Switch from AutoCad 14 to Archicad

[Anonymous]

Our Atlanta office is in serious need of software upgrade from AutoCad 14. We have looked at several: AutoCad 2006, Revit, Archicad. We are impressed with Archicad so far. Have a few questions for experienced users:

1.) We have many project types in our office. Some are so small (ie, single family porch renovation) they don't need full 3d modelling capabilities.
a.) Can you draft in 2d in Archicad for a small job like this?
b.) That said, not every drawing in a set needs full 3d. For example, can you do a general model of the building, cut a section, and draw 2d detail over the section?
c.) Is that the wrong approach for Archicad? Would we have to think of detail drawings in a different way? Is it really meant to model every little detail in full?

2.) Full 3d modelling capability is a nice plus. But, what we are really after is software that is reasonably easy to learn, use, and can produce quality construction documents. How satisfied are users with Archicad's ability to produce quality cd's ranging from a single family renovation to a multi-story office building? Architectural Desktop promised a lot, but delivered practically nothing. We barely use its features at all, and we're drafting in 2d anyway.

3.) How long should we expect to be on the learnign curve? Could we draft in 2d if we get in a crunch?

[Anonymous]

You can use AC not only for very large, but also for small projects.
Yes you can draft 2d drawings in AC for construction docs.
I draw only with AC and use other programms only in very special situation.
If you are architect it's very good idea to start working with AC, espcialy after Acad14.

[Eduardo Rolon]

A) yes
B) yes but you should try to model as much as possible since it will reduce drafting mistakes
C) IME you don't need to model the whole project (up to 95-95% is enough) what is not modeled are usually specific/generic details. But these details can be imported from your existing DWG's into the Detail Section of the Project if you have them.
D) The problem with this statement is that in AC the concept is to Build your design (not draft it), let AC do the basic drafting and then you finish/polish your drawings.
E) Basic concepts take usually about 12-16 hrs to learn and with these you will be more productive than with AutoCAD, but to be proficient you will need more time to learn how to setup templates, establish teamwork procedures, libraries and customize AC to your work flow and modify your workflow accordingly. And yes you could draft in 2d during crunch time...

[Aussie John]

the small projects are ideal for getting the 3d techniques off the ground.

[Anonymous]

dj-sprout (featuring Dr Dre?)

I agree with all the comments above.
I switched to ArchiCAD a couple of years ago and there's no way I would go back to 2D AutoCAD. You will find that it's easier to draw (and think) in 3D while doing plans (easier to draw a wall with the wall tool than with lines, add a window, door, done) even if you don't necessarily need 3D output, although I find that once I get to the end of the general draughting I whip up a 3D sketch using the Sketch render engine a put it on the cover of the documents. Looks good, takes no time at all.
Using templates, modules (think blocks or x-refs) and favorites you can easily set up standards and shortcuts to commonly drawn items to streamline your workflow. Details can be started automatically from large scale sections or plans, with extra info added in 2D. I do feel that AutoCAD 2D tools are still better than ArchiCAD's, but as you learn new tricks and work-arounds (plenty of them) you can achieve almost anything.
In the words of that sportswear company....just do it!
Cheers

[Bruce]

As already mentioned by more experienced members than I: 2D drafting is more than possible with ArchiCAD. However...

I've just completed a small extension to a residence for a faithful client (only 4.8 x 6.6m, single story, timber framed). I modelled 99% and just added notes and a couple of drafting elements. Much easier than when I used to draft in AutoCAD.

Give yourself about 6 months to really start cooking with ArchiCAD (you won't be unproductive before this, but 6 months should be plenty of time to feel fluent with the new package).

Cheers

[Andy Thomson]

We model everything. Once you get the hang of it, 6months? Maybe more like 1 year, it 'can' be as fast as drafting, that is, once you have all your tools, templates and standards set up, which never ends, and takes a huge amount of work....

All of our jobs now, tiny and massive, are modelled right to the end.....to see work, go to: www.architectsalliance.com

A

[TomWaltz]

dj-sprout wrote:
2.) Full 3d modelling capability is a nice plus. But, what we are really after is software that is reasonably easy to learn, use, and can produce quality construction documents. How satisfied are users with Archicad's ability to produce quality cd's ranging from a single family renovation to a multi-story office building? Architectural Desktop promised a lot, but delivered practically nothing. We barely use its features at all, and we're drafting in 2d anyway.

Above all else, get the training. You will lose much more time digging through manuals and praying for divine intervention than you will spend on the training. There are a lot of things Archicad can do, but only a real training will help you make the most of it.

[Ignacio Azpiazu]

TomWaltz wrote:
Above all else, get the training.

If 'the Atlanta office' is larger than say two CAD-proficient and ArchiCAD-enthusiastic guys, *do get* the help of a CAD consultant to set up your templates and quickly learn the tip and tricks you need to go straight and without accidents from your customized blank template to your finished CD printouts, PDFs, and DWG exports. If the users simultaneouly do the basic training (surprisingly many just don't, ever), that should leave you ready for your first small ArchiCAD projects in say two months.

If 'the Atlanta office' is actually two CAD-proficient and ArchiCAD-enthusiastic guys, you can get by with
- Eric Batte's STS [Standardized (by his office and for his office only) Template System],
- Ludomir Kulisev's ArchiCAD Training Guide (last published for 8.1, but still by far the best training book around),
- a systematic scan of all the messages in ArchiCAD-talk in the last year,
- six months to study and play around with the program, and at least six months to set up your own basic system.

[Steve Jepson]

Not a popular opinion I know, but I think "training" over rated.

If you can't figure it out on your own with a little help from this forum you will probably never be any good with ArchiCAD anyway. Quit now. It is a very intuitive program. Very simple to use and with lots of learning resources.

You never remember what you were "taught" only what you "learned".

Forget the manuals. You can have mine for free. Still unopened! Click on Help if you need to know something. Have fun! Just play around with it. All of the buttons have pictures right? How hard can it be if Architects can learn to do it?

I saw this on the web....

Advanced ArchiCAD Techniques: Enhancing Productivity : $345
This course details advanced techniques in ArchiCAD that can dramatically shorten the time required to produce a documentation-ready ArchiCAD model. Topics covered include; creating custom line types, fill types, and composite structures; using Find and Select and saved searches; using Favorites and standards; API commands like Automatic Dimensioning, Modify Wall, and Spell Checker; and a section on DWG export and import settings and methodologies. This course is appropriate for users who understand simple operations like Multiply and Rotate, and intermediate operations like Intersect and Edit Polygon. (Full day)

Please! for $375.00 this course must come with a hell-of-a good box lunch.

Spell checker? Favorites?, custom lines? find and select? modify wall? automatic dimensioning?

What's in the beginners course Thomas?

I loved the prerequisite for this "Advanced" course.

Apparently, the course is for users who understand how to multiply and rotate!?! and have mastered the "Intermediate" chalenges of intersect and edit polygon.

Now thats got to make you laugh!

I am only 1/2 serious about my perspective on training. And I know Archvista is a great place to learn. I just couldn't help but poke a little fun at that course description.

Actually, I could use a little training my self with TeamWork and Calculations. Well, that and my manners.