Structural steel sections & profile manager

[Anonymous]

Assuming that I'd get a chance to test ArchiCAD in a project... (Been only looking at the demo for a few hours and it looks quite appealing, I must say.)

How does one - in real world - (i) create and (ii) manage even a modest selection of steel sections? Is there something in the profile manager I don't get?

I mean: if I have the standard hot rolled sections from channels to IPE & HE A/B/C, stock sizes of RHS, SHS and RHS etc., is there an efficient way to store & select sizes? Can the profile be a parametric object?

[Anonymous]

~/archiben wrote:
at what angle does a column become a beam i wonder?

I don't know. In reality, a beam cannot be used as a column.

Not because of IFC, but because of the user interface.

Well, the latter may change in my perception when I get used to the robe of Hare ArchiCAD and prostrate myself at the feet of The Guru. (Not likely.)

OK. In ArchiCAD you simply cannot have raked columns that would be translated as IFC-columns. Moving to the next Crucial, Essential and Paramount Issue in our next exciting episode in the chilling serial What ArchiCAD Cannot Do.

[Anonymous]

Fantastic feedback from "Member GSHQfadmin from "ArchiCAD-Talk" called Peter

Petri,

Don't do this!

OK. I won't. I promise: I'll never again be interested in ArchiCAD and I'll do my best to spread the good word.

[Anonymous]

This guy obviously has nothing better to do with his time than to moan and post reply after reply about how he can't get his columns to work.

His software is obviously so much better than ArchiCAD, let's leave him to it.

[TomWaltz]

It's just the latest person to confuse "I can't" with "Archicad can't", who feels neglected enough in life to rant about it publicly.

[Anonymous]

TomWaltz wrote:
It's just the latest person to confuse "I can't" with "Archicad can't", who feels neglected enough in life to rant about it publicly.

Ha Ha, Well said!!

[Djordje]

Easy, guys ...

While exclusively in Archicad, it is more often than not the case of what one can't do, instead of what Archicad can't do.

However, when it comes to IFC ... the control is MUCH more in the hands of the software, and therefore - although the method and the style of the address leaves a lot to be desired, the gist of the things is correct.

Petri, how are you checking the IFC output? Through a viewer, or opening in another application? A viewer is better, IMHO, as another application may not be understanding the IFC output correctly and therefore the elements are wrong. See my bad experience with ETABS.

[__archiben]

Petri wrote:
In reality, a beam cannot be used as a column.

...

OK. In ArchiCAD you simply cannot have raked columns that would be translated as IFC-columns. Moving to the next Crucial, Essential and Paramount Issue in our next exciting episode in the chilling serial What ArchiCAD Cannot Do.

ok. i see what you're saying. that is kind of true, but only takes a minute to fix:

• open up the 'Universal Column Beam' object
• 'Save As..' 'Universal Column Raked' (for example) into your own library.
• change it's subtype category from 'Beam' back to 'Column'
• re-save.

it means you're keeping track of more objects though. i do agree that the steel objects need to be a little more refined and accessible. less objects that do more: something i've been working on in my spare time for a while now . . . watch this space!

~/archiben

[Rob]

just for a reference I have created a lib part called BeamMaker some time ago (last update was for v10) with almost all possible hot-rolled and cold-formed profiles with ability to save your own instance per section. Editable in 3D (like tapering both ends, rotating etc..)
however, all predefined sections are to Australian standard but you can create and save your own.

http://www.graphisoft.com.au/services/archicadobjects/
look for one steel object

Anyway, despite all of that I do not like to use lib parts as structural elements because of their significant limitations in terms of plan and storey visibility... we are using the profile manager for steel stuff.

[__archiben]

Rob wrote:
Anyway, despite all of that I do not like to use lib parts as structural elements because of their significant limitations in terms of plan and storey visibility... we are using the profile manager for steel stuff.

seriously?! so you must have a bazillion different steel profiles for all the shapes and materials you need?

i still maintain that "complex profiles" are too dumb for such complex elements. a level of flexibility and intelligence is needed that CPs cannot provide, not to mention round-trip collaboration with structural solutions should you require it.

sure, they're slightly more fiddly to begin with, but far more rewarding . . .

~/archiben

[Rob]

seriously?! so you must have a bazillion different steel profiles for all the shapes and materials you need?

oh, yes, we've got around 500 profiles in the profile manager (defined on the money with all proper radii etc and with designation numbers).
I have presented this problem (dealing with the huge number of items and not having some folder-like organisation means) in Budapest. They are pretty aware of it.
There are some limitations in terms of tapering and special shaping - that is solved with rather one-off lib parts or sometimes by SEO operations (I am very reluctant in this case as SEO are still very crappy)

the advantage is communication between us and a structural engineer - we can simply pick-up a profile by its designation number as referred getting precise dimensions in a seconds. secondly, lib parts do not work for a bill of quantities...

anyway, I can see your point using lib parts and I have considered pros/cons (trying to address that with BeamMaker) but it just does not work in a long run. In other words, resolving all joints and mitering manually as oppose to a bit less detailed virtual building showing on GA plans and solving odds and sods in 2D detail. I know, it's not the holy grail of VB or BIM but it is a commercial reality at least for me.