navigator etc) but certainly Windows UI should not be the leader here...

edited:
interestingly enough there is no trace of the ribbon UI in Autocad2012 for OSX... actually it looks like Photoshop... lesson learnt perhaps?
::rk